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Why Do Americans--Especially Among the Contemporary Elite--Believe Their Country is Evil?
Rubin Reports ^ | 1/30/'13 | Barry Rubin

Posted on 02/06/2013 12:48:18 PM PST by Zionist Conspirator

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To: discostu
No I’m getting it just fine, you’re not understanding what I’m saying.

You're right. I don't.

Doesn't mean you're wrong; just that I can't quite get it.

21 posted on 02/06/2013 1:30:23 PM PST by Zionist Conspirator (Ki-hagoy vehamamlakhah 'asher lo'-ya`avdukh yove'du; vehagoyim charov yecheravu!)
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To: Zionist Conspirator
I've pondered the same question for years. My answer, and it's a simple one, is that America and its founding belief system is the last remaining barrier to world socialism.

The undermining of America by the Marxists began in the 1920s and they were firmly entrenched in media and academia by the 1930s, where they have remained and grown tremendously in strength and influence. After WWII the U.N. was to be the organizational force of this New World Order and it was so structured by FDR's hand-picked man, proven Communist Agent Alger Hiss. Hiss and the U.N.

Several generations of American kids have been carefully taught to loathe their own country. I saw on Fox News just this morning that a new on-line history course approved for 825 school districts in Texas (of all places!) depicts the original Boston Tea party as a terrorist act!

22 posted on 02/06/2013 1:31:15 PM PST by Bernard Marx
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To: Zionist Conspirator

You said you’re scared to death of your government, which is of course good and right and proper, now put your brain in the monolith space. Stop thinking of the government as separate, it’s America, and you’re scared of it. That one little dividing line you erect in your brain that helps you keep the concept of the government separate from the concept of the country is the only thing that keeps you from thinking the country is evil. Erase that line and you’re just like the elites.

And we all do it periodically. Some of us have certain separations we’re good at maintaining but there’s always some we can’t handle. Ever complain about America’s behavior on Black Friday? Ever stop to think that only about 10% of the country actually goes shopping on Black Friday so it’s really not America as a country going all bargain crazy? Really any time you’ve ever complained about our culture as a whole you’re doing the same thing, taking the actions of what’s probably a small chunk of America and casting it as the whole country. I do it and I’ve actually spent time studying this phenomenon so I should know better. But I still have a human brain and it still gravitates to monoliths.


23 posted on 02/06/2013 1:39:16 PM PST by discostu (I recommend a fifth of Jack and a bottle of Prozac)
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To: Zionist Conspirator

Once we began aborting our own babies in 1973 at the rate of 1.5 million per year, we lost the ability to stand on the high ground.

We no longer had the moral authority to fight back.

That’s what happened.


24 posted on 02/06/2013 1:47:53 PM PST by donna (Pray for revival.)
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To: Zionist Conspirator

In 1965, we changed the immigration rules and started letting in millions of third worlders who were only here for money and/or to escape the hellholes they came from. They had no desire to be Americans in the way that European immigrants of the past did. We encouraged them not to assimilate. We catered to them and their demands never to be “offended.” This is a big reason, perhaps the main reason, for the changes the author speaks of. But it is the elephant in the living room that no one wants to discuss.


25 posted on 02/06/2013 1:49:21 PM PST by Nea Wood (When life gets too hard to stand, kneel.)
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To: Zionist Conspirator
Now as before, they believe that the country doesn't live up to its or their ideals. Probably no country could. Most likely they don't live up to those ideals either.

But this is a little off:

While Europeans are aware of their colonialist past, their guilt trip is far more limited. Why is that? On the surface, they have America and Israel to claim as real villains—scapegoats whose condemnation banishes European guilt-- but there is more to it than that.

One thing is that the United States can be said to be, in Marxist terms, a settler colonial society. But Latin American societies are based on far more deliberate and systematic genocide of the original inhabitants. Specific tales can be told of specific, usually small-scale massacres in America or the exile of the Cherokee. But in Spain’s colonies in the new world, there were deliberate massive killings, including—unlike the United States—of those who never attacked the Europeans or even fought wars against them.

The strange thing is that it doesn't "banish European guilt." Blaming somebody else may have the psychological effect of making it easier to go on living by scapegoating somebody else, but the people in Europe who are most against the US or Israel still feel pretty guilty about their imperialist past, at least in Northern Europe.

And I'm not sure about the rest which seems to be manipulative, distorting history to lead readers to the opinion the writer decided on in advance. Latin Americans (many of whom are of Indian descent) would look at this differently, as might North American Indians.

PS: Nothing about Lew Rockwell? Every day they tell why they think the United States (the government at least) is awful and evil.

26 posted on 02/06/2013 1:57:03 PM PST by x
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To: donna

“We no longer had the moral authority to fight back.”

You’re right; we export the evil by setting up puppet governments that try break up cultures with “women’s rights” (not in the generic sense, but strictly in terms of child-murder). The puppet government in Afghanistan is required to have a certain number of female members; we don’t even allow that nonsense here.


27 posted on 02/06/2013 2:01:05 PM PST by kearnyirish2 (Affirmative action is economic war against white males (and therefore white families).)
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To: Zionist Conspirator

12 YEARS OF GODLESS, HUMANIST GOVERNMENT SCHOOLING!!!!

It’s a long existing problem the sane adults in this country had better solve while there MAY still be time.

To leave things as they are is to invite another, more tyrannical Obama into our lives.

It will NOT be pretty!!


28 posted on 02/06/2013 2:18:08 PM PST by Dick Bachert ("Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not." T. Jefferson)
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To: Zionist Conspirator

Answer: They are almost all educated by a system that has been taken over by Marxists and other social;ist variants. They no longer learn about the founders except that they were eeevil white, slave owning rich guys.


29 posted on 02/06/2013 2:29:23 PM PST by JimRed (Excise the cancer before it kills us; feed &water the Tree of Liberty! TERM LIMITS, NOW & FOREVER!)
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To: JimRed

My take is that the Left is as Puritan as the originals once were, they simply deny it. Thus, you have a Marxist worldview allied to a religious fervor that sees all “imperfections” in this country as something to be purged from humanity, by force if necessary. Leftists remind me of Shia’s who physically scold themselves with whips until they bleed, but because they have no true religion to teach them that all earthly things are imperfect, they never really learn. Consequently, they try again and again to perfect the imperfectable, causing more problems.


30 posted on 02/06/2013 2:56:00 PM PST by Amberdawn
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To: JimRed

My take is that the Left is as Puritan as the originals once were, they simply deny it. Thus, you have a Marxist worldview allied to a religious fervor that sees all “imperfections” in this country as something to be purged from humanity, by force if necessary. Leftists remind me of Shia’s who physically scold themselves with whips until they bleed, but because they have no true religion to teach them that all earthly things are imperfect, they never really learn. Consequently, they try again and again to perfect the imperfectable, causing more problems.


31 posted on 02/06/2013 2:58:12 PM PST by Amberdawn
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To: Zionist Conspirator
Why Do Americans--Especially Among the Contemporary Elite--Believe Their Country is Evil?

They don't believe any such thing - because they don't believe anything at all.

Conservatives have an absolutely deadly blindness problem to what they are up against. Conservatives think for themselves, and they project this upon an enemy who doesn't. The very essence of collectivism is not thinking for oneself, not believing in anything at all, except what you are told to believe - and dropping that for something else on a dime when you are told to.

Collectivists hate America because that is wha they are told to do. Each one of them would march alongside Marines fighting communism and show the utmose courage in standing up for freedom, too - IF that's what the collective told them to do.

Collectivists have abandoned their souls. They have refused the very meaning of life itself. They use all of their intelligence and loyalty and heart and love to obey, obey, obey the collective - that is their only focus, their only God.

Collectivists are morally and spiritually depraved to a level that most people cannot even grasp - and they use that blindness to great advantage. That Democrat mom walking down the street with her child is NOT a loving mother - she is obeying collectivist orders to wear those clothes, walk in that place at that time, and treat her breeding offfering to the collective in a certain way - and she is doing it.

You think I exaggerate? Then explain - really explain - Obama's and Hillary's popularity.

Without this explanation, you can't.

32 posted on 02/06/2013 3:25:30 PM PST by Talisker (One who commands, must obey.)
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To: discostu
The fact is in the 60s and 70s (and really in the 50s but we didn’t find out about that stuff until much later) America went on a tact that was at the very least sneaky and dishonest, and you could make an argument that it was down right evil. And it’s never really recovered, we’re always doing something sleazy to somebody, we keep getting in unpopular ill defined wars, aligning ourselves with seriously bad people, and electing tax and spend liberals. Anybody that doesn’t think that a large portion of our government has a strong evil bent is really not paying attention. Americans are still by and large good people, our government is scum.

Except, for the most part, the people who were promoting and doing these sleazy things are the very people who now bemoan our national history.

It was liberals who involved us in Viet Nam. It was liberals who accused Nixon of doing what their own leaders routinely did. It was liberals who directed and managed the CIA. Ivy League-educated liberals

And it is Ivy League-educated liberals who claim that the country is unworthy today.

Thus, it is self-hatred -- predicated on an arrogance that they are the only ones who count. <

An attitude that is endemic among liberals...

33 posted on 02/06/2013 3:29:20 PM PST by okie01 (The Mainstream Media: IGNORANCE ON PARADE)
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To: Zionist Conspirator

“Why should the United States be considered the most evil country in history, and by its own elites?”

Because America has been the greatest hope for Freedom that the planet has ever hosted. America worked. America was right. That drives them CRAZY.


34 posted on 02/06/2013 3:38:42 PM PST by TalBlack (Evil doesn't have a day job.)
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To: edcoil
"lawyer"

Many or most of the sixties radical feminsists grew up in upper middle class or well to do homes. They were born with many more advantages than the great majority of the males they maligned. Some of the most rabid, anti-American rhetoric oozed out of the radical feminists movement along with tremendous hatred of men. They managed to infect millions of the succeeding generations of females that life was horrible for them despite having more material advantages than any group of women in the world. Why they hated/hate the country that gave/gives them so much is a mystery to me.

35 posted on 02/06/2013 3:50:47 PM PST by driftless2
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To: discostu
"down right evil"

Are you sure you're on the right forum? Start naming all those evil things.

36 posted on 02/06/2013 3:53:05 PM PST by driftless2
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To: Zionist Conspirator
the hegemonic elite in the United States today has largely achieved something never done elsewhere: it has convinced itself and a large portion of the country’s youth that America’s whole history is evil.

It's an Anglo-Saxon "thing". The Brits preceded the US into self-hatred.

It's success that's being sneered at. Ayn Rand termed it "the hatred of the good for being good".

37 posted on 02/06/2013 4:44:37 PM PST by BfloGuy (Money, like chocolate on a hot oven, was melting in the pockets of the people.)
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To: Bernard Marx

FEMA training in 2001 explaining that the Founders were terrorists

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=oGZjR9NIHJk

Accept the possibility the instructors words are taken out of context.

Now consider the vaguest uttering of a public figure that might be construed as racist/islamophobic/pro-life or homophobic and tell me how much time passes before apologies are rendered.

The video of that class is dated 2001. It’s been around the block a couple of times and I don’t remember hearing a FEMA apology or a clarification about it, yet.

American Loathing 101 is taught everywhere our domestic enemies drag their reptilian tails.


38 posted on 02/06/2013 4:55:13 PM PST by MurrietaMadman
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To: Zionist Conspirator

“Then why don’t the liberals hate Armenia and Ethiopia? Why just the USA?”

Because it is the Christian civilization in the USA (and at one time Europe) that stands in their way.


39 posted on 02/07/2013 6:51:55 AM PST by PetroniusMaximus
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To: driftless2

There isn’t time to name ALL the evil things. Here’s a few goodies though:
project paper clip
Viet Nam (wouldn’t have been evil if we’d actually wanted to win, but we didn’t, and getting into a war you don’t want to win is probably the most evil thing you can do)
at least half a dozen times we inspired people to revolt against their government and doing nothing to back them (again the whole not wanting to win thing)
backing the Shah
backing Marcos
backing Duvalier
we backed a lot of really bad people during the Cold War

And that’s just the 50s, 60s and 70s. We haven’t even gotten into “Iranian Moderates”, abandoning Afghanistan to a decade of chaos after helping kick out Russia, Clinton’s adventure with Haitian dictators, and Obamacare. Our government’s done a lot of evil.


40 posted on 02/07/2013 7:17:52 AM PST by discostu (I recommend a fifth of Jack and a bottle of Prozac)
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