Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

The U.S. Trade Deficit Is Not A Debt To Repay
Forbes ^ | Mar 22, 2016 | Dan Ikenson

Posted on 03/23/2016 5:55:46 AM PDT by expat_panama

It’s a presidential election year so the quadrennially-maligned U.S. trade deficit is taking its lumps. Donald Trump says the trade deficit means the United States is losing at trade, and it’s losing because U.S. trade negotiators aren’t smart enough. Bernie Sanders believes the trade deficit deprives the economy of production and good jobs. Meanwhile, some of the economics commentariat argue that trade deficits are bad because they represent a burden on future generations – a debt that must be repaid.

Trump and Sanders are both wrong... ...the debt argument is being used to wrap trade skepticism in a moral sheen it doesn’t deserve...

...central point is that trade has to be in balance because, in his example, the Germans aren’t willing to exchange the cars they produce for pieces of paper (dollars) indefinitely. Eventually, Americans will have to accept the return of those dollars for real output and that, ultimately, running a trade deficit is just an intertemporal shifting of the burden of production and the reward of consumption....

...a trade deficit does represent a loan, but that loan doesn’t always have to be paid back...

...Let me assure you that Americans, who part with hard-earned dollars for every transaction, don’t think they’re getting stuff for free. But here’s why Smith is wrong on the broader question. There’s a clearer, more instructive way to conceptualize the issue. The United States runs a trade deficit with the rest of the world because Americans spend more dollars on foreign-produced goods and services than foreigners spend on U.S.-produced goods and services. The dollar value of U.S. imports exceeds the dollar value of U.S. exports, so our trade account is negative. It’s in deficit. That’s straightforward.

(Excerpt) Read more at forbes.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Editorial; Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: 2016issues; debt; economy; investing; trade
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-38 next last
Questions for the group:
  1. If the trade deficit is like the national budget deficit, then how come we got a total national debt (right now HERE at $19,205,597,413,856.96) but nowhere is there an accumulated "national trade debt"?
  2. If our dollars are going over seas and not coming back, just what is the rest of the world doing with all those dollars?
  3. Everyone cares about international trade in goods and services, but what about the other half of international trade in other stuff like construction, land, designs, etc.?
  4. Why is it that U.S. employment goes up when the trade deficit gets bigger?

1 posted on 03/23/2016 5:55:46 AM PDT by expat_panama
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: expat_panama

US employment is not going up.

That is a total, complete fabrication.

Big time.


2 posted on 03/23/2016 5:58:48 AM PDT by cba123
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: expat_panama

The public increasingly does not believe that ANY deficit is a debt to repay.


3 posted on 03/23/2016 6:00:33 AM PDT by Buckeye McFrog
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: expat_panama
"If our dollars are going over seas and not coming back, just what is the rest of the world doing with all those dollars?"

Look at the stock market.

4 posted on 03/23/2016 6:01:58 AM PDT by circlecity
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: expat_panama

The article is technically correct; tbe trade deficit is not a “debt to repay.” It is, however, an exportation to or an appropriation of or national wealth by other nations. All those dollars going overseas come back and buy our land and all of the assets on it.

Try to make a movie in Hollywood critical of Saudi Arabia or China. Not gonna happen. Guess who owns and finances the studios.


5 posted on 03/23/2016 6:02:31 AM PDT by henkster
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: cba123
US employment is not going up.  That is a total, complete fabrication.

You don't believe the employment numbers, however you chose to accept those made up fabricated trade deficit numbers.  They all come from the same people, why the one one and not the other?

6 posted on 03/23/2016 6:06:39 AM PDT by expat_panama
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: expat_panama

To simplify it fr the free traitors - the dollars that go in trade then get loaned back to the USA or spent on other countries (China is buying up African natural resources for example). The dollars spent that goes to say a China that do get returned to the USA that do not buy American goods and services is loaned to the USA by ourchases if treasury bonds. That adds insult to injury that the money spent on Chinese goods is then loaned back to the USA adding to our budget defecit. And we need to borrow because the tax base declines - any new jobs add are low paying service jobs.


7 posted on 03/23/2016 6:06:51 AM PDT by Trumpinator ("Are you Batman?" the boy asked. "I am Batman," Trump said.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: expat_panama

the trade deficit is definitely not a loan

the trade deficit is not sovereign

the trade deficit doesn’t matter

BTW, with China, the money is infact coming back in the purchase of stocks and real estate by Chicap investors.


8 posted on 03/23/2016 6:10:09 AM PDT by bert ((K.E.; N.P.; GOPc;+12, 73, ....carson is the kinder gentler trump.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: 1rudeboy; Mase; SAJ; Toddsterpatriot; 1010RD
what is the rest of the world doing with all those dollars?"

Look at the stock market

That's true, it's like when I sell my Sony stock to a Canadian at a huge profit and then I use the Canadian dollars to buy Canadian gasoline.   That's a trade deficit and I really don't see what's wrong there.

9 posted on 03/23/2016 6:12:49 AM PDT by expat_panama
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: expat_panama
"If Noah Smith and other economists worry about this debt, they should advocate reducing wayward government spending instead of restricting trade."

Amen!!!

I can remember a few decades back how angry some were that "The Japanese were buying up America. They even owned The Rockefeller Center!" Well, guess what. The Rockefeller Center is still here.

Then it was the South Koreans, the Indonesians, and now the Chinese. And yet,.....The Rockefeller Center is still here. No matter how high the tariffs Trump places on the Chinese, the buggy whip factories will still be closed.

10 posted on 03/23/2016 6:13:14 AM PDT by norwaypinesavage (The Stone Age did not end because we ran out of stones)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: bert
...with China, the money is infact coming back in the purchase of stocks and...

Exactly, it's like in my post #9

11 posted on 03/23/2016 6:14:53 AM PDT by expat_panama
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: bert

The thing is, China is buying American companies.

American companies however, cannot buy Chinese companies.

Not a good deal, for America.


12 posted on 03/23/2016 6:14:55 AM PDT by cba123
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: henkster
an appropriation of or national wealth by other nations. All those dollars going overseas come back and buy our land and all of the assets on it.

Whoa --all the land and all the assets in the U.S. have all left!!!

We know that's not true.  We know it's like what I said in post 9 about swapping Sony stock for gasoline in Canada.

13 posted on 03/23/2016 6:23:56 AM PDT by expat_panama
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: norwaypinesavage

In real estate a good point to note is when the top of the market is reached is when the foreigners are buying.


14 posted on 03/23/2016 6:26:42 AM PDT by Mouton (The insurrection laws maintain the status quo now.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: expat_panama
The “money” or “trade units” or whatever you wish to call them are being used between nations as a base currency. You wish to deal in goods outside the US, you need buy dollars to do that to effect the exchange. That is where the money is. These trading units are not currency as much as some see them.

The dollar right now seems to be peaking or just past its peak. This dollar supports our debt. When it goes past any point of equilibrium with other money, the US will have no choice but to raise the interest rates to “support” the dollar. When that happens it will be game over.

15 posted on 03/23/2016 6:32:04 AM PDT by Mouton (The insurrection laws maintain the status quo now.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: expat_panama

Future American generations will see a serf-like existence. Forced to pay back huge loans their entire lives without the ownership of any productive assets.


16 posted on 03/23/2016 6:33:38 AM PDT by Last Dakotan
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: cba123; bert
American companies however, cannot buy Chinese companies.

A lot of people have been saying that on the FR for quite a while, and in the mean time the rest of us have say, bought BIDU at $140 six weeks ago and are now selling it at $190.  Yeah, I know folks here can say that my paying my money to own the company and having others want to pay big money to buy it from me --that's not really really really "owning" the company. 

Whatever.

17 posted on 03/23/2016 6:42:18 AM PDT by expat_panama
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: expat_panama

The largest IPO (Initial Public Offering) in the history of the New York Stock Exchange was a Chicap company called Alibaba Holding

Alibaba is first of all at the root an ebay and Thomas Register for business to business transactions. Alibaba has also many big irons in the internet fire.


18 posted on 03/23/2016 7:28:45 AM PDT by bert ((K.E.; N.P.; GOPc;+12, 73, ....carson is the kinder gentler trump.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: cba123

there are very active Chicap stock exchanges and the largest IPO in history of the NYSE was a Chicap company

Better check your facts


19 posted on 03/23/2016 7:31:58 AM PDT by bert ((K.E.; N.P.; GOPc;+12, 73, ....carson is the kinder gentler trump.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: expat_panama

“just what is the rest of the world doing with all those dollars?”

You mean besides China financing their military buildup?


20 posted on 03/24/2016 11:23:16 AM PDT by jospehm20
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-38 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson