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AMERICANS DRIVE INLAND TOWARD KEY JUNCTION AND BATTLE FOR TOWN ON ROAD TO CHERBOURG (6/12/44)
Microfilm-New York Times archives, Monterey Public Library | 6/12/44 | Drew Middleton, Frederick Graham, Henry T. Gorrell, Marshall Yarrow, John W. Jarrell, more

Posted on 06/12/2014 4:27:28 AM PDT by Homer_J_Simpson

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TOPICS: Extended News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: history; milhist; realtime; worldwarii
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To: Homer_J_Simpson

That p11 article about the Mariannas being struck is interesting. If the Americans remain in the area and the Japanese come out to play, this could turn into a real turkey shoot.


21 posted on 06/12/2014 4:47:10 PM PDT by fso301
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To: fso301
That p11 article about the Mariannas being struck is interesting. If the Americans remain in the area and the Japanese come out to play, this could turn into a real turkey shoot.

Okay, wise guy.

22 posted on 06/12/2014 5:10:40 PM PDT by Homer_J_Simpson ("Every nation has the government that it deserves." - Joseph de Maistre (1753-1821))
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To: Homer_J_Simpson
Concerning that p5 article about Germans outposts being alerted by telephone. I think it worth noting the Polish prisoner who said he was forcibly conscripted into the Germany army under penalty of death.

My understanding is that this happened a lot to men in Eastern Europe. Even for those who "volunteered", for many it was a matter of volunteer and receive food rations, or face starvation.

23 posted on 06/12/2014 5:27:27 PM PDT by fso301
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To: fso301; Homer_J_Simpson

Yeah, but the Brits are right outside Caen. They should take it in just a few more days...


24 posted on 06/12/2014 5:37:53 PM PDT by henkster (Do I really need a sarcasm tag?)
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To: fso301; Homer_J_Simpson; colorado tanker

There is the story in Cornelius Ryan’s “The Longest Day” about the two POWs taken on D-Day; nobody could understand them. It turned out they were Mongolian. I believe they had been press-ganged into the Red Army in the late 1930s, captured by the Germans in 1941, and then pressed into service for the Germans and sent to France.

They wound up being repatriated through the United States and across the Pacific, completing a round-the-world tour that few Mongolians have ever done.

Too bad for them they didn’t stay in America and start one of those nice Mongolian BBQ restaurants.


25 posted on 06/12/2014 5:41:49 PM PDT by henkster (Do I really need a sarcasm tag?)
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To: fso301

Heh, good simile.

He did help the other seamen, at least, apparently with excellent swimming skills.


26 posted on 06/12/2014 5:51:18 PM PDT by Tax-chick (When the truth finally dawns, it dawns in fire!)
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To: fso301; Tax-chick
The Navy officer who wrote the report on the PT-109 affair was Byron White, who became bff with Kennedy. Lucky draw - another officer might have hammered him for losing his boat.

White went back to Colorado to practice law after the War, but remained a Friend of Jack, organizing his Colorado campaign. Kennedy rewarded him with Deputy Attorney General and later Justice of the Supreme Court.

27 posted on 06/12/2014 6:04:17 PM PDT by colorado tanker
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To: colorado tanker; fso301

Hmm, all neatly wrapped up. But to be fair, if the story is even mostly true, he was t-boned by a destroyer at night. It’s not like he ran aground (like Nimitz early in his career ;-).


28 posted on 06/12/2014 6:08:27 PM PDT by Tax-chick (When the truth finally dawns, it dawns in fire!)
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To: colorado tanker; Tax-chick
White went back to Colorado to practice law after the War, but remained a Friend of Jack, organizing his Colorado campaign. Kennedy rewarded him with Deputy Attorney General and later Justice of the Supreme Court.

That I did not know. Thanks!

29 posted on 06/12/2014 6:09:31 PM PDT by fso301
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To: henkster
There is the story in Cornelius Ryan’s “The Longest Day” about the two POWs taken on D-Day; nobody could understand them. It turned out they were Mongolian. I believe they had been press-ganged into the Red Army in the late 1930s, captured by the Germans in 1941, and then pressed into service for the Germans and sent to France.

Thanks. Interesting story. I have heard mention that there may have been a significant number of non-Germans in the Wehrmacht at Normandy/Atlantic Wall but never really delved into the matter.

30 posted on 06/12/2014 6:12:50 PM PDT by fso301
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To: Homer_J_Simpson; Tax-chick; colorado tanker; fso301
The Japanese have 5 fleet carriers, 2 light carriers, 2 seaplane carriers, 5 battleships as well as several cruisers and destroyers in support. The commander of the Combined Fleet, Admiral Toyoda, realizes that the American forces are numerically superior but he also expects support from the land-based aircraft on the islands. These air assets, however, are being depleted by American attacks.

And here is the difference between the Battles of Midway and the Philippine Sea, or more specifically how code breaking makes all the difference. At Midway, the Ameican fleet is already in ambush position off to the northeast of the island. So while the Japanese are trying to beat down the land-based aviation on Midway, as well as fending off their attacks, the naval air forces can jump in at just the right time with the decisive attack.

At the Battle of the Philippine Sea, the IJN is still days away, not even close to the scene of the battle. In fact, their fleet has been dispersed with much of it engaged in Operation Kon, the relief of Biak. Instead of already being in position to strike while the Americans have to deal with the land based air power from Guam and Saipan, the IJN is scrambling to change from Operation Kon to A-Go. By the time the IJN gets on the scene, Spruance doesn't have to worry so much about his back. The land based air power has already been eliminated.

The Pacific Fleet was forewarned to be in ambush position already when the Japanese appeared at Midway. The Japanese at the Philippine Sea are groping in the dark, and reacting two steps behind.

31 posted on 06/12/2014 6:19:43 PM PDT by henkster (Do I really need a sarcasm tag?)
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To: henkster

Excellent analysis. The sort of thing that seems obvious once someone has said it ;-).


32 posted on 06/12/2014 6:20:59 PM PDT by Tax-chick (When the truth finally dawns, it dawns in fire!)
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To: Tax-chick; colorado tanker; fso301

He had a high speed boat and wasn’t paying enough attention to get out of the way of the oncoming ship.

I hadn’t known what Whizzer did to earn the Supreme Court appointment.


33 posted on 06/12/2014 6:21:11 PM PDT by PAR35
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To: PAR35

I didn’t know what Whizzer did to get the appointment either. While he had the educational pedigree from Oxford & Yale, he wasn’t an accomplished jurist. But then again, the idea that a Supreme Court Justice should have prior appellate judicial experience is a relatively new concept.

It certainly helps to have connections. His biographies make mention of the fund-raising for Kennedy’s campaigns, but are silent about his war time connection.

White was very much a “centrist” on the Court. He was never bat-guano crazy liberal like Brennan or Marshall, but was never as conservative as Burger or Rehnquist. He was also a very long-serving Justice, ranking 12th on the tenure list.


34 posted on 06/12/2014 6:42:39 PM PDT by henkster (Do I really need a sarcasm tag?)
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To: Tax-chick; colorado tanker
But to be fair, if the story is even mostly true, he was t-boned by a destroyer at night.

Even on a moonless night, the sky is not "pitch black". It is easily seen as luminous to the dark-adapted human eye, especially if objects are silhouetted against it.

How could JFK be on patrol for enemy ships at torpedo distances yet be surprised by an enemy destroyer and have no time to react?

35 posted on 06/12/2014 6:44:11 PM PDT by fso301
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To: PAR35; fso301; Tax-chick
Smart Presidents know to have someone they absolutely trust as their AG. Kennedy made his brother AG and the guy who not only saved his bacon but got him a medal as the Deputy. But, I have no beef with White - that's the way politics are played.

IMHO, he was a pretty good Justice, showing more restraint than most Democrat appointees. IIRC, he dissented in Roe v. Wade and thought the case was wrongly decided.

36 posted on 06/13/2014 10:22:15 AM PDT by colorado tanker
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To: colorado tanker

Very informative, thanks.


37 posted on 06/13/2014 11:09:45 AM PDT by Tax-chick (When the truth finally dawns, it dawns in fire!)
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