Posted on 05/30/2012 9:51:48 AM PDT by JohnKinAK
Do you believe that parents should be able to spank their children? Do you ever express that opinion to others? If so, then you could be sent to prison. Sadly, that is exactly what happened to one pastor up in Wisconsin recently. A minister named Philip Caminiti was sentenced to 2 years in prison for simply teaching that parents should spank their children when they misbehave. Please note that Caminiti was not accused of spanking anyone or of physically hurting anyone. He was put in prison simply for his speech. He was put in prison simply for what he was teaching others to do. Whether you agree with spanking or not, this should be incredibly sobering for all of us. Increasingly, speech is being penalized in the United States. Much of the time, the focus of the attacks by the forces of political correctness is on religious speech. If this trend continues, many of you that are reading this article might be put in jail for the things that you say in the coming years.
When many of us were growing up, once in a while our parents would take out a belt or a wooden paddle and give us a paddling on the behind when we did something wrong.
Was there anything wrong with that?
Of course not.
Yes, there is real child abuse that goes on out there, but in the vast majority of instances spanking does not do any lasting physical harm. Rather, it benefits the child because it helps them learn what is right and what is wrong.
I know that when I got a licking on the behind as a child that helped me to remember not to do the same thing again.
But Dane County Circuit Judge Maryann Sumi was absolutely horrified that some parents would actually use a wooden spoon to spank their little children when they misbehaved.
Perhaps that judge should actually try to spank someone with a wooden spoon some time. You simply cannot do much damage with a wooden spoon.
Instead of going after the parents who were doing the spanking, prosecutors chose to go after the pastor instead. They claimed that Caminiti was "the spoke in the wheel of this conspiracy".
Even after Caminiti leaves prison, he will be forbidden from having any contact with his old church....
Caminiti will be on extended supervision for six years after his release from prison. Despite objections on constitutional grounds by Caminiti's lawyers, Sumi ordered that he not have any contact with the Aleitheia Bible Church and have no leadership role in any church. What in the world is happening to this country?
Criminal predators are literally eating the faces off of people, and yet authorities want to go after pastors that are encouraging their congregations to follow the teachings of the Bible?
Have we stepped into a really bizarre episode of The Twilight Zone?
Sadly, this is not the only example of how our free speech is under attack these days.
Up in New York, a new bill was recently introduced that would outlaw all "mean-spirited and baseless political attacks".
I think that would cover a whole lot of people that leave comments on my blog.
The following is how a recent article by Kurt Nimmo described what this new law would require....
New York state government is attempting to pass the measure in both the Senate and the Assembly. The legislation has been referred to the Codes Committee in the Senate, and the Government Operations Committee in the Assembly.
Both proposals are identical and would effect messages posted on message boards, blogs, social networks, and “any other discussion site where people can hold conversations in the form of posted messages.” The law would require websites to post email addresses for “removal requests, clearly visible in any sections where comments are posted.” Those demanding the removal of content they find objectionable, however, would have their anonymity protected.
“Had the internet been around in the late 1700s, perhaps the anonymously written Federalist Papers would have to be taken down unless Alexander Hamilton, James Madison and John Jay revealed themselves,” notes David Kravets, writing for Wired. Will we soon see laws such as this nationwide?
Will all blogs and websites soon be at the mercy of the politically correct police?
Up in Buffalo, New York it is apparently now against the law to hand out Christian tracts on a public sidewalk. At least that is what one man was told recently when he attempted to hand out tracts outside of an Italian heritage festival. The following is from a recent WorldNetDaily article....
While handing out tracts to willing recipients on a public street during a public festival, Owen was approached by a police officer who declined to identify himself but told him that the Buffalo Police Department is “the law” and he should stop handing out tracts.
According to the lawsuit: “Subsequently, another police officer, Officer Slomka, arrived on the scene. She quickly informed Owen that they could not hand out tracts in the festival and explained that the prohibition was ‘by our orders.’ Owen asked for her name, and she replied: ‘Slomka, write it down.’ Owen advised that he believed the tracts to be free speech; nonplussed, Officer Slomka reiterated that they couldn’t hand out tracts there and had to go outside of the festival area to continue with their expressive activity.”
Then, “Owen inquired as to whether they would be arrested if they continued to hand out tracts in the festival area, to which, Officer Slomka replied: ‘Yes.’” That almost makes me angry enough to take a trip over to Buffalo and hand out tracts right outside the police station.
Even if you do not ever distribute literature, you should be alarmed at how our freedom of speech is being eroded.
The truth is that whenever anyone has their freedom of speech attacked it is an attack on all of us.
If we are not careful, we are going to end up just like Canada.
At one high school up in Canada recently, a student was suspended from school for a week for wearing a shirt with the following message....
"Life is wasted without Jesus" The student was told that the shirt was "hate talk" and that he would be suspended for the rest of the year if he tried to wear it to school again.
They are coming for our free speech ladies and gentlemen.
They are not going to be satisfied until they have either shut all of us up or put all of us in prison.
It is imperative that we all stand up for free speech while we still can. Once our freedom of speech is gone, the loss of the rest of our freedoms will only be a matter of time.
Caminiti’s charges allege that two of the children beaten by followers of his doctrine were only two months old. When the beatings were stopped by authorities in 2010, the oldest victim was only five years old.
I can't quite figure out how a two month-old child would deserve a beating.
“I can’t quite figure out how a two month-old child would deserve a beating. “
Under no circumstance.
Do you know what “conspiracy to commit child abuse” consists of?
I’d hardly hold up this conviction as abandonment of the Constitution. But if it suits your personal agenda....
Having relatives who are Ex-Amish, if this is what amounts to a conspiracy to commit child abuse then the Amish are in real trouble. They might as well send the SWAT teams out to every Amish community and arrest the parents and preachers for conspiracy today.
Here’s the dirty little secret you won’t find in any MSM article: This is really all about the State finding an excuse to take the kids from their parents and turn them over to the State Sponsored Pedophiles who are within the Child Protective Services.
“Caminiti would instruct church members and his own adult children to beat crying infants and toddlers with wooden spoons and dowels on their bare bottoms.”
That sounds like conspiracy to commit child abuse all right. I don’t see what’s so outrageous about the conviction. People who beat children—babies—are as bad as child molesters.
No, this is not a free speech case. This guy was not charged with "preaching" this sort of "discipline" to his congregation. He was chardged with and convicted of specifically instructing individual congregants on how to discipline children as young as two months old using a rod to inflict pain; those congregants agreed with him and then, in fact, used rods to discipline their children. Legally and Constitutionally, there is a huge difference between those two situations - the former is Constitutionally-protected speech and religious preaching, while the latter is a conspiracy to commit child abuse.
UM spanking and abuse are not equivalent. Half the time when I was spanked it didn’t hurt, and the other half of the time it didn’t hurt as badly even as stubbing my toe. For me, spanking was disapproval; spanking was being held accountable. The pain of spanking was the pain of knowing I had done wrong and the pain of being caught.
The worst part is that spanking is treated like an evil, and yet there are people out there openly advocating pedophilia as something normal and okay!! Freedom of speech for the babyrapers, but not for the Christians who say to discipline children? I guess spanking is only acceptable if its a pedo advocating it as part of a “valid” relationship with the children.
In the days of Noah, what was it like? Only 8 people were left who were righteous in the eyes of the Lord. There are more than 8 Christians out there and we are told that the end will be like the days of Noah. It’s going to get worse, people.
But Dane County Circuit Judge Maryann Sumi was absolutely horrified that some parents would actually use a wooden spoon to spank their little children when they misbehaved.
That judge needs a good spanking
***
Absolutely. I nominate John Wayne for the job.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T12-qzPW9Gg
” But then, if it DID happen 150 years ago, the judge and jailers would have to answer to an angry mob of armed American citizens and there would be no SWAT Teams or other sophisticated paramilitary forces there to protect them. “
Correct
The sad thing is every preacher from every church that believes in the Bible should have been speaking out against this. Unfortunately, I guess there aren’t enough churches who believe in the Bible. And there are many who do believe but are cowards.
People who beat children—babies—are as bad as child molesters.
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People who beat children - babies - ARE child molesters. One and the same.
Free speech and religious freedom is all fine and good until their freedom to practice their religion as they see fit goes against basic common sense and basic humanity and rules of a “civilized” society and the basic and fundamental Constitutional rights of others not to be beaten or abused in an egregious fashion.
He’s not advocating “spare the rod, spoil the child” in any sort of “biblical” or common sense sort of way. What he’s advocating is the beating with a wooden dowel of two month old infants for being “selfish” and doing what any normal two month old infant is prone to do, which is to cry sometimes.
I for one would like to take a rod to this asshat’s ass and beat him severely until he cries and pleads for mercy and then beat him some more for good measure.
How can any decent human being see and hold a two month old infant in their arms and think for even one moment that beating them is OK?
This is not a religious freedom case unless any of you here really think that advocating child abuse falls under the protection of religious freedom. Again, we are not talking about spanking an unruly child but beating a two month old infant with a wooden dowel for the egregious “crime” of crying.
I’m amazed and disappointed that some here are actually defending this monster.
And that verbal “instruction” is not protected as free speech, and it should constitute a conspiracy to commit child abuse, a criminal conviction, and jail time?
Hmmm. Think about that.
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The folks who actually had access to all of the facts, and were instructed on the relevant portions of Wisconsin law found the guy guilty in a hot minute.
Hmmm. Think about that.
Yep spanking is bad, and abortion is good. We indeed do live in a age where evil is good and good is evil.
Wisconsin judge jails pastor for telling parents they can spank their child
FReep Mail me if you want on, or off, this Wisconsin interest ping list. Judge Sumi rears her head again.
>>He essentially advocated beating children into submission because they were “exhibiting ‘selfish crying’,” according to what he told police.
Response:
So what? <<
And if a cult leader talked your son or daughter into committing suicide, no consequences? In Wisconsin, anyway? Just curious.
Free speech is a right, but rights come with responsibilities. This pastor abused his right, and is responsible for convincing people to abuse children. Very similar to yelling “fire” in a crowded theater.
Correct - no consequences. The chance you take to keep freedom of speech. Similarly I take a chance that some scumbag will shoot me every day (we all do), but I far rather take my chances with that than lose my 2nd amendment rights.
Free speech is a right, but rights come with responsibilities
Absolutely true, but you and I differ on what these responsibilities are. If the morons decided to heed his advice, then THEY are the ones at fault. Not him. The responsibility is to tell the truth. In this case he's neither telling the truth or a lie. He's expressing his (idiotic) opinion. If you believe some idiot's opinion, and act foolishly or criminally on his opinion when he doesn't, who's the idiot?
Very similar to yelling “fire” in a crowded theater.
TOTAL BS not in the least similar. One is based on a quick panic situation where you have to act immediately. The other is something you can think about and come to a conclusion on your own with plenty of time to contemplate the ramifications. Don't piss on my head and tell me it's raining.
I'm amazed and disappointed that so many people on a supposedly conservative forum are so abysmally ignorant of the constitution and what constitutes rights that they think it's a good thing to lock someone up for expressing an opinion, no matter how moronic the opinion. That my statist FRiend is the end of freedom, and you're advocating it.
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