Skip to comments.Germany not keen to join France and UK in Syria strike
Posted on 08/27/2013 1:46:31 PM PDT by Tailgunner Joe
BRUSSELS - Germany has indicated it will not take part in any military strike on Syria, as France and the UK signal readiness to join a US-led intervention.
Philipp Missfelder, the foreign affairs spokesman for German Chancellor Angela Merkel's CDU party, said in the Leipziger Volkszeitung daily on Tuesday (27 August) that: "The [German] army has, through its current international operations, already reached the breaking point."
He added that a Western strike could create a "spiral of escalating violence" by drawing Iran and the Lebanese militant group, Hezbollah, deeper into the conflict.
He also said military action without a UN mandate is "hard to imagine."
Despite Missfelder's statement, Merkel in recent days joined British and French leaders in giving credence to reports the Syrian regime has used chemical weapons to kill hundreds of people on the outskirts of Damascus.
A statement by British Prime Minister David Cameron's office noted that Cameron and Merkel spoke by phone on Sunday.
"They agreed that this was a very grave incident and that there was little doubt that it had been carried out by the regime," it said.
"They agreed that such an attack demanded a firm response from the international community," it added.
France on Monday also used strong words.
"The only option that I am ruling out is to do nothing," French foreign minister Laurent Fabius said on Europe 1 radio.
The toughest language came from Washington on Monday evening, however.
US secretary of state John Kerry told media in the US capital: "The indiscriminate slaughter of civilians, the killing of women and children and innocent bystanders, by chemical weapons is a moral obscenity."
He added: "There must be accountability for those who would use the world's most heinous weapons against the world's most vulnerable people."
The US also cancelled a meeting with Russia, due in The Hague on Wednesday, designed to re-launch peace talks between Syrian rebels and Syrian authorities.
If the US and some EU countries do strike Syria's chemical weapons depots, elite brigades or air force, the move risks further alienating Moscow.
Cameron's office said he also spoke with Russian President Vladimir Putin on Monday, but "the Russian President said Moscow had no evidence as to whether such an attack had taken place or who was responsible."
Russian foreign minister Sergei Lavrov on Monday spelled out his country's point of view.
We are especially concerned to hear talk coming from London and Paris suggesting that Nato could take the lead in bombing in Syria without Security Council approval. This is a very slippery slope," he told Russian press.
"Any military action without [UN] Security Council approval would be a crude violation of international law," he noted.
Asked what Russia would do if a Nato-linked coalition does strike its Middle East ally, Lavrov added that Moscow is "not planning to go to war with anyone," however.
A UN chemical weapons inspection team arrived on the site of the alleged attack on Monday, with any Western action unlikely to come before it files its report.
A former French airforce chief, Jean Rannou, told EUobserver in a previous interview a military strike would most likely be launched from the UK's military base in Cyprus.
He noted there is a risk that Syria's Russian-made SA-17 missiles could shoot down a handful of Nato planes.
But he added: "I don't see any purely military problems. Syria has no defence against Western systems."
Some defence analysts have also voiced concerns about asymmetric threats.
EU countries have troops in UN peacekeeping missions in Lebanon and Syria, which could become targets.
Rainer Wendt, the head of Germany's police trade union, also told press on Monday that Syria could react with terrorist attacks in EU countries, including Germany, whether or not it takes part in an attack.
IF Syria were harming Israel or the US, I’d be behind it.....as of now....NO FREAKING WAY!!!!
A beacon of sanity from Europe.
It looks as though we’re in for another war-of-choice for a better, more unified and fair world. It worked out so well in Libya.
Hello, Germany...yeah, ah, is she available for me, Obama, ruler of world.
Auctung, no, she is having a manicure.
Ah, this is important I talk with her.
Auctung, when she is done, she says she will call you back after she figures out her cable bill and decides what wine to have with dinner.
Ah, but my plan for action in Syria is ah, well, important now.
Auctung, in that case, don’t expect a call back she says...click buzz.
Assad helped kill our soldiers in Iraq, so I say, DEATH TO ASSAD!
Obama is a fool. He does nothing on hundreds of other incidents that normally require a response. Then steps into crap on purpose. We need to stay out of this mess, else the crap hits the fan.
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How about anti-ship missiles, not to mention a Russian torpedo, if Russia wants to really make a point.
I'd say things worked out pretty well.
So, we helped the rebels get chemical weapons and Benghazi was a trading post. The WMD’s probably came from Saddam Hussein.
We told the rebels to kill a bunch of innocents right when the UN inspectors showed up and to blame the Syrian government. That “crossed the red line” and allowed BHO to strike Assad, thus helping the rebels to take over Syria.
The stuff in Egypt is off-script.
Am I getting this right?
Russia’s weapons are garbage, and Putin will do exactly what he did when when toppled his terrorist ally Saddam Hussein, NOT A DAMN THING!
Then WHY didn’t the WARMONGER, BUSH, go after ASSAD??? There is WAY MORE to this story than what is being told....WAY MORE!!
“The muslim terrorist Kaddafy finally paid the price for murdering dozens of Americans on Pan Am 103 over Lockerbie, Scotland.
I’d say things worked out pretty well. “
All things considered, Kaddafi was a pretty tame guy who kept the lid on his corner of craziness. We don’t know what’s going on there now, as it’s been thoroughly blocked by the MSM to avoid embarrassing Obama further. But you can be assured that whatever it is, it will leak out and potentially do much more damage than one old and toothless lion.
It’s nice to know that 91% of the American people agree with Europe’s most successful leader, Angela Merkel of Germany, that the west should not attack Syria with missiles.
What would the outcome of such attacks be except more civilian casualties on top of the ones caused by the chemical-weapons that we’re supposed be hysterically angry about?
What part of “following France into war” does not sound like a bad idea?
The POS does not have an honest bone in his body.
Yeah we should never do anything without getting permission first from the UN, the Kremlin, Red China and the Ayatollah.
Assad harbored al-qaeda to help them kill American soldiers in Iraq and now his terrorist evil has blown back right in his face!
Flight time, launch to target 20 to 45 seconds.
Aren't you Putin fans still waiting for him to liberate Kosovo?
Don't hold your breath!
Wouldn't we be cutting off our nose despite our face if by getting our revenge we end up with a Syria even more sympathetic Al Qaida?
The al-qaida types are the useful idiots of the Saudis. Saudi Arabia wants to topple Iran’s ally Assad, but they will not allow al-qaeda to take over Syria. They can’t tolerate that any more than they could tolerate the Muslim Brotherhood running Egypt!
So we go from "Russian weapons are garbage" to "Putin won't use 'em". Generous of you, considering that you're not the one facing them.
The point is, it's Putin's choice, and it's standard procedure to evacuate as many non essential personnel when expecting hostilities.
And why should anyone, including Putin, want to "liberate Kosovo"?
Putin acts real tough when he is picking on a tiny weak country like Georgia, but he is not interested in fighting an enemy his own size.
Like all stupid bullies who shoot their mouths off and act tough, Putin is nothing but a coward when it counts.
Seems the Israelis don’t share your dismissal of Russian weapons.
My whole point is that the Russian missiles can be intercepted and countered. They are as good as useless. Their purpose is not to defend Syria but to make Putin money selling junk to suckers!
“The al-qaida types are the useful idiots of the Saudis. Saudi Arabia wants to topple Irans ally Assad, but they will not allow al-qaeda to take over Syria. They cant tolerate that any more than they could tolerate the Muslim Brotherhood running Egypt!”
Fine Joe. Then let the Saudi’s involve their military in this fight. I don’t know about you but I am tired of our boys being tasked to step in and shed blood, limbs and lives, not to mention national treasure wasted, when we have no dog in this fight. McLaim talks of a moral imperative justifying our involvement. If a moral andate meant anything we would have stayed in S.E. Asia and finished the damn job instead of allowing millions to be killed by the communists after we pulled out! I say we have a moral mandate to protect our boys from losing their lives for anything less than the direct defense of this nation. If you want to go play in the dirt and lob clods at someone go for it! Leave our boys out of this! As far as I’m concerned this is MVM-NHI and of no concern of ours until it directly threatens our existence.
Damn! Just damn!
Maybe I can salvage this day with coffee and coffin nails. Damn.
The conflict between the Saudis and Iran is a proxy war between Russia and the USA. We are not shedding our blood fighting their war, they are shedding blood fighting ours.
Very well stated indeed!!!
Damn Joe! We’re not at war with the Russians! Proxy or otherwise.
It appears you want involvement in this Middle East cluster*#%). As I said go for it and take as many with you as you can muster but don’t involve our boys in their fight. That includes some romantic notion of sending in missiles and drones to do the dirty work because as you should well know some boots must be on the ground or in the air to monitor the targets and eventually boots have to be on the ground to hold it for the effort to have mattered.
Time and again since WWII we’ve played this damn game and I for one am tired of watching it and what it does to our people. Both those who serve and those at home who have to deal with the aftermath. Get your head screwed on straight. That isn’t meant to be a personal attack. Just some sound advice.
If you think the Cold War is over so Russia is our friend now, then you are the one who is deluded.
Look. I’m not attacking you. If you can’t get my drift that we have no business shedding American blood in this dust-up I can’t help that. Our relations with Putin and Russia, as well as with every other nation on this planet, are political. It would behoove us to cultivate mutually beneficial commercial relationships with the former communist nation of Russia rather than stokes the fires of the furnace of war. When our commercial relations are forcibly interrupted by military powers of another country, our closest allies invaded by their neighbors and that threatens our national security, then we have a reason to be concerned, involved and active. Otherwise we owe it to those who defend us not to waste their lives on fruitless ventures such as this Syrian flap.
We have more pressing problems here at home. N.S.A., D.E.A., E.P.A., and the leftist minions in charge of those and a myriad of other government agencies all ruining the commerce and culture of these United States. We have an uneducated indoctrinated populace who believe the federal government is the be all and end all in their lives and will do whatever they are asked to do to further the controlling mechanisms of the state at all levels of government in this nation.
And you are worried about the Syrians? The Middle East? Seriously? Damn. Makes me wonder why I volunteered to serve just to see this happen. My father, in addition to all the others who are now gone, must be throwing a fit in their graves.
I’ll see you on the line. When it becomes necessary.
Well what do you think we can do to get on Russia's good side?
Shall we grovel before our genocidal Russian enemies and beg them to be nice to us?
Please enlighten me.
What lengths should we go to in order to appease the Russians so they will like us and be our friends?
Post WWII Germany is generally averse to war, as a matter of principle.
To begin with, the victorious allies imposed that on Germany, and they came to adopt it themselves.
Not much room in the Anglo-French mouton volant for kraut-eaters.
I don’t care who pretends to preside over it, but it needs to be done. Harping for Assad only helps the mullahs with their nuclear weapons buildup.
US TOLD TO LEAVE CENTRAL ASIA [Russia & China demand “deadline.”]
Putin: Russia Building Nuclear Weapon U.S. Won’t Have
Russia says new Topol RS-12 mobile ICBM can evade U.S. missile defense
Russia, N.Korea, China give Iran missile aid -CIA
Russia to deploy 11 new Topol-M ICBMs in 2008
Russia: No System Will Stop New Missiles
Russia Ramps Up New 'Satan' Nuke After U.S. Talks Breakdown
The Russians Are Coming - As Many Russian Spies Now In The U.S. as during the Cold War
Do we have commercial relations with the People’s Republic of Vietnam? Do our citizen’s, including our war veterans, visit that country and spend hard-earned American dollars there? Are we dealing commercially with the People’s Republic of China? Give me a break here.
Let me put this in perspective. Syria - Two bad factions, both of whom are attacking and killing one another with all the collateral damage that entails. Those factions are members of a combined political religious belief which seeks dominance over the population of the world. That system is in direct conflict with the Rights of Man and the very freedoms we allegedly still enjoy in this nation. To interfere in that fight would be akin to interfering in a fight between the Soviet Union and China during the height of the Cold War, given that the use of nuclear weapons weren’t involved. Would you have entered into that? Two avowed enemies destroying themselves with no loss to us?
As to genocide we practiced it here. Are we to be forever held in contempt for those acts and denied relations with our fellow men throughout the world? We deal with the German, Italian and Japanese governments today. Times and people change Joe. Yesterday’s sworn enemies are now our peaceful allies.
As to your final question, the solution of international problems is above my pay grade; but I hasten to say the avoidance of war or the involvement in the wars of others, particularly those instances where are enemies are hurting themselves, is of paramount concern in my mind unless and until we are threatened with extinction as a nation. The course you are advocating would involve us in every instance of conflict where humans are losing their lives for one reason or another and it is up to those directly involved to resolve it. So it isn’t about our ‘feelings’. Our involvement certainly should not be based upon the word of the leaders of our government. Particularly since the lies and outright obfuscation of what our government has been doing in the Middle East has become known. I don’t trust our politicians. I have been given a plethora of examples why I must not.
I am saddened by the events occurring throughout the world which result in the needless loss of life; but I would be heartbroken watching our guys making sacrifices made in efforts not directly related to our national survival, as in this case where it appears our political leaders would involve us to prove their own self-inflated notion of importance.
I’m not trying to convince you to change your mind or otherwise influence your thoughts. My responses should be considered as one American’s thoughts to another and nothing more other than a response to what you yourself initiated in your statements.
I loathe Imam Obama as much as the next red-blooded American, but not so much that I will side with our most evil and dangerous enemies in the world against our own country. Not me. Never.
Had they harkened to Patton’s words it would have saved more lives in the long run and Reagan wouldn’t have had to say, “Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall.” The Cuban missile crisis might not have occurred and we would not have been brought to the brink of a nuclear war. If only we had paid more attention then to the Marxist/Communists in positions of influence in our government then we might not have one of them in the Oval Office today.
As to your links I was aware of the information and what the stories report always has to be addressed by the intelligence agencies. So much for that considering who is occupying the White House and influential positions in this nation.
But ‘I Don’t Believe In If Anymore’ (Roger Whittaker) and I no longer have faith in the veracity of our government leaders. Any of them. Verify everything.
Air strikes=CSAR assets ready to infil. Unless they go pure TLAM. Even in a 3 day fight we have a good chance for a ground fight due to SAMs.
Those are very good points. They can’t just wish away high-intensity conflicts forever, and you know a few things about what so-called low-intensity conflicts do to morale among other things.