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Posted on 04/04/2013 6:47:18 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet
Thousands of Americans are sent to jail not for committing a crime, but because they can't afford to pay for traffic tickets, medical bills and court fees.
If that sounds like a debtors' prison, a legal relic which was abolished in this country in the 1830s, that's because it is. And courts and judges in states across the land are violating the Constitution by incarcerating people for being unable to pay such debts.
Ask Jack Dawley, 55, an unemployed man in Ohio who between 2007 and 2012 spent a total of 16 days in jail in a Huron County lock-up for failing to pay roughly $1,500 in legal fines he'd incurred in the 1990s. The fines stemmed from Dawley's convictions for driving under the influence and other offenses. After his release from a Wisconsin correctional facility, Dawley, who admits he had struggled with drugs and alcohol, got clean. But if he put his substance problems behind him, Dawley's couldn't outrun his debts.
Struggling to find a job and dealing with the effects of a back injury, he fell behind on repayments to the municipal court in Norwalk, Ohio. He was arrested six years ago and sent to jail for not paying his original court fines. Although Dawley was put on a monthly payment plan, during his latest stint behind bars in 2012 the court ordered him to pay off his entire remaining debt.
" I called my brother, and they told him I have to pay off the whole fine in order for me to get out," he said. "That was $900. So I sat my whole 10 days [in jail.]"
Such stories are by no means unusual. Rather, they reflect a justice system that in effect criminalizes poverty....
(Excerpt) Read more at cbsnews.com ...
People who loan out money foolishly deserve to lose it. Get some collateral idiot or don’t loan the money out! The Fed’s Easy Money, Loose Money, Bailouts, Too Big To Fail is all Pure Satanic Evil my friend!
In Ohio if you pay each medical debt an amount of $5 by check each month you are fine. My parents owed over 3 million dollars and it took several years before a medical malpractice ca$e was won that took care of the entire amount (lawyers took over 1/3). This guy deserves what happened to him; there is no way he did not know but he probably wa angry and refused to pay anything at all. His mistake.
I don’t understand the point being made here. It’s ALWAYS been the case that if a judge fines you and you don’t pay you go to jail. You go to jail just for calling the judge a moron! I personally believe you SHOULD go to debtor’s prison if you fail to meet your obligations - such as child support, paying back welfare fraud, etc. Credit cards not so much unless they charged a reasonable interest rate.
Just as I said, if they can not or will not pay back the money they took they should go to prison. And the person who is owed the money must be satisfied with the punishment inflicted upon the thief in lew of repayment.
You are assuming the person goes to jail and ALSO must repay the money. I am suggesting they should go to jail instead of repaying the money.
Sounds like your brother in law needs to get a good lawyer and sue.
I seem to remember something Jesus said...
oh yeah!
Render onto Ceasar was is Ceasar’s.
Difference is you were stupid enough to loan them money, in a burglary they took it without your consideration.
Let’s just charge gasoline, electricity, (bad)food, etc. based on a person’s income. That will deter those evil rich people from ruining the environment.
That has been a sore spot with me all along. If you are arrested and not enough evidence is supported to even keep you arrested you still face court costs, vehicle impounding, and bail. In cases like this one the defendants deserves 100% reclamation back to the state they were in at moment of arrest. It is asinine in situations like this that this person faces several thousands of dollars or incidental costs and probably without his job.
Ah but there’s a difference. The State has control over the cost of fines for breaking commonly agreed laws. They dont (or at least they shouldnt) have any control of the price of anything else.
Although it might be considered a mitigating circumstance when it comes to the length of punishment (much the same as a robbery committed with a gun is punished more harshly than one without), but in no way should it negate the need for punishment.
Every effort should be made to allow the debtor to repay the debt first, even if that means substantially lengthening the original length of the loan. BUT, if he refuses, then he is basically choosing jail instead in lieu of repayment.
Without the ability to punish contumacious behavior, civil court orders would be mere advisory opinions. The poor, poor man who stars in this story apparently was able to find enough money to buy drugs and alcohol, just not enough to comply with the court order.
I specifically chose disorderly conduct as the charge because there are generally no damages to property or persons involved — otherwise the charge would be vandalism or assault, not disorderly conduct.
We were considering fines, not compensatory damages. In the case of compensatory damages, justice for the victim (owner of the property destroyed, or person incurring medical bills due to the assault) demands compensation for the cost of the damages. Fines, however, are simple punishment — the perpetrator is deprived of money by the state in retribution for a misdeed and a discouragement against its repetition. The $1000 fine plus court costs is severe retribution on the minimum-wage earning rowdy, and no punishment at all for the eight-figure-earning NBA player whose public conduct was identical.
Considering traffic laws: potential loss of license is a greater deterrent than the fines for moving violations, and to the extent that fines are deterrents to parking violations or an added deterrent to moving violations, if a $250 fine will deter someone whose household makes the median income for one earner households (say in my state of Kansas, just over $41K), would not the same level of deterrence be attained for a potential miscreant working full-time at minimum wage by a fines of just over a third that amount? And how much of a deterrent is a $250 fine to our hypothetical NBA-playing scofflaw? Not much — the limo being towed is the deterrent.
Remember, it is not the case that the poor have no income — where the European system of scaling fine (not compensatory damages, just fines) to income to be adopted, all income, including social benefits would have to go into the calculation.
For your benefit, I will break down the story which neither of you seem to understand fully! Your attitude is pathetic! Your understanding is even worse, it seems!
*********
Ask Jack Dawley, 55, an unemployed man in Ohio who between 2007 and 2012 spent a total of 16 days in jail in a Huron County lock-up for failing to pay roughly $1,500 in legal fines he'd incurred in the 1990s. The fines stemmed from Dawley's convictions for driving under the influence and other offenses. After his release from a Wisconsin correctional facility, Dawley, who admits he had struggled with drugs and alcohol, got clean. But if he put his substance problems behind him, Dawley's couldn't outrun his debts.
Struggling to find a job and dealing with the effects of a back injury, he fell behind on repayments to the municipal court in Norwalk, Ohio. He was arrested six years ago and sent to jail for not paying his original court fines. Although Dawley was put on a monthly payment plan, during his latest stint behind bars in 2012 the court ordered him to pay off his entire remaining debt.
" I called my brother, and they told him I have to pay off the whole fine in order for me to get out," he said. "That was $900. So I sat my whole 10 days [in jail.]" ...
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