THIS is America's gun...
Posted on 01/18/2012 11:02:18 AM PST by rellimpank
OK, i am the idiot.
I forgot about the near-bankrupt Desert Hills Shoot Club out there in Boulder City.
No one goes because it cost 3x what everyone else charges. Only way most folks go is as a guest of a member.
Nothing to see here folks, move along.....
No, but methinks that’s the norm for upper limit per what you’re asking.
THIS is America's gun...
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Firearms training makes the difference in winning in a serious situation.
Unfortunately, there are too many folks who never learn how to "run the gun." Instead, they focus on either caliber or capacity.
In either or two cases, they can't hit the target and an innocent is at risk, or they are stalled in a serious situation because they can't clear a malfunction and resume their defensive operation
Training is cheaper than dumping lead and failing to achieve hitting the target on a consist basis. I invest about $1,000 a year training with professionals.
Two expressions people should consider:
"It's the indian not the arrow." - It's the shooter, not the equipment nor the caliber.
"Practice does not make perfect... it just makes permanent." - Practice proper techniques, don't reinforce a failed process.
I'll bet on a guy engaging a threat with a 7 shot 1911 than a yahoo with a 33 round G17 who can't hit the target, nor clear a malfunction.
.
The following videos are instructive and entertaining:
Five shots with a 9mm: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0kwU40huC4
Six shots with a 1911: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQy5yKN-2vw&feature=related
One aspect of "running the gun": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BfyULpEhmug
Basics: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nM8nwZjaf1Y
Self preservation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCC1f-_4ztI&feature=related
Honing skills: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aVoO_Khb2_k&feature=related
--yep--If I'd add "Walmart" too, we'd probably get one of those five-hundred post threads---
I have a Glock G19. The compact model. The full size and the sub compact 9mm versions can all use the 33 round mag. I have a few 33 round mags. I can load it, chamber a round, remove the mag, add another round to it and now have 34 rounds available. Here's a photo of the 33 rounder.
That's not spray and pray. It's just darned fast shooting.
The double-column magazine, in a major caliber pistol, does indeed reduce efficiency and affords nothing particular in return.
Col. Cooper, bless his heart, apparently never had his hands on a Para-Ord pistol with a double column magazine. I have. If anything, I find it to fit my hand better than a traditional single-stack 1911.
I suppose that "we congnoscenti" might say that I'm wrong about that ... that despite my preference of the double-stack pistol I should listen to their theorizing and ignore actual experience ... but if they say that, I say that they can pound sand.
Colonel Cooper also later described the South African Armored Car action [at Ebo, as I recall] in which one Eland A/C went to retrieve another that was bogged down, then itself stalled, whereupon it was taken under fire by a platoon-sized group of Angolans and Cubans. Out of 90mm main gun ammo, the gunner/commander had no recourse but to return fire with his 9mm Star pistol, his two spare magazines and those of his driver, five each, eight round mags in all.
Result: 29 hostiles killed or wounded, for an expenditure of fewer than 40 rounds. And not with a double-column *large capacity* magazine, but a standard eight-shot army issue piece, firing through a 4x4 inch reloading hatch in the side of the turret.
But that is extended aimed fire, not *spray and pray.* And with a 9mm, rather than a .45.
Dwight Johnson received the Medal of Honor for his own similar activities under somewhat similar circumstances, except that he was limited in the amount of M1911A1 .45 magazines available, and while beating North Vietnamese Army sappers to death with a salvaged M3 greasegun, it broke and he was left with having to spear at least one of them with the M3s wire buttstock. Oh, and the fight lasted a half hour or so, and it was at night....
Dwight's the fella hanging off the main gun's bore evacuator....
I practically worshiped Co. Cooper, tho it was more for his politics and his original thinking than his opinion on the .45 auto.
I will have to admit if cornered that the 1911 is my favorite pistol but there are many others just as good or in many situations even better.
If I knew I was going to be attacked by a swarm gang such as we are reading about more and more often, I would probably choose a Glock 17 with a 33 round mag and a couple of spare ones. That is probably overkill but as Bill Jordan once said, “even a creek which averages a foot deep can have some deep holes” or words to that effect.
A well designed 9mm jhp at a high velocity is every bit as effective as the better .45 loads. If one is limited to fmj bullets then the .45 really comes into it’s own.
If I knew I was only going to fire one or two shots, I would choose a S&W model 25-5 which is in .45 Long Colt and use hot loaded jhp loads. A model 27 with hot .357 jhp loads would be as good as would a .41 mag.
That one’s a 617, but I have the identical 686 as well. It’s my favorite winter gun because I don’t have to chase the brass in the snow.
i wonder why nobody yet mentioned the hk p2000 v5 ?
i wonder why nobody yet mentioned the hk p2000 v5 ?
So where'd ya get on your first date? Second base...third base...home??? ;^)
Sorry...couldn't help myself!
—now there is a man who disproves my thought that pistols are not useful in about 98% of military activities except as symbols of authority-—
Power packin plinker!
When I first got into shooting, (1980s), I read everything I could find of his ...
He seemed very wise and educated. I learned a lot from reading his stuff. I also began to realize that he was something of a pompous ass, and seemed incapable of even conceiving that his way might not always be "The One True Way".
It's OK. I learned a lot from him. For that I'm grateful.
I continue to learn a lot from others, as well.
Cooper was a little well a lot, overboard about the .45 auto. The fact that it was and still is a great gun helped.
He clearly was smart tho. He had one of the best comebacks I have ever seen when a CBS reporter asked him if violence doesn’t beget violence? Cooper’s reply was “I sure hope so”.
I do think he was capable of learning even if not admitting he was wrong. When I first started reading him, I think in the 60’s he used to say a hit with a .45 auto would stop a person 98% of the time. I later saw him call it 95%, then in his later years, I never saw him claim that again.
Ashamed to admit I don’t even know what an hk p2000 v5 is.
I suppose some type of Heckler & Koch pistol?
Bullseye. And the same goes for long guns - you put your money on the rifleman, rather than the dude with the glossy .3000 Hypersonic Super Magnum (with optional drum magazine).
Thanks for the links.
Yeah, but he was OUR pompous ass, and we love him;o)
His books still figure prominently on my Kindle, even if I do consider the 1911 to be a gloriously sublime anachronism.
To Ride, Shoot Straight, and Speak the Truth: could there be anything more quintessentially American?
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