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Herman Cain in May: Don't Kill Anwar al-Awlaki (Get out the Popcorn)
The Atlantic ^ | October 3, 2011 | Chris Good

Posted on 10/03/2011 10:32:55 AM PDT by Captain Kirk

The killing on Friday of Anwar al-Awlaki, a U.S. citizen described as a powerful al-Qaeda terrorist, has stirred considerable debate about whether it's appropriate for a president to order an American assassinated.

Evidently, Republican presidential candidate Herman Cain shares those concerns.

The above video was recorded just after the first nationally televised GOP presidential debate of the 2012 campaign cycle, held in Greenville South Carolina on May 5 of this year, according to its YouTube page.

"He should be charged. And since he's an American citizen, he should be tried in our courts," Cain said of al-Awlaki. When asked if he considered it legal for President Obama to order al-Awlaki killed, Cain said, "In his case, no, because he's an American citizen."

It has been known since early 2010 that the CIA and the U.S. military's special-operations division maintain kill lists with three to four Americans on them. Al-Awlaki, a U.S.-born cleric, was on the list. He was reportedly killed in Yemen on Friday in a U.S. drone and jet strike. A classified Department of Justice memo authorized the killing, The Washington Post reported.

(Excerpt) Read more at theatlantic.com ...


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs
KEYWORDS: alawlaki; assassination; cain; paul
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To: jgge
You seriously think that the President of the USA should be allowed to order the extra-judicial murder of US Citizens?

Don't let your mindless adoration for Perry cause you to act with such reckless abandonment of all contact with rationality.

51 posted on 10/03/2011 11:03:49 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (Giving more money to DC to fix the Debt is like giving free drugs to addicts think it will cure them)
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To: justsaynomore

This is a tough one.
I tend to lean on the side of k.ll all the SOBs and sort them out later.
it is a slippery slope.
I don’t know the law on this one.


52 posted on 10/03/2011 11:03:52 AM PDT by Donnafrflorida (Thru HIM all things are possible.)
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To: justsaynomore

This is a tough one.
I tend to lean on the side of k.ll all the SOBs and sort them out later.
it is a slippery slope.
I don’t know the law on this one.


53 posted on 10/03/2011 11:03:52 AM PDT by Donnafrflorida (Thru HIM all things are possible.)
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To: Wilderness Conservative
You seriously think that the President of the USA should be allowed to order the extra-judicial murder of US Citizens?

Don't let your mindless adoration for Perry cause you to act with such reckless abandonment of all contact with rationality.

54 posted on 10/03/2011 11:04:52 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (Giving more money to DC to fix the Debt is like giving free drugs to addicts think it will cure them)
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To: Donnafrflorida
You seriously think that the President of the USA should be allowed to order the extra-judicial murder of US Citizens?
55 posted on 10/03/2011 11:05:29 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (Giving more money to DC to fix the Debt is like giving free drugs to addicts think it will cure them)
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To: eak3

I have read that by joining the group he did, he effectively renounced his American Citizenship. One needn’t say “I revoke my American Citizenship” to do so, the mere act of joining a foreign military/terror campaign against the US effectively terminates your citizenship and all rights thereof.


56 posted on 10/03/2011 11:05:42 AM PDT by Paradox (Democrats on Obama, They can't deny him, He is them.)
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To: CSI007
What we need are more Herman Cains and less “elected to office before” types.

I agree. Also the military needs to lighten up and let more weekend paintball players into the army, instead of all those boring "graduated from boot camp" types.

57 posted on 10/03/2011 11:06:13 AM PDT by sklar
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To: Donnafrflorida

FWIW - Herman Cain was 100% FOR the taking out of Bin Laden.

He is not soft on terror. But this guy was a US citizen, unfortunately. Conservatives will fall on both sides of this issue.


58 posted on 10/03/2011 11:06:42 AM PDT by justsaynomore (Cain 2012 - http://teamcain.hermancain.com)
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To: Paradox

I don’t know where you read that but it is a total myth. He did not renounce his US Citizenship simply by joining Al Qeda.


59 posted on 10/03/2011 11:06:42 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (Giving more money to DC to fix the Debt is like giving free drugs to addicts think it will cure them)
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To: eak3
Sorry to say Freepers but every American citizen, no matter how horrible they are, has the right to due process.

SCOTUS addressed this during WWII. They disagree with you.

60 posted on 10/03/2011 11:06:42 AM PDT by MileHi ( "It's coming down to patriots vs the politicians." - ovrtaxt)
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To: sanjuanbob

And the same holds when it’s the “Tea Party terrorists?”

Homophobic Christian enemy combatants of tolerance?


61 posted on 10/03/2011 11:07:10 AM PDT by FourPeas ("Maladjusted and wigging out is no way to go through life, son." -hg)
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To: jgge

You’re right-—he ain’t gonna make it, and he’s proved over and over that he IS in over his head. BUT he has his hardcore fans who will be with him to the bitter end and will have to throw their support somewhere else eventually.
All of it adds up to an eminently exploitable image of a “fractured” Republican Party that the MSM will love exploiting.


62 posted on 10/03/2011 11:07:36 AM PDT by supremedoctrine
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To: jgge
Man you Perrybots are desperate to manufacture something to save your not reayd for prime time canidate aren't you?

You seriously think that the President of the USA should be allowed to order the non-judicial sanctioned murder of US Citizens?

Don't let your mindless adoration for Perry cause you to act with such reckless abandonment of all contact with rationality.

63 posted on 10/03/2011 11:08:14 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (Giving more money to DC to fix the Debt is like giving free drugs to addicts think it will cure them)
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To: MNJohnnie

Yes, I think the President should have the right to snuff anyone like Awlaki. Cram your Perry assumption because my last 2 hopes are based on Palin or Christie getting in the race.


64 posted on 10/03/2011 11:08:28 AM PDT by Wilderness Conservative
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To: Captain Kirk

I’m in the Cain camp, I don’t agree with him on this issue, but after all, he is siding with the constitution so I think he can stand on this.


65 posted on 10/03/2011 11:09:45 AM PDT by Scythian
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To: jgge
Terrorist Awlaki was a traitor and therefore he was no longer a US citizen.

. Your complete ignorance of even the most basic principals of US law are pitiful. Simply no excuse for your level of irrational ignorance in a supposed adult mind.

66 posted on 10/03/2011 11:10:58 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (Giving more money to DC to fix the Debt is like giving free drugs to addicts think it will cure them)
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To: Captain Kirk

I’d like to see Cain do well. I disagree with this opinion.

There is no slippery slope. Citizen or not, he was an enemy combatant on a foreign field. I would have preferred that Awlaki was given his citizen due rights. I’m not upset that, since that was not an option, he was otherwise neutralized.

I would like to make a side comment because it seems that Cain’s hardest opponents here are Perry supporters. I think that the Perry people consider that Perry’s fall was a case of fratracide (I think he vetted himself negatively by calling Conservatives heartless and doubling-down on illegal alien subsidies). Since Cain has been the primary beneficiary of Perry’s fall, I see the Perry people as more than invested in some fratracide of their own in hopes that people will turn their attention back to Perry.

I’ve been accused of basically this very same thing here. I’m a Palin supporter that would be equally happy to see Cain move forward. I have serious problems with the idea of Perry as the nominee based on his record in Texas.

I see in-state tuition as just an operative example that stuck.

My problems with Perry is not a case of electioneering for Palin. I would - and do - have those same problems with Perry regardless if Palin gets in the race or not. I classify Perry in the same category as Romney as far as being a conservative, which is why I find it cute and not-on-any-sort-of-point for the Perry people to claim that he’s the only alternative to Romney. I believe in ABO, but Perry is no better than Romney.

If my only goal were to clear the path for Palin, I’d have the same problems with Cain. I do not. From years of listening to Cain on the radio, I know that he is a Conservative whereas I also know, as a Texan, that Perry has a history of being a Conservative six months before every election. I’d like to see Cain do well, even if that ultimately hurts Palin. If Cain can outdo Palin, so be it. I hope to compare them both in the Primary before this is over.

It’s not fair to say that Palin supporters had it out for Perry just to buck up Palin. I think the contrast between the Palin supporters here being fairly supportive of Cain points that out. We want the best Conservative elected possible. For many of us, the rules out Perry.

I don’t support Cain on this issue, or several things he’s done or said this weekend. I am willing to give him and his new communications director a chance to right that ship. That said, I’m more than willing to call Cain out on something that I consider to be wrong, while still offering qualified support that he might be the man. It strikes me as crazy that some of Perry’s supporters have now pretzeled (for the gas jets, or something like that) their positions into something even THEY wouldn’t have agreed with 2 months ago in order to support their man.


67 posted on 10/03/2011 11:11:10 AM PDT by ziravan (Are you better off now than you were 9.4 Trillion Dollars ago?)
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To: DTxAg

You really want to argue the President of the USA should have the power to order the non-judicial sanctioned murder of US Citizens?


68 posted on 10/03/2011 11:12:13 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (Giving more money to DC to fix the Debt is like giving free drugs to addicts think it will cure them)
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To: Jeff Chandler
Not once he becomes an enemy combatant.

Ding. Ding. Ding. IMHO, if done within an armed conflict authorized by Congress, the morality or legality of such action can be based on the same reasoning as the 'Just War' doctrine. This targeted bomb is a part of the shooting in contemporary warfare and if you are on the wrong side of the fight, regardless of your citizenship, you've forfeited any "special handling". You don't get a Miranda warning in a war.

69 posted on 10/03/2011 11:12:25 AM PDT by Servant of the Cross (the Truth will set you free)
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To: MNJohnnie

Not this one for sure. I don’t trust him as far as I can spit. I guess the question is if osama was a citizen what we would do then?
I am still Cain 2012!


70 posted on 10/03/2011 11:12:33 AM PDT by Donnafrflorida (Thru HIM all things are possible.)
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To: Jeff Chandler

“Not once he becomes an enemy combatant. “

some people are worried that the president could claim the tea party is terrorist and take us out.


71 posted on 10/03/2011 11:12:38 AM PDT by ari-freedom (I'm a heartless conservative because I love this country.)
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To: d-back
We ALL hate terrorist scum, but giving the US Govt the broad right to kill citizens abroad who they ACCUSE of terrorism is too much.

Agreed. I thought taking this guy out was a good idea until I learned that he was an American citizen. And with this administration labeling former military vets, pro-lifers and others on the Right as "terrorists", what's to stop them from sending a Predator drone to the National Right To Life or veterans groups to "take them out" for their "perceived" threat to America?

72 posted on 10/03/2011 11:13:02 AM PDT by Sister_T ("Calling ILLEGAL aliens "immigrants" is like calling shoplifters 'customers'!"-UCFRoadWarrior ><>)
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To: MNJohnnie

What has my strong support to Perry has anything to do with the subject we are discussing. Terrorist Anwar Al Awlaki was a traitor and hence he automatically abdicated his US citizenship, it is that simple. Also for those who are calling that he needed to be arrested and tried, did you ask yourself how many US troops would risk their lives for such a mission? Are you willing to lose brave US troops to capture this POS evil terrorist so we can try him in the US? I do not want to see a single US military personnel harmed in order to capture this evil SOB and I am very glad that he was blown out by a missile.


73 posted on 10/03/2011 11:13:11 AM PDT by jgge
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To: Captain Kirk

Herman, Herman, Herman - wrong answer.


74 posted on 10/03/2011 11:13:29 AM PDT by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: svcw
Cain is not the one being stupid here.

You really want to argue the President of the USA should have the power to order the non judicial sanctioned murder of US Citizens?

Stop, put your emotional angst on hold and actually THINK about what you are saying here.

75 posted on 10/03/2011 11:13:43 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (Giving more money to DC to fix the Debt is like giving free drugs to addicts think it will cure them)
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To: Jeff Chandler
Factually incorrect. A US Citizen is still a US Citizen even if he is an Enemy combatant.

You really want to argue the President of the USA should have the power to order the non judicial sanctioned murder of US Citizens?

76 posted on 10/03/2011 11:15:52 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (Giving more money to DC to fix the Debt is like giving free drugs to addicts think it will cure them)
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To: Captain Kirk
Nice try.

Who knows how being in the White House and knowing the things the general public does not know can change ones opinion on different matters related to our security. I would bet Obama this time back in 2007 would have also been adanantly against carrying out a kill like this - yet now approves it. Who is to say if Cain "knowing what a president knows" would have not done the same.

77 posted on 10/03/2011 11:16:03 AM PDT by NavyCanDo
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To: Captain Kirk

Nobody’s perfect.
Cain is still at the top my list for Primary.


78 posted on 10/03/2011 11:16:12 AM PDT by Little Ray (FOR the best Conservative in the Primary; AGAINST Obama in the General.)
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To: douginthearmy

Yes, but generally we try to negotiate with the hostage taker before shooting him, if it comes to that. If they can do this to one citizen they can do it to any citizen. At the very least they should have a trial in absentia on criminal charges, to revoke his citizenship, or something.

Cindie


79 posted on 10/03/2011 11:16:28 AM PDT by gardencatz (Proud mom US Marine! It can't always be someone else's son.)
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To: eak3
Sorry to say Freepers but every American citizen, no matter how horrible they are, has the right to due process.

It could pretty easily be argued that since this guy was in a foreign country fighting against the U.S., he had renounced his American citizenship.

80 posted on 10/03/2011 11:16:47 AM PDT by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: GraceG

The history books should read....Obama avoids “interrogation” of most valuable target


81 posted on 10/03/2011 11:16:51 AM PDT by Sacajaweau
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To: Captain Kirk

If you’re in a warzone leading ragheads against US military, you better keep your head down.

Sort of like “hiking” in Iran and expecting Uncle Sam to bail your ass out. Don’t count on it happening more than once.

Why is this question asked of the GOP candidates and not the sitting _resident in the White Hut?


82 posted on 10/03/2011 11:17:11 AM PDT by hattend (If I wanted you dead, you'd be dead. - Cameron Connor)
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To: jgge

“And how many US troops lives are you willing to risk to get this SOB terrorist alive? I am so happy that he died the way he died.”

Considering how many plots he was involved in and the plans we KNOW he made, he was responsible for a lot already. If we had him in our hands and got him to cough up everything he knew, it could have been saving a LOT. And what makes you so sure any troops would have died taking him? He probablly would have pulled his skirt over his head and surrendered at the drop of a rag. The chances are he could have led us to a lot of the evil bastards still out there. How many will they kill? But, you’re probably right, Obama knows best.


83 posted on 10/03/2011 11:17:53 AM PDT by jessduntno (Obama shanks. America tanks.)
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To: Captain Kirk

I’m in the Cain camp, I don’t agree with him on this issue, but after all, he is siding with the constitution so I think he can stand on this.


84 posted on 10/03/2011 11:18:13 AM PDT by Scythian
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To: Paradox

“I have read that by joining the group he did, he effectively renounced his American Citizenship. One needn’t say “I revoke my American Citizenship” to do so, the mere act of joining a foreign military/terror campaign against the US effectively terminates your citizenship and all rights thereof.”

I think the key words are “joining a foreign military”
Since tea partiers didn’t join a foreign military, the govt shouldn’t be able to just take them out on a whim.


85 posted on 10/03/2011 11:18:29 AM PDT by ari-freedom (I'm a heartless conservative because I love this country.)
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To: MNJohnnie

You are the ignorant one.


86 posted on 10/03/2011 11:19:18 AM PDT by jgge
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To: Captain Kirk
He has a point.
87 posted on 10/03/2011 11:19:25 AM PDT by caveat emptor (Zippity Do Dah)
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To: blasater1960

“There is a really simple answer to this problem. Do a trial in absentia (since he was in Yemen), there was plenty of eveidence, revoke his citizenship. Then take him out.”

Exactly how civilized people should protect their citizens. Bravo!


88 posted on 10/03/2011 11:19:54 AM PDT by greatvikingone
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To: Captain Kirk

Terrorist acts fall into a murky area between criminal activity where the accused deserve a trial under the constitution, and outright war where the enemy has no such rights. Killing this guy was totally justified because his traitorous acts were well known.

But very few should be on such a kill list. One other who should definitely be on the kill list is Gadahn (sp?) the American.


89 posted on 10/03/2011 11:20:19 AM PDT by Will88
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To: d-back

That is the best solution I’ve heard so far, one that could get this guy off the books but not give Zero a blank check either.


90 posted on 10/03/2011 11:20:37 AM PDT by Free Vulcan (Vote Republican! You can vote Democrat when you're dead.)
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To: jgge
Biden and any number of Democrat Congress critters have go on record calling Tea Party members "terrorirsts"

Really want to establish the principal in US Law that it is just FINE if the US President order the non-judicial sanctioned murder of US Citizens?

You are relly this stupid? Put your mindless Perry worship on hold bot boy and actually THINK, if only for just a heartbeat, what you are arguing for here.

91 posted on 10/03/2011 11:21:49 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (Giving more money to DC to fix the Debt is like giving free drugs to addicts think it will cure them)
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To: jgge
Biden and any number of Democrat Congress critters have go on record calling Tea Party members "terrorists"

Really want to establish the principal in US Law that it is just fine if the US President order the non-judicial sanctioned murder of US Citizens, as long as he calls them "terrorists" first?

You are really this stupid?

92 posted on 10/03/2011 11:23:09 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (Giving more money to DC to fix the Debt is like giving free drugs to addicts think it will cure them)
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To: Retired Greyhound
What is to keep Obama from declaring the Tea Party "enemy combatants"?

The second amendment.

93 posted on 10/03/2011 11:24:20 AM PDT by Jeff Chandler (I never win at Scrable.)
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To: jgge

“Terrorist Awlaki was a traitor and therefore he was no longer a US citizen.”

Per http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/8/1481.html he would lose his citizenship for his acts, but only “if and when he is convicted thereof by a court martial or by a court of competent jurisdiction”.


94 posted on 10/03/2011 11:25:30 AM PDT by greatvikingone
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To: MNJohnnie
You really want to argue the President of the USA should have the power to order the non-judicial sanctioned murder of US Citizens?

Yes I do. It's no different than killing American citizens who might have returned to Germany or Japan during WWII. We don't read them their rights and arrest them. We kill them on the battle field and move on. This guy was in Yemen plotting with al Qaeda to kill Americans. If I am remembering correctly, it was reported that he was busy trying to figure out how to attack New York subways. I'll lose no sleep over this, nor will I worry that this will somehow be used as justification for killing Tea Party members in the US.
95 posted on 10/03/2011 11:25:30 AM PDT by DTxAg
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To: justsaynomore
That[sic] saw WACO as enemiesThey wacked al-Awlaki in Texas?
96 posted on 10/03/2011 11:26:48 AM PDT by Jeff Chandler (I never win at Scrable.)
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To: McGruff
Biden and any number of Democrat Congress critters have go on record calling Tea Party members "terrorists"

Really want to establish the principal in US Law that it is just fine if the US President order the non-judicial sanctioned murder of US Citizens, as long as he calls them "terrorists" first?

97 posted on 10/03/2011 11:26:56 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (Giving more money to DC to fix the Debt is like giving free drugs to addicts think it will cure them)
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To: McGruff; Al B.; RonDog; Syncro

:)

YES!

98 posted on 10/03/2011 11:27:11 AM PDT by onyx (You're here on FR so, support it! If you support Sarah Palin, & want on her ping list, let me know!)
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To: jgge

Yep. Herman hasn’t the depth of concern or curiosity to actually learn what he’s talking about. Sell those books, line up that next talk radio gig, and thank you for your service.


99 posted on 10/03/2011 11:28:09 AM PDT by 9YearLurker
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To: eak3

That would be the case if our legislative branch had not specifically empowered the POTUS on this.

The Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Terrorists (Pub.L. 107-40, 115 Stat. 224, enacted September 18, 2001), one of two resolutions commonly known as “AUMF” (the other being “Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Iraq Resolution of 2002”), was a joint resolution passed by the United States Congress on September 14, 2001, authorizing the use of United States Armed Forces against those responsible for the attacks on September 11, 2001. The authorization granted the President the authority to use all “necessary and appropriate force” against those whom he determined “planned, authorized, committed or aided” the September 11th attacks, or who harbored said persons or groups. The AUMF was signed by President George W. Bush on September 18, 2001.

Obama is the sitting POTUS. Evidently, he determined that this American citizen “planned, authorized, committed or aided” the September 11th attacks or harbored said persons or groups.”


100 posted on 10/03/2011 11:28:46 AM PDT by BuckeyeTexan (Man is not free unless government is limited. ~Ronald Reagan)
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