“How can someone claim to be a Christ follower (Christian) and embrace something that Christ calls abomination? They can’t!”
They are claiming that they are in fact Christians and that they have Christianity correct.
“It’s a question I’ve never considered as it is irrelevant.”
No, it’s not. If we determine someone’s faith by what they claim, than Bishop Vicky et al are all Christian. There has to be an objective standard by which we *can* determine folks to be or not be Christian.
“I was raised Catholic. Baptized, first communion, altar boy, confirmed etc. Up until college I was a faithful mass every Sunday confession every Saturday Catholic. But I wasn’t a Christian at that time.”
So what does make someone a Christian then that includes you and excludes Bishop Vicky?
“I got saved (accepted the reality of Christ and His atoning sacrifice for me, and made Him Lord of my life) that April.”
So, you’re a protestant and a Baptist. This isn’t hard to figure out here.
“Being Catholic no more makes you a Christian than living in a garage makes you an automobile.”
So what you are saying is that doing the things that Christians do doesn’t make you a Christian?
This is actually contrary to what Romans teaches where Paul states explicitly that, “those who live in accordance with the law, even though they do not have the law are a law unto themselves. They demonstrate that the dictates of the law are written on their hearts.”
It’s not enough to claim that one is Christian to be a Christian. One has to live their life in accordance with Christian teachings.
How does one become Catholic? You were baptised into the Faith. Are you saying that Baptism is worthless?
“Apparently the same happens in Roman Catholicism. Lots of American Catholics on birth control.”
The difference is between official teachings and what the people themselves believe. It’s one thing for some people to dissent quite another for the pastors to teach things that are wrong.
“You can’t be following Christ if you love what He hates and hate what He loves. It’s pretty simple really. If our testimony does not line up with our actions then our testimony is false.”
Thank you. That’s exactly what I am saying here.
“I am saying that it doesn’t matter what church you belong to”
It does matter. You yourself just said, “our actions should be congruent with what we believe.” What does it say when we choose to remain in a church that has apostasized?
“What matters, indeed, the only thing that matters, is if you have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ”
Show me where this appears in Scripture. You gave your testimony and said that this is why you believe what you do.
“will lead you away from anti-Christian “churches” such as vicky’s.”
This is why it’s crucial to be a member of a church which practices what Christ teaches. We are explicitly called not to go at it alone, but to go at it together.
“It’s not yours until you accept it and take it.”
I would argue that the gift has been there long before I ever came to be, and it was more a matter of discovering that the gift had already been given to me.
“But not until I accept that gift is He MY Savior”
If I reject him, it doesn’t change. He remains my saviour. If someone saves your life, does this fact change depending on whether I choose to accept it or not? No. The fact remains - my life has been saved. Whether I accept it or not does not change what has already been done long before me.
The choice is not so much to accept that which is already true, but acknowledge the truth that Jesus suffered and died for us on the cross. Someone can accept something to be true and still reject it.
“What is it?”
http://www.ccel.org/creeds/nicene.creed.html
It was first promulgated by the First Council of Nicaea in 325.
“Exactly. Not the Roman Catholic church.”
Where do you get that from? Christ says there’s only One Church, not many, and that the divisions between Christians are not part of his will.
“with trivial and unimportant questions”
They are not trivial, as we are seeing today. Christian unity is important and the divisions of Luther, and Calvin have brought about the disasters that we are now seeing with Bishop Vicky.
“All Christians are in unity.”
Not so - there are wide and deep divisions between Christians.
“We’ve let sin take root in the church and have not pulled it up and expelled those who endorse it.”
You’ll find this in your church just as much as in mine. Sin isn’t a Catholic exclusive.
“This is self-evident. If they are Christian they are in unity with Christ’s teachings.”
But we aren’t you and I have significant differences over the meaning of Christian Baptism, and of Confirmation, Communion, Last Rites, Confession and Ordination. If there are differences between 6 of 7 sacraments, why should we assume that marriage would remain the one held the same rather than assume that the breach will become total, with 7 of 7?
I was a Baptist myself. This is what I fear - that your church will choose the same line that many others already have.