Posted on 10/08/2012 7:10:12 PM PDT by markomalley
Collective bargaining is a matter of free association, once considered an unalienable right in this country. The real problem is not the existence of unions, it is union monopoly. If unions had to compete for business, they would behave far differently.
My greatgrandfather was a union organizer for the International Workers of the World - the Wobblies. You don’t have to instruct me about unions and why they exist.
What I’m talking about is the proposition’s bullet #3: Override state laws that regulate hours and conditions of employment to the extent that those laws conflict with collective bargaining agreements.
This is blatantly anti-American, as it strips the voting public of law-making ability and elevates union power above those of the citizenry.
This is blatantly anti-American, as it strips the voting public of law-making ability and elevates union power above those of the citizenry.
Of course it is. I prefer to look toward real solutions to get people talking about them. It's long past time to revisit the NRLA.
Public employees should not be allowed to collectively negotiate wages and benefits.
“It’s long past time to revisit the NRLA.”
Agreed!
Yes, but the law works differently in Communist China.
In Communist China, unions are legal, and often membership is required, but the "union" is not operated for the benefit of the union members, nor for the benefit of (and here's the real difference) the local, national and international Union Bosses. The union is operated for the benefit of the few highly placed members of the Communist Party inner circle.
These "Communists" are very rich elites that collect shakedown "partnership" profits from the people who actually built and run the factories (often foreigners).
The unions are operated to ensure smooth, high productivity operations at minimum cost for labor and benefits.
Unions in Communist China protect the state (which is one of the partners in the business that employs the workers), from the workers, and they do a very good job of it, as the workers in China generally perform highly productive, skilled work for very low wages, and very long hours.
Unions in the United States, and Communist China are highly similar in that they are both based on the same Marxist philosophy and Communist principles of organization and operation.
The important difference is that in China the elite don't allow the fat cat local and regional thug union bosses any riches or power, nor do they fund any international union activities anymore (why pay when ya don't have to and the useful idiots will keep on workin' for ya for free?).
In short, everybody in the union (including the bosses) gets screwed (and executed when necessary), for the benefit of the Communist insider elite who are oligarchs in reality, the 1% ultra rich (pretty much like the DemoRat elite in the US).
The important difference is the Commies have learned not to take too much from the factory owners (that would put them out of business and kill the golden goose), while the US DemoRat union thug bosses have not learned that lesson yet.
As far as your worry over collective bargaining rights, there are only two things you need to remember:
Required union membership=Communist tyranny
Required Right To Work, free from union intimidation=Free Market Liberty
Choose one.
My post was a sarcastic reference to US Communists (reference my tagline), not Chinese ones, however, Chinese Communists do operate within the law.
Exactly. Tyranny.
Good, let it pass. That’s federalism - the ability of each individual state to succeed or fail, thus providing a laboratory of proof of concept.
Imagine if all the liberal states had to stand on their own without the fedgov passing the same inane laws across the nation. They’d have to remain competitive. Federal overreach has covered their errors.
Here in IL our Gov. Pat Quinn’s solution to more than a half century of overspending is a federal bailout of our state. How’s that for thinking outside the box?
Yet they are selling it with claims that it will allow for firefighters to get equipment and will ensure that schools don’t hire child molesters.
The unions are sick, yet I fear they are fooling a lot of the populace. If this proposal passes, I will need to consider leaving this state.
Completely agree
Guess what? That is on the ballot again this time, and if it passes it be in the constitution and never go away.
“Question: In Michigan, is a simple majority on a ballot enough to cause an amendment, or is a super-majority needed either by public or State Legislature vote?”
Simple majority! It is scary indeed.
If it passes in MI, and I fear that it will, then it will be brought to many more states. This is the first state in a long line of Dominos!
The truth is the union leadership knows the majority of people don’t want/need a union. They know that means a end to their six-figure salaries for doing nothing. They need to protect that.
I doubt it... or they could of done it ages ago.
Actually, I'm enjoying the discussion and the thoughtful points made by others. You should join in the discussion. I would think being alone in the school yard would be, well, lonely for you.
Let's start. I view the right to organize as a basic freedom and a conservative view. I don't look at the results of the process as cause to curtail rights. In my conservative mind, you find out where the process has broken down and fix it. I view the process as having broken down by the corrupt politicians that accepted campaign contributions and then compromised the best interest of the public.
Again, please, join the discussion. FR is about conservative friends discussing positions. I've taken a contrarian view, I realize that and I certainly dont' expect everyone to agree with it. It is just a little difficult to deal with "nan na nah na na na" as a rebuttal.
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