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Guns allowed at school?(MI)
easternecho.com ^ | 8 April, 2012 | Sammy DeMarco

Posted on 04/09/2012 6:22:00 AM PDT by marktwain

Concealed weapons should be allowed on campus. There, I said it. After years of believing weapons should not be allowed on university property, I have flipped my position. I can no longer find a valid reason as to why law-abiding citizens who attend and work at Eastern Michigan University or any university campus should be left defenseless.

Last week, the group Students for Concealed Carry protested the ban on carrying concealed weapons on campus. It coincided with a bill passed in the Michigan Senate that will lift the ban and allow citizens to legally carry concealed weapons at universities.

Last week was also one in which seven people were killed at Oikos University in Oakland by a former student. According to the LA Times, the alleged gunman lined his victims up in a classroom before shooting them. The police arrived as soon as they possibly could, but for seven people it was not soon enough.

If just one of the seven had a weapon, do you think those victims would have stood a better chance of surviving?

The EMU Public Safety folks are some of the most professional authorities I’ve encountered. I have no doubt they are highly capable of handling a situation similar to what happened last week at Oikos. But we cannot expect police to be on every corner, in every parking lot and every classroom every minute. Beyond that, concealed carrying restrictions actually extend beyond campus.

Many students live off campus, have night classes and walk home. We regularly receive emails and texts alerting us that yet another classmate was robbed or assaulted while walking home.

So, not only are citizens not allowed to defend themselves while on campus, they are left defenseless going to and coming from the university, too.

I realize many people will say we need stricter gun laws, not less strict, to deter crime. That logic goes something like this: We need to restrict law abiding citizens from carrying concealed weapons. This in turn will reduce the crime that criminals commit on those very law abiding folks.

So, out of all the laws criminals break, we think the one law they will obey is not carrying a concealed weapon? I’m having trouble reaching that conclusion.

Opponents of concealed weapons also point out that all hell will break loose and blood will flood the streets if we are allowed to carry. OK valid point, except that cities with the greatest restrictions are also ones that experience some of the highest homicide rates: Detroit, New York, Washington D.C. and Chicago according to a report by the National Center for Policy Analysis.

Chicago had an outright ban on all handguns until the U.S. Supreme Court struck down the law in 2010. In the response to its decision, the Court said “Chicago Police Department statistics, we are told, reveal that the City’s handgun murder rate has actually increased since the ban was enacted and that Chicago residents now face one of the highest murder rates in the country and rates of other violent crimes that exceed the average in comparable cities.”

According to academic researcher and author John Lott, areas that allow good standing citizens to carry concealed weapons experience a drop in crime after a few years.

He attributes some of this to would-be attackers thinking twice about targeting a potential victim who might be armed. So, imagine this scenario: You leave your class that ended at 9:55 p.m. to walk home. On your way, you see three suspicious males and your instincts tell you something isn’t right. Your hands happen to be in your coat pockets because it’s a chilly night. They walk by without incident. Two hours later you receive an EMU text alert that your classmate was attacked by three males matching the description of the ones you saw earlier and was in critical condition.

It turns out they didn’t prey on you because they thought maybe you were clutching something more than a cell phone in that pocket. Even though you weren’t carrying a concealed weapon, the fact that you could and thus might have was enough to deter them and save you.

Self defense should go beyond law; it’s a right by nature. Denying someone a right to defend themselves against his or her would-be attackers is immoral. The reasons opponents give for supporting restrictions is not supported by data. The restrictions criminalize the good guys and empowers the bad ones. Police cannot be everywhere at once. Ultimately, there is only one person truly responsible for your safety: you.

It took me years to arrive here, but here I stand. It’s time we’re allowed to defend ourselves with more than a pen and a sharp tongue.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; News/Current Events; Philosophy; US: Michigan
KEYWORDS: banglist; campus; ccw; mi
Nice to see someone open to considering the facts.
1 posted on 04/09/2012 6:22:06 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: marktwain

The way I see it, we either have Thought Police and an ineffectual and corrupt Police State or an armed, and thus polite, society.


2 posted on 04/09/2012 6:55:41 AM PDT by stayathomemom (Beware of kittens modifying your posts.)
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To: marktwain
Back in the early 80's I went to college at at large university in Michigan and took many night classes to increase my credit load to graduate quickly.

There was a man who would hide in the Men's bathrooms and rape them at knife point.

I carried a 45 ACP in a shoulder holster even though it was illegal in the entire state as they would not issue permits to anyone.

Better to be judged by 12 than carried by six or homosexually raped.

3 posted on 04/09/2012 6:57:22 AM PDT by OldMissileer (Atlas, Titan, Minuteman, PK. Winners of the Cold War)
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To: marktwain
In my youth in Michigan and we had 3 big hunting seasons: Rabbit Pheasant and Deer. I remember all the boys bringing our luggage and our rifles to school so that our dads would pick us up and head North immediately thereafter.

I remember the nuns taking each rifle attaching a note with the name of the boy who owned it and putting them in the closet.

Imaging trying that today.

4 posted on 04/09/2012 6:58:14 AM PDT by Mikey_1962 (Obama: The Affirmative Action President.)
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To: Mikey_1962

I graduated in ‘79. If you left your shotgun in the gunrack, the principal would ask that you hide it before going to the next period.

I was allowed to restock a shotgun for my wood shop project however. The teacher kept the bolt until I needed to fit it.

Hard to believe how far we have fallen.


5 posted on 04/09/2012 7:10:57 AM PDT by Clay Moore (The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but the heart of a fool to the left. Ecclesiastes 10:2)
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To: Mikey_1962
I went to a rural HS. We were allowed to bring shotguns to school and hunt on the back 80 acres of school property after school.

Yes, we even were allowed to bring them on the school bus.

They had to be in a case and stored in your locker until school was out.

6 posted on 04/09/2012 7:34:06 AM PDT by Beagle8U (Free Republic -- One stop shopping ....... It's the Conservative Super WalMart for news .)
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To: marktwain
cities with the greatest restrictions are also ones that experience some of the highest homicide rates: Detroit, New York, Washington D.C. and Chicago

Detroit has the same restrictions as the rest of the state, and they aren't all that onerous. shall issue CPL, open carry is legal, no limits on how many guns you can buy. worst part is the ~$10 fee for the background check to buy a pistol (if you don't have a CPL).
detroit is the exception to this rule.
7 posted on 04/09/2012 7:36:40 AM PDT by absolootezer0 (2x divorced tattooed pierced harley hatin meghan mccain luvin' REAL beer drinkin' smoker ..what?)
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To: Beagle8U
I went to a rural HS. We were allowed to bring shotguns to school

I remember always taking my shotgun to school during deer season. Hunting is a way of life where I grew up. The Superintendent hunted with us and stayed at Deer Camp every year. Like someone else mentioned, I put the gun behind the seat in the pickup during the day.

8 posted on 04/09/2012 7:40:41 AM PDT by IamConservative (Shall I try and perhaps fail or shall I do nothing without fail?)
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To: absolootezer0
Detroit has the same restrictions as the rest of the state, and they aren't all that onerous. shall issue CPL, open carry is legal, no limits on how many guns you can buy. worst part is the ~$10 fee for the background check to buy a pistol (if you don't have a CPL). detroit is the exception to this rule.

You are correct, but it is a fairly recent change. Detroit had to be taken to court and ordered to follow the law. They were arresting people who were doing nothing illegal. The City management thought that they were above state law.

9 posted on 04/09/2012 8:12:10 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: Springman; sergeantdave; cyclotic; netmilsmom; RatsDawg; PGalt; FreedomHammer; queenkathy; ...
Gotta love Michigan. No smoking on school grounds unless its gunsmoke.

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10 posted on 04/09/2012 8:25:08 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: Beagle8U
I went to a rural HS. We were allowed to bring shotguns to school and hunt on the back 80 acres of school property after school. Yes, we even were allowed to bring them on the school bus.

I had the same experience-- in 1985! The district superintendent himself would come over to my buddy's truck as we pulled in, and asked us how we did hunting that morning before school! And the supt stood there while our rifles or shotguns were in my buddy gun rack in his truck!

11 posted on 04/09/2012 8:25:14 AM PDT by backwoods-engineer (I will vote against ANY presidential candidate who had non-citizen parents.)
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To: backwoods-engineer

I’m an 83 graduate. The rules for us were that any student who brought a gun to school had to leave it in their car if they drove. Guns couldn’t be carried on the bus so a parent had to bring you and the gun had to be left in the principal’s office. The place looked like an armory some days.

Not one shooting ever happened.


12 posted on 04/09/2012 8:28:45 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: cripplecreek
Not one shooting ever happened.

NOT ONE! And if there had been a dangerous attacked, the good 'ol boys would have beat his ass into the concrete floor of the Ag Building!

Things are so much better when citizens take care of their own lives rather than depending on government to protect and nourish them.

13 posted on 04/09/2012 8:40:41 AM PDT by backwoods-engineer (I will vote against ANY presidential candidate who had non-citizen parents.)
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To: cripplecreek
(sorry correction)

Not one shooting ev7 er happened.

NOT ONE! And if there had been a dangerous attacker, the good 'ol boys would have beat his ass into the concrete floor of the Ag Building!

Things are so much better when citizens take care of their own lives rather than depending on government to protect and nourish them.

14 posted on 04/09/2012 8:42:46 AM PDT by backwoods-engineer (I will vote against ANY presidential candidate who had non-citizen parents.)
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To: marktwain
I live 15 miles from there. Ypsilanti is a rough little city known as "Ann Arbor's ghetto". They need CPL there.
15 posted on 04/11/2012 9:21:55 AM PDT by Darren McCarty (Time for brokered convention)
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