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Armed civilians attempting to intervene are actually more likely to increase the bloodshed, says Hargarten, "given that civilian shooters are less likely to hit their targets than police in these circumstances." (Dr. Stephen Hargarten is a source cited in the Mother Jones article.)

A chaotic scene in August at the Empire State Building put this starkly into perspective when New York City police officers confronting a gunman wounded nine innocent bystanders.

It makes more sense edited that way with respect to the NYPD's Annie Oakleys.

Mother Jones sounds as trustworthy as ACORN. The moonbats and BS media are out in force.

1 posted on 12/27/2012 2:48:32 PM PST by neverdem
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To: neverdem

Even if true, it matters not one iota to me. My interest is in protecting myself, my family, and my property.


33 posted on 12/27/2012 3:47:29 PM PST by brewcrew
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To: neverdem

Don’t forget the recent mall shooter that killed himself after he saw a CC holder drawing down on him. Then there was the guy that had to run 1,000+ feet to get his gun and get the drop on the shooter at a college out in TN (I think) a couple years ago. Of course, there is the all time favorite of the armed impromptu posse of Texas boys with deer rifles that helped pin down and take out Charles Whitman back in the early 1960’s.

Go back a century or more and most all the bad guys got taken out with the trash by John Q. Public.


34 posted on 12/27/2012 3:47:36 PM PST by WorkingClassFilth
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To: neverdem

Unarmed civilians have stopped just as many elephant rampages in malls as armed civilians have, therefore, guns aren’t necessary. /s


35 posted on 12/27/2012 3:48:03 PM PST by Right Wing Assault (Dick Obama is more inexperienced now than he was before he was elected.)
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To: neverdem
Don't bother to try and reason or give substantiated facts to a liberal regarding guns. There is NO argument you can give them that will make them face the truth and stop leading with their bleeding hearts and peace rhetoric.

I've been arguing this point since I was in my teens in the 60's and said to a peacenik hippie: "If you came across a thug in an alley and he had a weapon and you had a weapon, would you actually lay yours down first hoping he would do the same?" The dipshit said, "Yes, peace brother."

From that day on I knew there are some people who just don't deserve to live and I'm ok if they just die yesterday (we all do). Even with their best of intentions, their rhetoric and behavior embolden the bad guys against the rest of us who would defend our lives, our family, our friends and our Country.

Liberals, socialists, Marxists, and communists are a bain on civilization as we have seen and still seeing. Imperialists were just as bad, but those days are long past except for parts of Africa. Now it's not so much about conquering, but about ideology and who gets what (not too far from the communes of the 60's). There are countless books with millions of pages that have said what I just expressed above. But then I'm not a scholar, but I have stayed at a Holiday Inn.

36 posted on 12/27/2012 3:49:05 PM PST by A Navy Vet (An Oath is Forever.)
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To: neverdem

How are “Law Abiding Armed Citizens” supposed to stop these shootings if they cannot bring their guns into these gun free zones...?


40 posted on 12/27/2012 4:07:55 PM PST by GraceG
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To: neverdem
Apr. 2012 Aurora, Colorado church shooting - one dead plus the perp. An off-duty cop who was a member of the congregation saved the day.

One could argue that an off-duty cop is not a civilian but he was there as a civilian and not serving as a LEO. Furthermore, he was related to the shooting victim so consider that a family member makes the save of others. Consider, too, the wealth of restrictions on concealed carry that make it more likely a random person in the crowd who is carrying may be a LEO. That is a pretty high percentage in some jurisdictions.

43 posted on 12/27/2012 4:20:44 PM PST by NonValueAdded (If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, you've likely misread the situation.)
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To: neverdem

Seems like someone forgot about Mr. Whitman in the bell tower at UT.

As the police came to the scene of the ongoing shootings, many students simply went to their cars and pulled out their rifles and joined in shooting at him.

I can’t remember if the bullet (or bullets) that killed him were cops or civilians. However these students firing their guns at him probably saved countless lives.


44 posted on 12/27/2012 4:24:49 PM PST by DH (Once the tainted finger of government touches anything the rot begins)
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To: neverdem
One is that when armed civilians are present, they often stop mass shootings before they can become mass shootings...well, duh - this is the same falacy we used to face in showing that under the right circumstances hospitalizing the mentally ill can cut down on their violent acts - "But they aren't violent" screamed the critics - of course - but if you suspect they might be and hospitalize them, that short circuits the behavior......
46 posted on 12/27/2012 4:43:59 PM PST by Intolerant in NJ
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To: neverdem

We have an NRA decal on our front window. No crime or break-ins.

Where’s THAT empirical study?

And a report I remember says criminals won’t break in homes with U.S. FLAGS (= patriotic, therefore vets, cops, loyal Americans), so guns - AND flags - protect people.


47 posted on 12/27/2012 5:04:32 PM PST by 4Liberty (Some on our "Roads & Bridges" head to the beach. Others head to their offices, farms, libraries....)
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To: neverdem

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pearl_High_School_shooting


50 posted on 12/27/2012 6:43:13 PM PST by A. Patriot (Re-electing Obama is like the Titanic backing up to hit the iceberg again.)
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To: neverdem

An armed citizen put an end to the serial rapist/murderer Wayne Nance.


52 posted on 12/27/2012 6:46:30 PM PST by blueunicorn6 ("A crack shot and a good dancer")
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To: neverdem; All

The Tyler, Texas courthouse shooting(s)...

After the initial gunfire played out, a resident (civilian, non LEO) nearby heard and responded to the gunfire armed with his .45 handgun...

Nevermind he was a highly trained and holder of a Texas CHL license...

This person engaged the rifle bearing individual and soon discovered that that person was wearing resistant armor and subsequently was shot and killed in doing so...

But, IIRC, that was enough of a distraction to force the criminal to cease his attack and flee the area, only to be stopped and shot and killed nearby after a short car chase...

Just another example, to the best of my recollection of another semi-successful armed citizen doing what they felt to be the right thing at the right time, and paid for it with their life...

Something I believe some of us would have done the same thing, but not expecting to run up against this type of preparation by this criminal in the first place, unfortunate, but it should be something that we who take the issue serously enough, should be mindful of if we deside to intervene in...

By the way, IIRC, the CHL’er did hit the suspect several times, and had just begun to reload as the criminal began firing back and murdering this hero (in my opinion)...

I believe the exact account is in the archives of Free Republic from a few years ago...A good discussion on it as well...


55 posted on 12/28/2012 12:31:23 AM PST by stevie_d_64 (It's not the color of one's skin that offends people...it's how thin it is.)
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To: neverdem

56 posted on 12/28/2012 1:21:18 AM PST by Yosemitest (It's Simple ! Fight, ... or Die !)
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