Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

US 2012: Romney 'Will not be Nominee'(Bob Vander Plaats switching to Newt?)
The International Business Times ^ | January 23, 2012 | Tom Nicolson

Posted on 01/23/2012 11:48:30 PM PST by 2ndDivisionVet

The president of the influential Christian organisation Family Leader has said Republican candidate Mitt Romney "will not be the eventual nominee" despite leading the polls for the nomination.

Bob Vander Plaats told the International Business Times UK that 75-80 percent of Republicans across the US do not want Romney. "The only reason why he is ahead is because there hasn't been a real alternative," said Plaats. "But now it looks like Gingrich is going to be that person."

Plaats, who initially endorsed former Pennsylvania senator Rick Santorum, carries significant political clout within the Republican Party.

He said: "When I endorsed Santorum in December he was on five percent. He ended up winning the Iowa caucus."

But with Santorum now looking shakier and Gingrich rising in the polls, Plaats said he would now endorse his close friend for the nomination.

"I would full-heartedly endorse Gingrich," he said. "He has been a good and loyal friend to me throughout the years."

Plaats saw the ABC interview with Gingrich's ex-wife as a "hit piece" by the network and rigorously defended Gingrich

"For the people of faith, we base it on the centrepiece of forgiveness," said Plaats. "We've all fallen and none of us are perfect.

"Our faith is concerned not where you start but where you end up. Newt has been very transparent that he has fallen on his knees before God, asked for his forgiveness."

Plaats claimed that his endorsement and that of others within the Christian faith would "not just win the nominee for the party, but for President of the United Sates".


TOPICS: Front Page News; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections; US: Florida
KEYWORDS: bobvanderplaats; elections; evangelicals; florida; gingrich; kingmaker; newt; romney; santorum; vanderplaats; wannabe
Another one. Newtmentum.
1 posted on 01/23/2012 11:48:43 PM PST by 2ndDivisionVet
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: 2ndDivisionVet

This is refreshing. Great to hear someone extend grace instead of condemnation. This is exactly how I feel about Newt - he has been very transparent about his past and how he has sought God’s forgiveness.


2 posted on 01/23/2012 11:59:09 PM PST by cinciella
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: 2ndDivisionVet
I'm with Sarah Palin. Endorsements mean NOTHING to me.
3 posted on 01/24/2012 12:03:11 AM PST by Coldwater Creek (He who dwells in the shelter of the Most High will rest in the shadow of the Almighty Psalm 91:)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: cinciella

It looks as if Mitt Romney and his supporters going after the conservatives in the Republican Party and giving the Obama liberals a pass. I feel very disappointed in the governor of New Jersey and Anne Couiter who by the way was looked at with pride with the conservatives.

Point of interest:
Chris Christie has a temper that cannot be controlled and he has the gull to talk about Newt!


4 posted on 01/24/2012 12:59:10 AM PST by Red Barr (The liberals cant get over our victory!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Red Barr

Ann Coulter and Chris Christie, as well as Sununu, Talent, Molinari, and all of the other members of the Newt hit squad, have greatly marginalized themselves.

THEY are the supposed insiders...not he.


5 posted on 01/24/2012 1:04:06 AM PST by dixiechick2000 (Ths hobbit is looking for her pitchfork.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: 2ndDivisionVet

never heard of him....heck of a name though van-der-plaats.

my Jewish friends will get a kick out of that name...

(but then again they have their ‘Lipschitz’ )


6 posted on 01/24/2012 4:00:47 AM PST by Vaquero ("an armed society is a polite society" Robert A. Heinlein)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: 2ndDivisionVet

The Establishment is already switching to Mitch Daniels - they’ve given up on Romney. Our job is to stop them...which means staying unified on Newt.


7 posted on 01/24/2012 4:28:51 AM PST by BobL ("Heartless" and "Inhumane" FReepers for Cain - we've HAD ENOUGH)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: 2ndDivisionVet; All
From the article: The president of the influential Christian organisation Family Leader has said Republican candidate Mitt Romney "will not be the eventual nominee" despite leading the polls for the nomination. Bob Vander Plaats told the International Business Times UK that 75-80 percent of Republicans across the US do not want Romney.

Indeed, he won't be!

Beyond his home turf, Romney has yet to win a single primary race on the 'road'...Now 0-17! The SuperLoserMan of our times!

Don't let the MSM hoodwink its gullible viewers and listeners into their 'frontrunner' crafty handiwork! Oost Romney for good in Florida!

Just posted: 'Mr. Electability?' SuperLoserMan Mitt not viable candidate...0-17 in 'road' races [Vanity]

8 posted on 01/24/2012 4:40:11 AM PST by Colofornian (If 94% of LDS repeat voting for Romney, then such RINO-voting reveals a liberal Mormon bent)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: 2ndDivisionVet

Re: Van der Plaant re-endorsement . In politics there are no friends but many political aquaintances


9 posted on 01/24/2012 5:03:29 AM PST by mosesdapoet (Moses ..A nick name I received as a kid for warning another -It's a sin to tell a lie")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: 2ndDivisionVet

Fred Thompson endorsed Gingrich last night, now this. The dominoes have started to fall in the Romney campaign & hopefully, he won’t be able to stop them. His performance last night was reptilian.


10 posted on 01/24/2012 5:44:06 AM PST by MissMagnolia (Being powerful is like being a lady. If you have to tell people you are, you aren't. (M.Thatcher))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: 2ndDivisionVet

Why didn’t he just endorse Newt in the first place?


11 posted on 01/24/2012 5:57:54 AM PST by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose of a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: 2ndDivisionVet; All
This is significant.

I've been saying for some time that if Newt Gingrich is going to be the Republican nominee, we have some serious and difficult work to do to keep Christian conservatives from jumping ship or, more likely, quietly failing to work hard for the candidate.

Vander Plaats may just be the right man to do that work.

The endorsement of the major national Christian leaders would carry more weight, but many of them run nonprofit 501(c)3 organizations or pastor large churches and therefore routinely work “under the radar” with personal statements of who they will support rather than public endorsements which, though perfectly legal if done as private individuals, could attract unwanted IRS scrutiny of their organizations or churches. I don't see the major heads of organizations who have come out backing Santorum changing their endorsement anytime soon, and the smaller groups didn't come out very publicly after the Texas conference and can't be expected to do so now, either.

However, a decision by Bob Vander Plaats to switch his support to Newt Gingrich would attract my attention for three reasons:

1) The Vander Plaats endorsement was key to Huckabee and Santorum’s performance in Iowa.

2) It's not a new thing. Vander Plaats said months ago that while the former speaker's personal life was a consideration that lots of Christians were dealing with, “Since four or five years ago, he’s shown a very transparent grace and maturity... He’s been married to Callista for over a decade. He’s healed his relationship with his children.”

http://www.slate.com/blogs/weigel/2011/12/20/santorum_surge_watch_the_vander_plaats_ening.html

3. Perhaps most important, those who are familiar with the Dutch Reformed world know the tremendous emphasis placed in those circles on marriage issues. Excommunication for unbiblical divorce used to be routine and sexual sins are still treated with great seriousness. That is not always the case in a significant part of the evangelical world.

I'm not trying to imply that the Dutch are better at saving marriages than non-Dutch evangelicals — I grew up in Grand Rapids, used to live in Iowa, and know very well that's **NOT** true — but I am saying that marital failures often get severely punished. Cheap grace is not something associated with the Dutch. For that reason, a Vander Plaats endorsement for Gingrich may carry significance with other conservative Christian leaders since it won't be possible to dismiss it as coddling sin or treating it lightly.

In summary: If we're going to have Gingrich as our nominee, I want Vander Plaats and a lot of people like him making that case loudly and clearly. Gingrich is going to need that to get and keep evangelical votes.

12 posted on 01/25/2012 12:49:49 AM PST by darrellmaurina
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: darrellmaurina

I’m Lutheran, but a close cousin married Dutch (Pella, Iowa) and my late father helped run some Dutch Reformed Cursillos (DeColores).


13 posted on 01/25/2012 1:00:12 AM PST by 2ndDivisionVet (You can't invade the US. There'd be a rifle behind every blade of grass.~Admiral Yamamoto)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: 2ndDivisionVet
Bbbbuutt....the media have already chosen our candidate for us!!!

A winning ticket.

Romney - McCain 2012!

14 posted on 01/25/2012 3:29:57 AM PST by SkyPilot
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: 2ndDivisionVet

Hubba. Hubba. Hubba.


15 posted on 01/25/2012 3:49:22 AM PST by Servant of the Cross (the Truth will set you free)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: 2ndDivisionVet
"I would full-heartedly endorse Gingrich," he said. "He has been a good and loyal friend to me throughout the years."

They must have changed the article since then - current text reads:

"I would full-heartedly endorse Gingrich [if Santorum were to drop out]," he said. "He has been a good and loyal friend to me throughout the years."

16 posted on 01/25/2012 3:56:08 AM PST by monkapotamus
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: 2ndDivisionVet
Plaats claimed that his endorsement and that of others within the Christian faith would "not just win the nominee for the party, but for President of the United Sates".
17 posted on 01/25/2012 4:30:02 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: cinciella
Great to hear someone extend grace instead of condemnation.

Yeah; it DOES get old; doesn't it!



Questions put to Joseph Smith: "'Do you believe the Bible?' [Smith:]'If we do, we are the only people under heaven that does, for there are none of the religious sects of the day that do'. When asked 'Will everybody be damned, but Mormons'? [Smith replied] 'Yes, and a great portion of them, unless they repent, and work righteousness." (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 119).
Joseph Smith: "for the teachers of religion of the different sects understood the same passages of scripture so differently as to destroy all confidence in settling the question by an appeal to the Bible" (from Pearl of Great Price 1:12). "What is it that inspires professors of Christianity generally with a hope of salvation? It is that smooth, sophisticated influence of the devil, by which he deceives the whole world" (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p.270).
 
 
 
Brigham Young stated this repeatedly: "When the light came to me I saw that all the so-called Christian world was grovelling in darkness" (Journal of Discourses 5:73); "The Christian world, so-called, are heathens as to the knowledge of the salvation of God" (Journal of Discourses 8:171); "With a regard to true theology, a more ignorant people never lived than the present so-called Christian world" (Journal of Discourses 8:199); "And who is there that acknowledges [God's] hand? ...You may wander east, west, north, and south, and you cannot find it in any church or government on the earth, except the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints" (Journal of Discourses , vol. 6, p.24); "Should you ask why we differ from other Christians, as they are called, it is simply because they are not Christians as the New Testament defines Christianity" (Journal of Discourses 10:230).
 
 
 
Orson Pratt proclaimed: "Both Catholics and Protestants are nothing less than the 'whore of Babylon' whom the Lord denounces by the mouth of John the Revelator as having corrupted all the earth by their fornications and wickedness. Any person who shall be so corrupt as to receive a holy ordinance of the Gospel from the ministers of any of these apostate churches will be sent down to hell with them, unless they repent" (The Seer, p. 255).
 
 
 
Orson Pratt also said: "This great apostasy commenced about the close of the first century of the Christian era, and it has been waxing worse and worse from then until now" (Journal of Discourses
, vol.18, p.44) and: "But as there has been no Christian Church on the earth for a great many centuries past, until the present century, the people have lost sight of the pattern that God has given according to which the Christian Church should be established, and they have denominated a great variety of people Christian Churches, because they profess to be ...But there has been a long apostasy, during which the nations have been cursed with apostate churches in great abundance" (Journal of Discourses , 18:172).
 
 
President John Taylor stated: "Christianity...is a perfect pack of nonsense...the devil could not invent a better engine to spread his work than the Christianity of the nineteenth century." (Journal of Discourses , vol. 6, p.167); "Where shall we look for the true order or authority of God? It cannot be found in any nation of Christendom." (Journal of Discourses , 10:127).
 
 
 
James Talmage said: "A self-suggesting interpretation of history indicates that there has been a great departure from the way of salvation as laid down by the Savior, a universal apostasy from the Church of Christ". (A Study of the Articles of Faith, p.182).
 
 
 
President Joseph Fielding Smith said: "Doctrines were corrupted, authority lost, and a false order of religion took the place of the gospel of Jesus Christ, just as it had been the case in former dispensations, and the people were left in spiritual darkness." (Doctrines of Salvation, p.266). "For hundreds of years the world was wrapped in a veil of spiritual darkness, until there was not one fundamental truth belonging to the place of salvation ...Joseph Smith declared that in the year 1820 the Lord revealed to him that all the 'Christian' churches were in error, teaching for commandments the doctrines of men" (Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 3, p.282).
 
 
 
More recent statements by apostle Bruce McConkie are also very clear: "Apostasy was universal...And this darkness still prevails except among those who have come to a knowledge of the restored gospel" (Doctrines of Salvation, vol 3, p.265); "Thus the signs of the times include the prevailing apostate darkness in the sects of Christendom and in the religious world in general" (The Millennial Messiah, p.403); "a perverted Christianity holds sway among the so-called Christians of apostate Christendom" (Mormon Doctrine, p.132); "virtually all the millions of apostate Christendom have abased themselves before the mythical throne of a mythical Christ whom they vainly suppose to be a spirit essence who is incorporeal uncreated, immaterial and three-in-one with the Father and Holy Spirit" (Mormon Doctrine, p.269); "Gnosticism is one of the great pagan philosophies which antedated Christ and the Christian Era and which was later commingled with pure Christianity to form the apostate religion that has prevailed in the world since the early days of that era." (Mormon Doctrine, p.316).
 
 
 
President George Q. Cannon said: "After the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was organized, there were only two churches upon the earth. They were known respectively as the Church of the Lamb of God and Babylon. The various organizations which are called churches throughout Christendom, though differing in their creeds and organizations, have one common origin. They all belong to Babylon" (Gospel Truth, p.324).
 
 
President Wilford Woodruff stated: "the Gospel of modern Christendom shuts up the Lord, and stops all communication with Him. I want nothing to do with such a Gospel, I would rather prefer the Gospel of the dark ages, so called" (Journal of Discourses , vol. 2, p.196).

18 posted on 01/25/2012 4:34:16 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: cinciella
 When asked 'Will everybody be damned, but Mormons'?
 
 [Smith replied] 'Yes, and a great portion of them, unless they repent, and work righteousness."
 
 (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 119).
 
 
 
 
 
Reinforced by the NEXT 'prophet' to hold power over the MORMONs:
 

"Now if any of you will deny the plurality of wives, and continue to do so, I promise that you will be damned;

and I will go still further and say, take this revelation, or any other revelation that the Lord has given,

and deny it in your feelings, and I promise that you will be damned.

Brigham Young - JoD 3:266 (July 14, 1855)


19 posted on 01/25/2012 4:34:34 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: cinciella
This is exactly how I feel about Newt - he has been very transparent about his past and how he has sought God’s forgiveness.

In light of the quotes from above; it looks like MITT needs to 'seek forgiveness', too!

20 posted on 01/25/2012 4:35:33 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: BobL
The Establishment is already switching to Mitch Daniels - they’ve given up on Romney.



My man Mitch!
 
 
 
 
My man Mitt!
 

21 posted on 01/25/2012 4:42:02 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: MissMagnolia
His performance last night was reptilian.

It ain't easy; bein' green!

22 posted on 01/25/2012 4:48:52 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: cinciella
This is not refreshing--this is disgusting. Just simply read the quotes by BVP and you'll understand what makes this man tick.

There was credible evidence BVP tried to get Santorum help him raise ONE MILLION DOLLARS in order to help him promote Santorum.

I know these people, I know their history. BVP has run for governor three times and has been rejected by Republicans in Iowa each time.

This guy lucked out that Santorum just happened to rise at the time he did. Then it looked as though BVP was responsible for Santorum's win in Iowa, when in fact, I allege it was in spite of the fact VP endorsed him. With BVP, everything is about BVP.

23 posted on 01/25/2012 4:57:05 AM PST by Conservativegreatgrandma
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: darrellmaurina
This is BS. BVP is an opportunist and if he switches his support from Santorum to Newt, it's only because he sees an opportunity for himself. He wants to be thought of as a kingmaker.

The very fact that BVP is willing to do this shows the character of the man.

24 posted on 01/25/2012 5:02:50 AM PST by Conservativegreatgrandma
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: Conservativegreatgrandma

Amen

A big offering is his desire


25 posted on 01/25/2012 5:07:10 AM PST by bert (K.E. N.P. +12 ..... Crucifixion is coming)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: Elsie
Yea, right, we see where that endorsement from the 150 evangelicals who met in TX got Santorum. BVP may think he solely was responsible for Santorum winning the Iowa caucus but he just happened to go on board while Santorum was in ascent.

If BVP is so powerful, why is Santorum not continuing with the momentum. BVP is a phony.

26 posted on 01/25/2012 5:07:12 AM PST by Conservativegreatgrandma
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: bert

You got that right. I am sick that so many people can be so gullible.


27 posted on 01/25/2012 5:10:25 AM PST by Conservativegreatgrandma
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: 2ndDivisionVet
13 posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2012 3:00:12 AM by 2ndDivisionVet: “I’m Lutheran, but a close cousin married Dutch (Pella, Iowa) and my late father helped run some Dutch Reformed Cursillos (DeColores).”

My pastor is from Pella, for whatever it's worth; his father owns Eagle Electric. You just showed your ability to play “Dutch bingo” — i.e., figuring out how to make an ecclesiastical or family connection between two Dutch Reformed people!

The “tres dias” or “Cursillo” movement's primary manifestation within Reformed circles has been the “Reformed Marriage Encounter” and I'm guessing that's what your father was involved in. Reformed Marriage Encounter is not an organization with which I have much firsthand knowledge and I don't want to say things if I'm not pretty sure of my facts. I just don't know the group very well and know about it mostly by reading articles on it; my impression is they're well-meaning people trying to take a successful Roman Catholic method of strengthening marriages and adapt it to a Reformed understanding of church life. In the modern world, anyone trying to strengthen marriage and family deserves our respect regardless of whether we agree on details or methods.

The United Reformed Churches in North America (the main conservative Christian Reformed secession group) is the denomination in which our pastor was raised and with which our local church was originally affiliated until we decided we needed to be in a more culturally Southern denomination to function effectively in the Missouri Ozarks. We're now in the Associate Reformed Presbyterian Church since a number of us were concerned about problems and trends in the Presbyterian Church in America, the main Southern Presbyterian denomination.

You may already know this, but there are two main Dutch Reformed denominations, the Christian Reformed Church and Reformed Church in America, both of roughly similar size in the 300,000-member range; the third largest but much smaller group is the United Reformed Churches in North America with about a tenth of that membership. There are numerous smaller bodies of which the more significant are the Canadian and American Reformed Churches, Netherlands Reformed Congregations, Protestant Reformed Churches, Heritage Reformed Congregations, and Free Reformed Churches in North America. Several of those groups have memberships which are mostly or almost entirely Canadian.

To the best of my knowledge Bob Vander Plaats is a member of a large and fairly conservative Reformed Church in America congregation, but I'm having trouble verifying that on the internet. The last time I talked to him in person was about a decade ago and I haven't had a reason to be in contact with him since leaving Iowa. He would not remember me though it is likely he would recognize my work as the reporter who spent a great deal of time covering an ultra-liberal RCA pastor who was eventually deposed for gross sexual misconduct after becoming a prominent supporter of gay marriage and denying salvation through Christ alone. Let's just say the RCA has serious and major problems which are often a major embarrassment to its evangelicals in more conservative places like Iowa, but the Christian Reformed Church is headed in the same direction, unfortunately, which is what generated the URC secession in the 1990s.

For whatever it's worth, you may want to ask your friend about the situation at the United Reformed congregation in Pella. There's a back-story behind the reason I'm pointing out how severely the Dutch Reformed have dealt with marriage problems; though it's one that is irrelevant to this issue on Free Republic, you may be interested. Total depravity is not a minor doctrine, its consequences are not limited to liberals, and it's one we all need to remember in our own lives lest we fall.

In the process of digging into the politics of Vander Plaats’ move toward a Gingrich endorsement, I've run into a lot of articles by Iowa pastors expressing serious concerns. I'm not going to post those online since a lot of them can fairly be accused of “bashing Gingrich.”

I have no interest in bashing Gingrich or doing anything that could cause me to be accused of that. My point is that Vander Plaats has some tough work ahead of him, but he also has the credibility to do the job if anyone can.

28 posted on 01/25/2012 5:14:42 AM PST by darrellmaurina
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: darrellmaurina
You're on the right track here. First, BVP is from NW Iowa--not the Pella area. BVP was a member of the ultra-liberal Reformed church. It was a point, I made many times as he was running for governor and all the evangelicals continued to make about his hardline stance of the issue of gay marriage.

My point was that if he had such passionate views about gay marriage, why did he belong to a denomination that was in full approval of gay marriage and as a matter of fact they had full fellowship with the totally apostate, ELCA.

It is possible he has changed denominations since then but I know what I was saying was the truth.

29 posted on 01/25/2012 5:23:15 AM PST by Conservativegreatgrandma
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies]

To: Conservativegreatgrandma
Caution may be appropriate. Free Republic has endorsed Newt Gingrich and those of us who support another candidate need to remember that support for private property means we support an owner's right to do what he wants with his property.

I can live with Gingrich or Santorum; we need the best candidate we can get and those are the two men left in the race who are consistently pro-life. I have my preferences but either is better than Mitt Romney with his history of flip-flopping, and both are tremendously better than Barack Obama.

30 posted on 01/25/2012 5:26:06 AM PST by darrellmaurina
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: Conservativegreatgrandma
Yes, I know Bob Vander Plaats is from Northwest Iowa. I lived most of my life in Michigan (Grand Rapids and Holland) but also have lived in Iowa. I have more than two decades of church connections with the state's RCA, CRC and URC community, and I know it well.

The RCA cannot fairly be called ultra-liberal. It's also still fighting the gay marriage issue; that's far from a settled matter in the RCA and there's a major difference between where the RCA stands and where the PCUSA and similar groups stand. I think there's still a good chance the RCA evangelicals will win on this, though I was more confident of that a decade ago before a key RCA evangelical leader who had close ties with Dr. D. James Kennedy was forced to leave the ministry due to major public sin, and a number of other conservative leaders left the RCA for other reasons.

The RCA has a huge split between its east coast regional synods, all of which are rapidly losing members, and its Midwestern churches which tend to be more evangelical than Reformed but are generally quite strongly opposed to liberalism. Since money talks, the denominational leadership, which **IS** quite liberal, is more or less forced to listen to evangelicals who have far more power in the RCA than they have in the PC(USA) or similar mainline denominations. That's quite different from a lot of other mainline denominations where the evangelicals are ignored because they don't have enough votes to matter.

So yes, feel free to criticize the RCA on doctrinal integrity. I'll join you; I'm a confessional Calvinist and the RCA's conservatives are broadly evangelical, not confessionally Reformed. But it's not fair to say the RCA is ultra-liberal.

31 posted on 01/25/2012 5:41:08 AM PST by darrellmaurina
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | View Replies]

To: darrellmaurina

I call all of these groups ultra-liberal—there can be no other description. I left the ELCA 20 years ago because they had already become apostate. http://www.elca.org/Who-We-Are/Our-Three-Expressions/Churchwide-Organization/Office-of-the-Presiding-Bishop/Ecumenical-and-Inter-Religious-Relations/Full-Communion-Partners/Reformed-Church-in-America.aspx


32 posted on 01/25/2012 5:52:52 AM PST by Conservativegreatgrandma
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: darrellmaurina

My position has nothing to do with Gingrich—it is BVP who is my focus. I would not want his endorsement.


33 posted on 01/25/2012 6:07:14 AM PST by Conservativegreatgrandma
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 30 | View Replies]

To: Conservativegreatgrandma

VanderPlaats is the white Al Sharpton.


34 posted on 01/25/2012 6:12:56 AM PST by Pappy Smear (Support the presidency, end the policies.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: Pappy Smear
Thank you. BVP has to be one of the luckiest guys in America. He escapes a huge scandal because those involved don't want to talk and then he turns around and happens to endorse Santorum at just the right time. Then he is declared the reason for Santorum's win.

I even saw Cavuto on FOX, the day after the caucus giving credit for Santorum's showing in Iowa to BVP. I wanted to gag.

It got worse, a few days later, I was watching DONALD TRUMP on FOX and he even brought up BVP. Trump said that BVP is a "great guy" and deserves more credit than he's getting for Santorum's showing.

I have no clue why Trump would be the least big interested in BVP but somehow, I doubt they are personal friends so how would Trump know if VP is a great guy, or not?

35 posted on 01/25/2012 6:22:47 AM PST by Conservativegreatgrandma
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 34 | View Replies]

To: Conservativegreatgrandma
I am sick that so many people can be so gullible.

Well, Ma'am; folks are REALLY not gullible; they just are a hungerin' for the TRUTH!!


36 posted on 01/25/2012 6:28:42 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: Elsie

I do not understand the relationship between the conversation and the photo but many people are not hungerin’ for the truth. They want affirmation of their preconceived ideas—even if they’re wrong.


37 posted on 01/25/2012 6:34:42 AM PST by Conservativegreatgrandma
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 36 | View Replies]

To: Conservativegreatgrandma
I spent a decade of my life working in the conservative movement trying to save the Christian Reformed Church. I'm a Calvin graduate. I grew up in Grand Rapids, Mich., and spent a fair amount of time living in the city of Holland, Mich., as well as rural Iowa. I once belonged to a church which eventually joined the URC and now am a member of a church which left the URC to join a predominantly Southern denomination, the Associate Reformed Presbyterian Church, mostly because the URC wasn't a good fit for the culture of the rural Ozarks.

You'll get no argument from me about the problems of the CRC and even more so the RCA. I am far to the right, theologically speaking, of both denominations. Using Lutheran equivalent categories you may be more familiar with, I'm much closer to the Wisconsin Synod than the Missouri Synod, and certainly am not anywhere near the ELCA.

I think we're disagreeing about definitions of words, not the underlying realities behind them. I prefer to reserve terms like “ultra-liberal” for the Unitarians, the United Church of Christ, and similar bodies. I take my definition of “Liberalism” from J. Gresham Machen’s “Christianity and Liberalism,” and that type of classical liberalism does not yet control the RCA.

We're off-track, however; this is a thread about Bob Vander Plaats and Newt Gingrich and Rick Santorum, not the RCA or CRC. It sounds like you're aware of some issues involving Bob Vander Plaats that have not yet come out publicly. I know the Dutch Reformed world well enough to know that if he has serious dirt, it will get exposed very publicly if he does something that fellow Christian conservatives believe is beyond acceptable limits. The Dutch keep lots of stuff hidden in their communities, but they also know everyone else’s dirt very well and will expose it if necessary.

38 posted on 01/25/2012 7:31:54 AM PST by darrellmaurina
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 32 | View Replies]

To: BobL
The Establishment is already switching to Mitch Daniels - they’ve given up on Romney.

Has JimRob ruled on Mitch yet?

I know I am in the minority here, but I really like him. Not sure if I am allowed to publicly support him on here though.

Anybody know for sure? I love FR and want to make sure I don't inadvertently break any rules.

39 posted on 01/25/2012 8:31:15 AM PST by comebacknewt (Newt (sigh) what could have been . . .)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: comebacknewt

Don’t be supportive of Romney on FR, and don’t jab at Newt. Formal declarations from forum owner.


40 posted on 01/25/2012 8:33:41 AM PST by Lazamataz (Norm Lenhart knows nothing about reloading.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 39 | View Replies]

To: Coldwater Creek
I'm with Sarah Palin.

I'm telling Todd.

41 posted on 01/25/2012 8:41:58 AM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Lazamataz
Thanks Laz.

No problem on Romney. I detest him.

I will also make sure I am respectful of Newt.

42 posted on 01/25/2012 8:42:05 AM PST by comebacknewt (Newt (sigh) what could have been . . .)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: comebacknewt
I totally missed who you were talking about.

I read 'Mitt'.

I suck.

43 posted on 01/25/2012 8:49:05 AM PST by Lazamataz (Norm Lenhart knows nothing about reloading.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: Lazamataz
You don't suck. You are a legend, and legends can't suck.

Do you know if he has specifically said anything about Daniels?

44 posted on 01/25/2012 9:05:41 AM PST by comebacknewt (Newt (sigh) what could have been . . .)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 43 | View Replies]

To: 2ndDivisionVet
"We've all fallen and none of us are perfect."

No truer words have ever been spoken. I can't remember where I read or heard it, but Newt saying it was a mistake sitting on that couch w/ stretch pelosi was a mistake.

Everytime I heard or saw Newt, that was the image that came to mind. I could not let go of it...until I heard Newt say it was a mistake.

"Forgive my trespasses as I forgive those who trespass against me".

45 posted on 01/25/2012 9:10:12 AM PST by NoGrayZone (Jim "Firebrand" Robinson endorses Newt...with EPIC call to action!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Elsie
"In light of the quotes from above; it looks like MITT needs to 'seek forgiveness', too!"

The only problem w/ mittens, is that in his mind he has done nothing wrong; therefore, needs nor seeks ANY forgiveness.

Certainly not a Christian. We ALL fall short. mittens seems to be the only one who thinks he doesn't.

46 posted on 01/25/2012 9:16:49 AM PST by NoGrayZone (Jim "Firebrand" Robinson endorses Newt...with EPIC call to action!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: don-o

YIPE”S


47 posted on 01/25/2012 10:55:37 AM PST by Coldwater Creek (He who dwells in the shelter of the Most High will rest in the shadow of the Almighty Psalm 91:)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: Conservativegreatgrandma
Those are MORMON 'elders'.

They HAVE the truth...


 
 
Professor Robert Millet        teaching at the Mission Prep Club in 2004  http://newsnet.byu.edu/video/18773/  <-- Complete and uneditted

 
 
Timeline...    Subject...
 
0:59           "Anti-Mormons..."
1:16           "ATTACK the faith you have..."
2:02           "We really aren't obligated to answer everyone's questions..."
3:57           "You already know MORE about God and Christ and the plan of salvation than any who would ATTACK you."


48 posted on 01/25/2012 2:47:29 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 37 | View Replies]

To: NoGrayZone
"Forgive my trespasses as I forgive those who trespass against me".

Even better:

Matthew 6:15

But if you do not forgive others their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins.


49 posted on 01/25/2012 2:50:13 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 45 | View Replies]

To: comebacknewt

“Has JimRob ruled on Mitch yet? I know I am in the minority here, but I really like him. Not sure if I am allowed to publicly support him on here though. Anybody know for sure? I love FR and want to make sure I don’t inadvertently break any rules.”

First, Daniels is an IDIOT for selling off the Indiana Toll Road. But regardless, it appears that he won’t be running. The problem will be that if he runs, and is perceived (correctly) to be an Establishment Tool to keep a conservative from getting the nomination, then, yes, your entire history on this site will be in danger if you support him to the point of calling Newt an jerk, or equivalent. If you like Daniels, you’ll probably live another day...but if you attack our front-runner...your days may be numbered.

Just my observations - not a threat.


50 posted on 01/25/2012 5:46:22 PM PST by BobL ("Heartless" and "Inhumane" FReepers for Cain - we've HAD ENOUGH)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 39 | View Replies]

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson