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Futile remedies for mass shootings
Chicago Tribune ^ | 26 july 2012 | Steve Chapman

Posted on 07/26/2012 6:14:50 AM PDT by rellimpank

When someone is ill or anxious to avoid illness, he may be open to any possible treatments. That's why quack remedies, untested formulas and obvious placebos often find takers. When a mass shooting occurs, the urge to find a cure is powerful. As a rule, though, those that emerge are the practical equivalent of sugar pills.

A nation with very few guns, exceedingly tight firearms restrictions and little interest in such weaponry would not experience these atrocities as often as ours does. But in a society with hundreds of millions of guns and huge demand for them, as well as high rates of violent crime of all sorts, the challenge borders on the insurmountable.

The tactics used by the alleged killer in this case serve gun control supporters as a road map to what should be done. He had an AR-15 "assault weapon," proving we should prohibit these guns. He had a magazine that can hold 100 cartridges, dramatizing the need to restrict magazine capacity. He bought some 6,000 rounds over the Internet, suggesting that the government should outlaw large purchases or monitor anyone who makes them.

All these conclusions sound perfectly plausible. And none of them offers any prospect of averting the next massacre

(Excerpt) Read more at chicagotribune.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; News/Current Events; US: Illinois
KEYWORDS: banglist; chapman; rkba

1 posted on 07/26/2012 6:15:01 AM PDT by rellimpank
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To: rellimpank

Makes me decide I need to upgrade to a Veridian green laser/LED light under barrel attachment. And the smallest NVG goggles or monocular I can find.


2 posted on 07/26/2012 6:18:33 AM PDT by Eye of Unk (Going mobile, posts will be brief. No spellcheck for the grammar nazis.)
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To: Eye of Unk

If you are getting NVG, you can get an IR laser instead of the green. You’ll see the IR laser, maybe 808 or 850 nm, just fine with NVG, or any digital camera, and nobody without NVG will.


3 posted on 07/26/2012 6:22:41 AM PDT by DBrow
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To: rellimpank

On July 22 of last year, Norway’s mass murderer killed 77 teenagers at a youth camp. Norway has very strict gun laws. There is no way governments can prevent these evil outbursts unless it cages everyone.


4 posted on 07/26/2012 6:22:52 AM PDT by txrefugee
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To: rellimpank
If they pass the UN gun control treaty, and I refuse to register my firearms, will I be a criminal?

Like that poor lady in the white jacket?

Makes you wonder, don't it?

5 posted on 07/26/2012 6:23:35 AM PDT by Travis McGee (www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com)
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To: rellimpank

Laws only impact the law abiding.
If they had an impact on criminals, law breakers wouldn’t exist..

And the knee jerk reaction of liberals and idiots is.. make more laws.


6 posted on 07/26/2012 6:24:34 AM PDT by Darksheare (You will never defeat Bok Choy!)
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To: Travis McGee
Yesterday Obama called for reinstating the AWB, proof positive that the idiot has lost his mind with his campaign going down the tubes.

Bill Clowntoon already warned the dumba$$ what happens when RATS push gun control.

Mutt Romney will win in a landslide now and Dingy Harry can kiss the Senate goodbye.

7 posted on 07/26/2012 6:34:35 AM PDT by Beagle8U (Free Republic -- One stop shopping ....... It's the Conservative Super WalMart for news .)
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To: Darksheare

There was virtually no looting in Japan after the earthquake and tsunami. Is it because they have a law against it?


8 posted on 07/26/2012 6:51:03 AM PDT by Spok
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To: Spok

Their culture is different from ours.
They still, in most places, teach the concept of respect.
“That’s not yours” is still an understood concept over there.


9 posted on 07/26/2012 6:54:14 AM PDT by Darksheare (You will never defeat Bok Choy!)
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To: Spok

On the other hand, there is one hell of a lot of rape in Japan, and reporting it in their culture results in an even worse situation for the victim than suffering silently.

Japan is not a utopia by any stretch.


10 posted on 07/26/2012 7:23:27 AM PDT by MrEdd (Heck? Geewhiz Cripes, thats the place where people who don't believe in Gosh think they aint going.)
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To: rellimpank

We don’t need any lectures on “gun control” from a Chicago newspaper.

http://crimeinchicago.blogspot.com/

One hour ago: Chicago police were questioning several males this morning following a shooting during a home invasion on the city’s South Side.
Authorities said four or five males, all armed, forced entry into a home in the 1400 block of East 73rd St. in the Grand Crossing neighborhood at about 9:45 p.m.

The dirty secret of “gun control” is that it isn’t about guns: It’s about control.


11 posted on 07/26/2012 7:37:46 AM PDT by tumblindice (Sic Semper Tyrannis)
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To: DBrow
The salesmen claim the strobing green lasers are the hot ticket. They certainly are attention getters.

I thought the IR lasers were banned from “civilian” sales under Clinton and one needs a cop-shop P.O. for purchase. Has that restriction gone by the wayside? Definitely the hot set-up for night coyote shoots if one can get below their vision spectrum.

12 posted on 07/26/2012 7:39:04 AM PDT by kitchen (Over gunned is better than the alternative.)
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To: tumblindice

Check out ‘Detective Shaved Longcock’ for up to date muz about Chitown Crime!


13 posted on 07/26/2012 8:08:36 AM PDT by iopscusa (El Vaquero. (SC Lowcountry Cowboy))
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To: kitchen

It may be illegal to sell an IR laser sight, but the green module comes out, and many lasers come in standard sizes, typically 12 mm dia.

I’d worry that the bright green dot would mess up your NVG, way too contrasty.


14 posted on 07/26/2012 8:13:44 AM PDT by DBrow
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To: Beagle8U

“Mutt Romney will win in a landslide now”

He has to be careful, he signed an assault weapon ban into law that has a $10,000 penalty for possessing a mag with more than ten rounds (if made after the enactment date).

“These guns are not made for recreation or self-defense. They are instruments of destruction with the sole purpose of hunting down and killing people.” Mitt Romney, 2004


15 posted on 07/26/2012 8:21:57 AM PDT by DBrow
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To: Travis McGee
If they pass the UN gun control treaty, and I refuse to register my firearms, will I be a criminal?

No, you will be an outlaw.

In Praise of Outlaws.

16 posted on 07/26/2012 8:55:07 AM PDT by DuncanWaring (The Lord uses the good ones; the bad ones use the Lord.)
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To: DBrow
He has to be careful, he signed an assault weapon ban into law that has a $10,000 penalty for possessing a mag with more than ten rounds (if made after the enactment date).

I have said the same many times; that Romney signed a permanent AWB.

I was wrong!
You are wrong.

I am ashamed to say I got fooled by this narrative, but finally found this article by Jim Wallace of GOAL, the Mass. gun-owners rights lobby. This is the same lobby that stopped dead in its tracks the effort to ban all handguns in Mass. They are trustworthy.

I feel a little sheepish letting myself be fooled like that and hope to save others that feeling. P.
17 posted on 07/26/2012 12:34:52 PM PDT by Peet (Everything has an end -- only the sausage has two.)
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To: Peet

At the time, the Globe, Herald, and other papers reported that if the Fed AWB expired, the Massachusetts one would too, so action must be taken promptly. Both houses then handed Mitt an AWB, which he signed, and made the statement I quoted above.
Later, much later, the reporting now says that golly, the MA AWB would dot have expired so Mitt actually did not sign a permanent ban (though, oddly, he did sign the bill).

It’s clear from Romney’ signing statement that he does not like “assault weapons” and probably THOUGHT he was signing a permanent ban. All the reporting surrounding the event said so.

And the penalties for illegal possession of a normal size magazine is still pretty steep.


18 posted on 07/26/2012 12:49:35 PM PDT by DBrow
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To: Peet; DBrow

P.S. I forgot to add: The “large capacity” magazine restriction was in MGL CH180 passed into law in 1998. That was not Romney’s baby. Harshbarger had been pushing gun control for decades — CH180 was his bastard-child. It was signed by Paul Cellucci. CH180 is a classic example of an oppressive law that accomplished NOthing except to give power to politicians and bureaucrats.

Considering the major errors on your first paragraph, I’d sure like to see a source for the “quote” you posted. (With all due respect, I really am curious.)

My sources:

http://www.malegislature.gov/Laws/SessionLaws/Acts/1998/Chapter180

http://www.keepandbeararms.com/newsarchives/XcNewsPlus.asp?cmd=view&articleid=34


19 posted on 07/26/2012 12:50:52 PM PDT by Peet (Everything has an end -- only the sausage has two.)
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To: DBrow

At the time, the Globe, Herald, and other papers reported that if the Fed AWB expired, the Massachusetts one would too, so action must be taken promptly. Both houses then handed Mitt an AWB, which he signed, and made the statement I quoted above.


Clearly you didn’t read the article at the link I posted, so let me excerpt for you:

“Press and media stories around the country got it completely wrong when claimed the bill was an extension of the “assault weapon” ban that had sunset at the federal level.”


and if you read my reference links in my followup post, you’ll see the (so-called) assault weapons ban is in CH180 passed in 1998 and signed by Celluci.

BBBBBZZZZZZZzzzzztttt

All your data are incorrect. (Unless you have a good source for that “quote.”)

Sorry...


20 posted on 07/26/2012 1:10:31 PM PDT by Peet (Everything has an end -- only the sausage has two.)
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To: Peet

There are no errors, Romney signed a bill that included an assault weapons ban, and it is permanent. Was it temporary, or not an AWB? I was wrong about the mag ban, that was in the CH180, agreed. There is a quote below from Mitt that explains why he, as a staunch supporter of the Second Amendment, did not change or challenge CH180.

Quotes:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_positions_of_Mitt_Romney

www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2846204/posts

http://www.usnews.com/news/blogs/ballot-2012/2012/04/13/mitt-romney-and-the-nra-uneasy-bedfellows

http://m.npr.org/news/front/150497961?singlePage=true
This one also has “We do have tough gun laws in Massachusetts. I support them. I won’t chip away at them. I believe they help protect us and provide for our safety,” as well as

“As Massachusetts governor, Romney also signed a bill making the state’s temporary assault weapons ban permanent. “These guns are not made for recreation or self-defense. They are instruments of destruction with the sole purpose of hunting down and killing people,” Romney said at the signing ceremony.”

http://www.iberkshires.com/story/14812/Romney-signs-off-on-permanent-assault-weapons-ban.html

http://www.sciforums.com/Mitt-Romney-poser-Republican-signs-MA-state-AWB-into-law-t-38517.html

http://www.factcheck.org/2011/11/flipping-through-dnc-playbook-on-romney/
This has “I just signed a piece of legislation extending the ban on certain assault weapons.” And indeed, on July 1, 2004, he signed a law making a state ban permanent and also issued a news release calling assault weapons “instruments of destruction” used only for “killing people.”

So this statement from Mitt saying he “extended the ban” means he thought (erroneously according to Wallace), that he was extending the ban beyond the expiration of the Fed law.
This link reiterates “These guns are not made for recreation or self-defense. They are instruments of destruction with the sole purpose of hunting down and killing people.”, sourcing it as a Romney news release.

You get the idea. I got over 100,000 Google hits when I typed the quote in exactly. I’m surprised you never heard of it.


21 posted on 07/26/2012 1:19:08 PM PDT by DBrow
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To: Peet

Show me news reports from before July 1 2004 explaining that the bill was NOT a permanent AWB to cover the expiration of the Fed AWB, please.

You will find that they all refer to the need for an extension of the state ban.

As I said, years after the ban was signed there were articles stating that the AWB signed into law by Mitt Romney was not actually a permanent ban.

In other words, when I said “At the time, the Globe, Herald, and other papers reported that if the Fed AWB expired, the Massachusetts one would too, so action must be taken promptly. Both houses then handed Mitt an AWB, which he signed, and made the statement I quoted above.”, it’s correct, prove it otherwise. You have to go back to before July 1, 2004.


22 posted on 07/26/2012 1:32:54 PM PDT by DBrow
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To: Peet

“I believe the people should have the right to bear arms, but I don’t believe that we have to have assault weapons as part of our personal arsenal...” Romney on Fox News in 2004

http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2012/07/20/romney-once-supported-assault-weapons-ban/

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2011/nov/29/democratic-national-committee/dnc-ad-accuses-mitt-romney-flip-flopping-assault-w/

In the Hannity and Colmes clip, guest co-host Pat Halpin asked Romney about the existing federal assault weapons ban, which was then on a path to expiring due to intentional Republican inaction. “So are you in favor of that ban being extended or do you want to see it lapse?”

Romney responded, “I believe the people should have the right to bear arms, but I don’t believe that we have to have assault weapons as part of our personal arsenal. … In my state I just signed a piece of legislation extending the ban on certain assault weapons in our state.”

There are only about 1400 hits for the Fox quote. Do you find it odd that Romney thought the Massachusetts ban was expiring? He once again says he “extended” the Massachusetts ban. How could he have been so wrong?


23 posted on 07/26/2012 2:21:11 PM PDT by DBrow
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To: rellimpank
A nation with very few guns, exceedingly tight firearms restrictions and little interest in such weaponry would not experience these atrocities as often as ours does.

I stopped reading right there.

When did we start allowing children to write commentary for grownups?

24 posted on 07/26/2012 11:54:58 PM PDT by publius911 (Formerly Publius 6961, formerly jennsdad)
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To: rellimpank
Just this year, three people were killed in separate incidents within line of sight of my storefront window. None were killed with a gun, as they were all traffic accidents on bright sunny and clear days. I don't know how many injuries there were, probably a few. All on one little stretch of road, which means that in the entire country such deaths are common enough to be routine and do not get reported outside of a local paper. Sometimes not even then. Deaths like these, which don't involve guns at all, just some unfortunte inattentiveness on the part of drivers or pedestrians, dwarf these massacres.

In fact, islamic suicide bombings dwarf US gun massacres, so much so the press has deemed most unnewsworthy.

Even before 9/11, IIRC, the annual number of bombings by assorted crazies in the US topped 500 cases a year, yet almost all of them go unreported in national news.

The number of abortions per week in the US is on the order of thousands and in each and every case the victims are innocent and unable to speak in their defense, and unlike our massacre perp, none of them will be represented by a lawyer or be granted a fair trial and the person who hired the hitman will never have to look at a photo of the victim. The human babies won't even be given a decent burial, not even as good a sendoff as the average American gives to a dead dog or cat. This is just a guess but I suspect the number of murders by baseball bat or other blunt object in our cities in a given week outnumber those by gun massacre in Colorado.

The same left that wants to throw away an amendment to the Constitution in an effort to deprive law abiding citizens of their rights is the same left that clamours to give constitutional rights to noncitizen terrorists overseas. The same left that cries crocodile tears over murder in Aurora callously murders defenseless babes, and sheds not a tear over murdered filling station employees or over people killed in leftist riots such as we saw in Los Angeles years ago. This is the same left whose folk heroes beat a black man because he was a tea partier, and whose heroes stood armed with clubs at polls in Ohio to supress voting, and whose heroes have built bombs to blow up soldiers at Ft. Dix before going on to become leftist college profs.

They can shove their crocodile tears and their false outrage where the sun doesn't shine.

25 posted on 07/27/2012 12:36:00 AM PDT by piasa (Attitude adjustments offered here free of charge)
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To: publius911

—my suggestion would be to read the last sentence in the post, then the rest of the article—


26 posted on 07/27/2012 6:17:30 AM PDT by rellimpank (--don't believe anything the media or government says about firearms or explosives--)
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