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E-Verify bill stirs broader immigration debate
The Washington Times ^ | September 22, 2011 | Stephen Dinan

Posted on 09/22/2011 8:32:28 AM PDT by oldbill

House Republicans on Wednesday jump-started the immigration debate, pushing through the Judiciary Committee a key immigration-enforcement measure to require businesses to check new employees’ work status against a government database —

(The) bill would invalidate those (however, those state and local) laws, which prompted Democrats to accuse Republicans of overriding states’ rights.

“Until we step up and do the job, I don’t think we should be pre-empting anybody trying to deal with this issue,”

(Excerpt) Read more at washingtontimes.com ...


TOPICS: Breaking News; Business/Economy; Government; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: aliens; amnesty; amnestyrino; dreamacttreason; everify; immigration; obamaperry; perry; perry2012; republicans; rinoperry
Just when you think the Republican resurgence may rescue the country from Obamaism, the Republican establishment tries another push to get cheap labor from illegal aliens by this deceitful bill that masquerades as a control on illegal immigration and illegal alien hiring and instead kills the only tools of enforcement that are actually working, state and local laws like in Arizona, Georgia, Hazleton, etc..

The Republican establishment in Congress still doesn't understand that the Tea Party movement is also against them and their cronies like the Chamber of Commerce and the Wall Street Journal who care not a whit for the real people of America.

The ghosts of George Bush, Karl Rove, and John McCain rise again.

1 posted on 09/22/2011 8:32:38 AM PDT by oldbill
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To: oldbill

Consider this news story today as another reason why Lamar Smith (R-TX) is sponsoring this Chamber of Commerce written bill. And for you Perry fans who brag about his ability to create jobs in Texas and defend his pro-amnesty leanings on illegal aliens, consider this news:

Study: Most Texas Jobs Went to Immigrants

http://campaign2012.washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/study-most-new-texas-jobs-went-immigrants


2 posted on 09/22/2011 8:47:15 AM PDT by oldbill
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To: oldbill

.....if you don’t think this country is constantly under attack from within.....a debate?


3 posted on 09/22/2011 8:47:41 AM PDT by Doogle ((USAF.68-73..8th TFW Ubon Thailand..never store a threat you should have eliminated))
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To: oldbill

This is the same e-Verify that reports Obama’s SSN as likely fraudulent - which (to my knowledge) not a single major news outlet has even looked into?


4 posted on 09/22/2011 8:47:51 AM PDT by Personal Responsibility (Government rushes to help the irresponsible and does little for the responsible)
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To: oldbill
I don't want the Federal government having control over whether or not I work.

There are better ways to get rid of illegal aliens. With a simple bounty system, with substantial penalties for false arrest and detainment, the people would clear this country of illegal aliens in a heartbeat.

5 posted on 09/22/2011 9:02:26 AM PDT by Carry_Okie (GunWalker: Arming "a civilian national security force that's just as powerful, just as well funded")
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To: Carry_Okie

I like it!


6 posted on 09/22/2011 9:05:54 AM PDT by WellyP (REAL)
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To: WellyP
I like it!

It is even Constitutional as a "letter of marque." Arrest them, seize their assets. and deport them.

Done.

In a recession like this, think of it as the ultimate "jobs bill."

7 posted on 09/22/2011 9:10:04 AM PDT by Carry_Okie (GunWalker: Arming "a civilian national security force that's just as powerful, just as well funded")
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To: Carry_Okie

“There are better ways to get rid of illegal aliens. With a simple bounty system, with substantial penalties for false arrest and detainment, the people would clear this country of illegal aliens in a heartbeat.”

yeah I don’t understand this new love for bureaucratic top down government solutions.


8 posted on 09/22/2011 9:11:26 AM PDT by ari-freedom (Thank you, Bob!)
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To: oldbill
Exactly.

This bill is completely fraudulent.

If there's anything good to come out of this debate it's getting open borders dogmatists like Berman and Lofgren to admit that states have a right to enforce immigration laws.

9 posted on 09/22/2011 9:51:41 AM PDT by OddLane (If Lionel Hutz and Guy Smiley had a lovechild together, his name would be "Mitt Romney." -KAJ)
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To: Carry_Okie
I don't want the Federal government having control over whether or not I work.

They already do thru the complete joke we call the I-9.

While this bill is a complete POS, I like the idea of E-Verify for both work and welfare. No E-Verify, no workee. No E-Verify, no welfare or other public assistance. This would have a huge impact and cause a lot of illegals to self-deport. My fear is the gov't would screw it up and ruin a lot of legal citizens.

I think regardless the mechanism, we need to turn off the magnet and turn up enforcement. Make it inhospitable for illegals to remain here.

I am not optimistic.

10 posted on 09/22/2011 10:11:09 AM PDT by umgud
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To: ari-freedom
yeah I don’t understand this new love for bureaucratic top down government solutions.

This is what we mean when we say that the Republicans do not understand the Tea Party and 10th Amendment people! Since we have Republicans in charge, all the good people will want their (the Republican version) Federalism instilled!

NO! We do not want you idiots running anything other than the bare bones basic requirements of the Constitution! At best that states the following: "To establish a uniform Rule of Naturalization..."! That does not say ENFORCE those laws, it states ESTABLISH! It is all about giving federal government more power and tighter control!

This is all designed so, no matter who is elected, they are safe and buffered from the rules and simply need to re-arrange deck chairs on the Titanic to make the majority of Americans believe they are "doing something." That is why the moniker "Do Nothing Congress" is considered a bad thing by liberals, but CELEBRATED by conservatives!!
11 posted on 09/22/2011 10:21:03 AM PDT by ExTxMarine (PRAYER: It's the only HOPE for real CHANGE in America!)
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To: oldbill
To quote Buchanan:

"U.S. companies see immigrants, legal or illegal, as an endless source of cheap labor to keep wage costs down. And they are right."
12 posted on 09/22/2011 10:57:14 AM PDT by algernonpj (He who pays the piper . . .)
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To: umgud

“No E-Verify, no welfare or other public assistance.”

I have no problem with that.


13 posted on 09/22/2011 10:58:22 AM PDT by ari-freedom (Thank you, Bob!)
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To: oldbill; All
Study: Most Texas Jobs Went to Immigrants

Immigrants vs Native-Born in the study.

And for you Perry fans who ... defend his pro-amnesty leanings on illegal aliens…

He's opposed amnesty, when Bush was president and Obama too. No to the Federal DREAM Act, and no citizenship element in a guest worker program.

14 posted on 09/22/2011 11:01:04 AM PDT by newzjunkey (Ryan: Obama "a pyromaniac in a field of straw men" / Andre Carson's racism goes unchecked)
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To: OddLane
Sounds like a horrible bill but the "check list" types will see "mandatory e-verify" and champion it.

The real flaw is in undermining state attempts to go further.

15 posted on 09/22/2011 11:13:48 AM PDT by newzjunkey (Ryan: Obama "a pyromaniac in a field of straw men" / Andre Carson's racism goes unchecked)
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To: newzjunkey
The worst part, from my perspective, is that Numbers USA is championing it.

I don't know if you were watching their live-stream of the debate in the House committee, but it was very illuminating.

16 posted on 09/22/2011 11:46:34 AM PDT by OddLane (If Lionel Hutz and Guy Smiley had a lovechild together, his name would be "Mitt Romney." -KAJ)
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To: newzjunkey

“Immigrants vs Native-Born in the study. “

So much for those who claim to be only against ILlegal immigration.


17 posted on 09/22/2011 11:58:02 AM PDT by ari-freedom (Thank you, Bob!)
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To: ari-freedom

I called NumbersUSA and chewed their ass out! Please unsubscribe from this group. They sat back and backed a bill supported by the Chamber of Commerce. UNREAL!
TOTAL IDIOTS!
They had no defense but the fact that state and local governments were not enacting bills to deal with jobs losses to Americans! NO DEEP THOUGHTS HERE PEOPLE!


18 posted on 09/22/2011 12:58:22 PM PDT by magna carta
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To: 1_Inch_Group; 2sheep; 2Trievers; 3AngelaD; 3pools; 3rdcanyon; 4Freedom; 4ourprogeny; 7.62 x 51mm; ..

Ping!


19 posted on 09/22/2011 1:27:55 PM PDT by HiJinx ("Good government is the concern of all men." ~ Louis L'Amour)
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To: magna carta
Democratic opponents said they feared businesses would use the tool to discriminate against all Hispanic workers, and pointed to instances where the system erroneously has said American citizens weren’t authorized to work.
Still, they said there is a place for electronic verification, but only after the current population of illegal immigrants has been granted legal status.
“The real dysfunction is trying to do E-Verify when there are 10-, 12-, 14 million people in this country who don’t have work authorization,” said Rep. Howard L. Berman, California Democrat, who led opposition to the bill. “You condemn E-Verify to failure when you try to do it in that context.”

IOW, "failure" means any immigration-related bill that doesn't include amnesty. This e-verify bill will not get 60 votes in the dem-controlled senate.

If we ever elect a responsible congress, I like the idea of some kind of electronic system to replace the I-9 paper forms, but we need a more effective system than the current e-verify. I might be wrong, but I don't see any plans to correct e-verify problems in this bill.

20 posted on 09/22/2011 2:12:42 PM PDT by ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas (Budget sins can be fixed. Amnesty is irreversible.)
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To: oldbill

And for you “conservatives” who are pushing for Romney to beat Perry, good luck surviving the death committees and shortages of Romney’s commiecare. He promised to leave it in place for you.


21 posted on 09/22/2011 2:18:19 PM PDT by SaraJohnson
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To: ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas

I don’t see a problem with E-Verify the error rate occurs when folks don’t get their names right with SS or somesuch. The issue is TAKING OVER STATES RIGHTS ON WORKPLACE ENFORCEMENT. Then doing nothing while the Chamber of Commerce cuts checks up in DC.
I hope you are right about the Senate.


22 posted on 09/22/2011 2:20:12 PM PDT by magna carta
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To: magna carta
I don’t see a problem with E-Verify the error rate occurs when folks don’t get their names right with SS or somesuch.

Another problem is that e-verify usually can't detect applicants who use a legal person's name and SS (with fake papers containing the correct data). They need to add a photo to the e-verify system, as well as other changes.

The issue is TAKING OVER STATES RIGHTS ON WORKPLACE ENFORCEMENT.

According to the article, Dems are the ones shouting "States' rights!" What are the specific states' rights issues here? I don't like the provision that exempts illegals for 3 years, but that doesn't sound like a states' rights issue to me.

I think states should be able to enforce federal immigration law, but Dems would say that states' rights include sanctuary states and cities. There is a bill in the Texas legislature that would give illegals a card that allows them to stay and work in Texas. I don't support that.

23 posted on 09/22/2011 2:52:47 PM PDT by ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas (Budget sins can be fixed. Amnesty is irreversible.)
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To: oldbill

Elect illegal aliens to Congress. They’ll do jobs like making hard decisions and fighting necessary fights that Americans simply won’t, and at a fraction of the cost.


24 posted on 09/22/2011 3:12:31 PM PDT by Eleutheria5 (End the occupation. Annex today.)
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To: umgud
I like the idea of E-Verify for both work and welfare. No E-Verify, no workee. No E-Verify, no welfare or other public assistance. This would have a huge impact and cause a lot of illegals to self-deport. I think regardless the mechanism, we need to turn off the magnet and turn up enforcement. Make it inhospitable for illegals to remain here.

Exactly!

25 posted on 09/22/2011 4:14:52 PM PDT by Netizen (Path to citizenship = Scamnesty. If you give it away, more will come. Who's pilfering your wallet?)
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To: umgud

I’m tired of most politicians and their finger pointing. They have been doing it for a ling time and so far it is working for them. The local ones point at the feds and feds point at the local level and all the while the finger pointing goes on, NOTHING gets done about it. Just as they planned.


26 posted on 09/22/2011 4:18:10 PM PDT by Netizen (Path to citizenship = Scamnesty. If you give it away, more will come. Who's pilfering your wallet?)
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To: ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas

Some of the candidates support guest workers. They haven’t gone into detail though on how they would make sure those guest workers returned to their country of origin.


27 posted on 09/22/2011 4:32:24 PM PDT by Netizen (Path to citizenship = Scamnesty. If you give it away, more will come. Who's pilfering your wallet?)
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To: Netizen
Some of the candidates support guest workers. They haven’t gone into detail though on how they would make sure those guest workers returned to their country of origin.

None of the "guest worker" candidates have convinced me they they have any interest whatsoever in the workers going back.

in fact, they have not gone into detail about any aspect of immigration, AFAIK.

28 posted on 09/22/2011 5:14:07 PM PDT by ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas (Budget sins can be fixed. Amnesty is irreversible.)
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To: ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas

Yep. most of them are deliberately vague on the issue.


29 posted on 09/22/2011 5:18:04 PM PDT by Netizen (Path to citizenship = Scamnesty. If you give it away, more will come. Who's pilfering your wallet?)
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To: umgud
They already do thru the complete joke we call the I-9. While this bill is a complete POS, I like the idea of E-Verify for both work and welfare. No E-Verify, no workee.

Of all the things I think are unconstitutional, I certainly think a law requiring someone to ask the fed gov to work is one of them.

We controlled immigration before we had an income tax where fed gov got access to every work document and income statement every man had. We can do it again.

Best way to stop illegals from getting fed gov welfare is to stop fed gov having welfare programs.

I'm tired of this vicious cycle where fed gov creates a problem and then they propose giving them more power as the solution. That's why we find ourselves in the morass we are in today.

State law enforcement is the answer to our immigration problems. That's why TPTB have so vociferously opposed it.

30 posted on 09/22/2011 7:43:56 PM PDT by triumphant values
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To: triumphant values

OK boys and girls here’s the real game plan.
Remember DC stands for “devil city”

The Judiciary Committee voting to pass out HB 2885 is a blatant effort to further seize 10th Amendment rights and stiffle all objection to the employers of illegal aliens.
WE LOST THIS BATTLE because our representatives took contributions from the National Chamber of Commerce and a whole host of other groups who wish to pass thire lawful obligations for hiring employees to the rest of society.
WE LOST THE BATTLE BUT THE WAR IS STILL ON!!!!
Everyone needs to write their congresman and let them know this is a litmus test of their worthiness to serve in office. Congress can fix this bill and anyone who votes for it in its current form should be kicked out.
To clarify further, this bill is intended to void e-Verify and here is the plan:
1 Pass HR 2885 in its current wording.
2. Then, defund e-Verify, leaving the preemption clause in effect.
3. Pop a cork and celebrate that no one will make them pay the full freight for hiring illegals.
Do not forgive and do not forget. These folks do not care about the Constitution or the State of Texas. They are only loyal to their net worth, do not believe in hell and only believe in the present.
Take their power and influence away this next year by removing them from office.
Last and not least, never forget the treachery of Numbers USA is selling out on this bill.


31 posted on 09/22/2011 7:54:53 PM PDT by magna carta
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To: triumphant values
State law enforcement is the answer to our immigration problems.

AZ SB 1070 is a good example. The feds aren't equipped to do interior enforcement even if they wanted to. It is state & local law enforcement who come in contact with illegals on a daily basis, not the feds.

32 posted on 09/22/2011 8:02:55 PM PDT by umgud
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To: Personal Responsibility
>> This is the same e-Verify that reports Obama’s SSN as likely fraudulent - which (to my knowledge) not a single major news outlet has even looked into?

Correct on both counts. Not only that, the SSN he is using was issued in CT in March 1977, and at that time, if you were over 12, you had to appear in person. He never lived there.

Obama is currently trying to dismantle E-verify with the way he regulates this tool.... He DOESN’T allow an employer to use E-verify until AFTER they have hired someone. The employer can be sued and heavily fined for violating that rule.

Obama’s team will ‘investigate’ any illegal, and if they find no record of violent crimes, plus if they have work history (and with the new job that is also true), they grant them a work permit.

Voila, the illegal gets his E-verify record corrected, and amnesty to stay here.

Obama also setup the ‘self check’ portion of E-verify so that any illegal can test out how good their “fake ID” is ahead of trying to use it.

33 posted on 09/22/2011 8:46:06 PM PDT by Future Useless Eater (Chicago politics = corrupted capitalism = takeover by COMMUNity-ISM)
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To: OddLane

Wow...

...one of the reasons the COC has decided to support this bill is because it preempts laws like the one in Arizona from being enacted in the future, as the outline of H.R. 2164 describes on Rep. Lamar Smith’s website. It also gives a wink and a nod to those agribusinesses employing illegal aliens right now, allowing those returning workers whose status hasn’t been verified to be exempt from the new law. These are just some of the reasons Kansas Secretary of State Kris Kobach has spoken out against it, most eloquently in a New York Post op-ed.


34 posted on 09/22/2011 8:49:01 PM PDT by Future Useless Eater (Chicago politics = corrupted capitalism = takeover by COMMUNity-ISM)
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To: Future Useless Eater

There are two kinds of Republicans - conservative and corporatist/RINO.

The latter has had control of the Party for decades and is one reason I registered Independent. The RINOs generally work in the interest of crony capitalists who expect business to always be subsidized, and they approve of politicians being bribed, and write legislation that benefits global corporations and neocons often at the expense of US citizens.

Illegal immigration has been unenforced and perpetuated since Reagan because of corporatist Rs and Democrats.


35 posted on 09/22/2011 9:19:51 PM PDT by apoliticalone (Honest govt. that operates in the interest of US sovereignty and the people, not global $$$)
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To: Future Useless Eater

Bump.


36 posted on 09/23/2011 4:50:56 AM PDT by OddLane (If Lionel Hutz and Guy Smiley had a lovechild together, his name would be "Mitt Romney." -KAJ)
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Comment #37 Removed by Moderator

Comment #38 Removed by Moderator

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