Posted on 08/06/2014 7:44:29 AM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans
Ukrainian Journalist Says Servicemen In Gukovo Are On Hunger Strike
14:25 (GMT)
Andriy Tsaplienko, a senior correspondent for Ukraine's Inter television channel, has written on his Facebook page that Ukrainian soldiers and border guards, who were forced to take refuge in Russian territory on August 4, are trapped in Russia and are on hunger strike.
He writes (translated by The Interpreter):
The soldiers from the 72nd brigade and border guards are stuck in the territory of the Russian Federation.
According to one of their commanders, none of the lads asked for asylum in Russia or switched their allegiance.
They summoned our soldiers for questioning throughout the night and tried to take fingerprints.
By morning, the lads had come out of the camp and begun a hunger strike, demanding that they be sent on to Ukraine or meet with a Ukrainian representative.
We have not seen any other reports of the start of a hunger strike, however a report by the OSCE Observer Mission from August 4 does say that no asylum requests were reported to their team in Gukovo.
They also reported that following the departure of the first group of Ukrainian soldiers for Ukraine, another bus was expected to take more soldiers home. This has not happened so far.
The OSCE notes that:
The cell phones of the 72nd brigade commander and border guard commander were not reachable to confirm this information.
To make it clear, these are the Ukrainian soldiers who wound up on Russian soil.
The Russkies claimed that some part of 400 or 700 Ukrainian soldiers surrendered in mass in order to get asylum from enlightened Russkie society, such as getting drunk on enlightened Russkie Vodka.
(They had also claimed this about a woman soldier from the Ukrainian army whom they had kidnapped and transported into Russia, whom they now are preparing to put on trial for alleged war crimes.)
It appears these people might be having a similar problem. They had ran out of bullets fighting the Russkies (on Ukrainian soil) near the border and were forced onto Russian territory where it seems they were likely held captive. The Russkies made a lot of noise about it, trying to make it sound like the Ukrainian army is falling apart.
Are we talking “Bobby Sands” Hunger Strike, or more like a “Ramadan” Hunger Strike?
I wouldn’t eat the Crap Russia feeds it’s Military either
The Ukrainians aren’t Muzzies, so it’s probably not like a fast during the day and eat at night thing.
Good thing they aren’t trying that here. They would get no sympathy whatsoever and it would give Michelle Obama an idea to slim America down and save millions of dollars worth of food daily so the elites would have plenty.
Hurry hurry! Send more MRE’s!
As per international law, since the other party in that war is not recognized as a state by anyone, not even Russia, Russia is obliged to repatriate these soldiers. They cannot be interned as soldiers in a similar situation would be.
The role of forward Army units is to engage enemy/hold the front. Rear army units resupply them.
The forward units of Kiev army surrendered because they run out of ammunition, fuel and food. It means there are no resupply lines left.
If Kiev army is NOT falling apart, as you want us to think, how come troops were not resupplied? In other words, Kiev Army IS falling apart. All lies about success of anti terrorist operation (read: indiscriminate murdering of civilians by artillery and Scud missiles) are exposed.
They escaped to Russia to escape responsibility for crimes they committed.
It seems You either can not grasp the basic concept of logic or are so brazen to try to fool Freepers.
True, however if Donetsk republic is not recognized by anyone, by the international law Donetsk is technically Ukraine.
Russia can repatriate the scum of 72nd and 70th to Ukraine via the nearest border crossing in Donetsk/Lugansk area. Like Brits did in 1945 in Austria. There is nothing in international law saying they should be repatriated to Western Ukraine.
One can not have it both ways.
I can hear your Russkie accent all the way from here, General. If you want people to believe I am "fooling freepers," you should probably try to quite down your transparent eagerness for the collapse of the Ukrainian army to the glorious Red Soviet one.
As for your claim, the Ukrainian army is already moving into Donetsk. Your Neo-Nazi people's governor has already stepped down and is being replaced by someone else. Along the border, the Russkies are shelling Ukrainian positions and doing their best to isolate troops just like the ones they're holding hostage here. But unless the Russkies invade, your relatives are going to be pushing up daisies soon, and good riddance.
As for "indiscriminate murdering of civilians." You should provide evidence for this.
I have no dog in this fight, but you obviously do. Yes, I know I shouldn’t be replying to you, but whatever.
That also is not correct as per international law.
Putting anyone, even soldiers who have crossed a border, deliberately in danger due to the means of repatriation - like, as you imply, handing them over to their enemies - is a human rights violation according to numerous treaties which Russia has signed.
It is possible to behave with honor and integrity even in such a conflict, and doing so can only help your side. Treating the enemy correctly is in your long term best interests.
Rage and bloodthirstiness is a poor guide to policy.
Neither do I. But both of us should have the same principle - do and say what is right.
Universal "International law" does not exist as such. There are conventions and treaties signed by different parties, applied in certain circumstances and ignored in others.
Staging coups in a foreign country is against many charters and treaties. Sending in Blackwater mercenaries to murder civilians in a foreign country is also against such treaties and conventions. But it is done, nevertheless.
What we are seeing now is the fallout.
In this particular case, it boils down to the question - are Kiev soldiers party in an armed conflict and as such protected by the Geneva Convention and The Hague conventions on warfare on land?
If they are fighting force, they are to be interned in a neutral country until the armed conflict is over, NOT repatriated to fight again. That neutral country can be ANY UN country.
However, if Kiev soldiers are NOT fighting side in an armed conflict because Kiev denies there is an armed conflict in Ukraine, only "anti-terrorist operation"), they are not protected by The Geneva Convention and The Hague Conventions on war on land.
Kiev soldiers are not ordinary civilian illegal aliens who came to Russia illegally, out of their own volition. They fled to escape capture. If Kiev junta claims there is no armed conflict on Ukraine soil, but Kiev soldiers claim they fear persecution,they can request refugee status in Russia or any other UN country on humanitarian grounds.
Letting them escape justice for crimes committed and allowing them to fight again can not be justified as decision humanitarian ground.
That's why I wrote it can not be both ways for Kiev junta - deliberate contravention of Geneva Convention and The Hague conventions when murdering civilians and wanton destruction of civilian infrastructure ,but expecting very same conventions to protect their fleeing army when it loses in battle.
A. “Kiev Junta” is the government of a sovereign country, as far as anyone in the world is concerned. Whether there is a dispute about the legitimacy of the government is neither here nor there, according to all current laws and traditions they and their armed forces are to be treated as legitimate. They have power in their country de facto and de jure.
B. Russia is by law and by treaty a neutral country. It can intern these men, but only if they are fighting a recognized party to a conflict, which is not yet the case. If the Donets rebels (and they are rebels, at least) proclaim a government and someone recognizes them, then Russia can intern the Ukrainians. Otherwise they fall under the same rules as shipwrecked sailors and similar victims of misfortune.
C. That there are many violations of these laws does not evade the fact that these are laws, and customs too. There are costs, political, economic and even military, to all such violations. Russia has a serious PR and legitimacy deficit, and I dont see the cost-benefit ratio being favorable in this case.
FWIW, Mercenaries are not, in and of themselves, a violation of any laws and certainly not a violation of any customs. Mercenaries are an ancient and more or less honorable tradition.
To add,
These men can be held for crimes, but only if someone with standing brings an indictment against them personally in a legitimate court.
Without such there really isn’t a legal way they can be held.
Really, the whole thing would be much simpler if Russia just declared war and got it over with. There would be no legal complications. This is what happens when people try to play games.
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