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Trump suggests France would have been defeated without U.S.
The Columbian ^ | November 13, 2018 | Darlene Superville, The Associated Press

Posted on 11/13/2018 10:53:06 AM PST by 2ndDivisionVet

President Donald Trump escalated his verbal assaults against France on Tuesday, suggesting that America’s stalwart European ally would have been vanquished in both world wars if not for the military firepower provided by the United States.

Trump tweeted about a suggestion by French President Emmanuel Macron that Europe build up its militaries because the continent can no longer depend on the U.S. for defense. Macron had also said Europe needs to protect itself against cyberthreats from China, Russia and the U.S.

Macron’s comments were inaccurately reported and Trump continues to misrepresent them, seemingly for political hay. The French leader’s office said Trump had lumped together Macron’s remarks on protecting against cyber-threats and “interference in our democracies” from “China, Russia and even the United States” with Macron’s later statement on military defense....

(Excerpt) Read more at columbian.com ...


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Government; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: france; macron; trump; ww2
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

When you get right down to it, France hasn’t “won” a war since 1789, and that was only because it was an internecine conflict!


81 posted on 11/13/2018 12:06:41 PM PST by ssaftler (This space for rent.)
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To: Reily
Aren’t we talking here about WWI?

Many historians argue that WWII was simply a continuation of WWI.

82 posted on 11/13/2018 12:21:17 PM PST by pfflier
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

If the U.S. stayed out of Wilson’s WWI folly, The Central Powers would have won and history much different and no WWII as we know it now. I think America would have to fight eventually even if we did not save France’s butt in WWI.


83 posted on 11/13/2018 12:38:05 PM PST by shanover (...To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them.-S.Adams)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

And, the United States of America would not exist without France, who backed us in our independence from the United Kingdom. So, we paid them back.


84 posted on 11/13/2018 12:41:35 PM PST by ro_dreaming (Chesterton, 'Christianity has not been tried and found wanting. It's been found hard and not tried')
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

That is true.


85 posted on 11/13/2018 12:43:47 PM PST by I want the USA back (It's Ok To Be White. White Lives Matter. White Guilt is Socially Constructed)
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To: dfwgator

Had we not intervened in WWII Europe the Soviets would have pushed all the way to the Atlantic.


86 posted on 11/13/2018 12:44:55 PM PST by Rebelbase
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To: Ingtar

Absolutely. They did not have enough steel


87 posted on 11/13/2018 12:45:44 PM PST by frogjerk (We are conservatives. Not libertarians, not "fiscal conservatives", not moderates)
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To: dfwgator
Ah....ok....I was going to talk about Operation Sea Lion.

Britain was only in WW1 to defend the Belgians right to neutrality. They rarely worked well with the French and a lot of the time, when they did work with the Brits, the French never left their trenches.

88 posted on 11/13/2018 12:46:41 PM PST by Wizdum (Buckle up! It's going to be one hell of a ride.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Certainly not the second. FDR was part of the war before official declaration, providing material support to Russia. Without that support Russia would likely have fallen, thus Germany would keep its hold on France.

For the first, well the forces were in stalemate. Russia leaving the war could have been argued the turning point for the Allies.


89 posted on 11/13/2018 12:47:05 PM PST by Sam Gamgee
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To: Rebelbase
Had we not intervened in WWII Europe the Soviets would have pushed all the way to the Atlantic.

Ironically France falling so quickly in WWII might have been a good thing. It caught the Soviets off-guard, they expected Germany, France and England to get bogged down in another war of attrition that would have bled all of them dry, making the entire continent easy pickings for the Red Army.

90 posted on 11/13/2018 12:47:53 PM PST by dfwgator (Endut! Hoch Hech!)
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To: DesertRhino

Except the US was sending aid to Russia before the war started.


91 posted on 11/13/2018 12:48:04 PM PST by Sam Gamgee
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To: cuban leaf

Hitler’s V2s and probably a NUKE would have defeated the Soviets


92 posted on 11/13/2018 12:50:24 PM PST by uncbob
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To: marron
I guess we have forgotten these guys. Vichy France
93 posted on 11/13/2018 1:03:17 PM PST by itsahoot (Welcome to the New USA where Islam is a religion of peace and Christianity is a mental disorder.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Well, they were indeed defeated in WW II. As for WW I, the German Army was all on French soil when the war ended, so... who knows.
94 posted on 11/13/2018 1:03:24 PM PST by hinckley buzzard (Power is more often surrendered than seized.)
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To: cuban leaf
If Hitler had been able to hold his hatred of Russia in check, he could have had a million more troops to defeat the Allies in Africa. this would have deprived Britain of their resources from the empire, and knocked them out of the war. Hitler then could have secured his western front, neutralized Britain, and pursued his entire drive to the Urals. And all this would have happened before the US was ready to engage in the European theatre.

The European war could actually have ended with a Pax Germana.

95 posted on 11/13/2018 1:11:10 PM PST by hinckley buzzard (Power is more often surrendered than seized.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Are there any credible historians that would argue with him?

What am I missing here?

Before the US began her war on the Nazis, France was already defeated. They had a bunch of puppets we can refer to as Vichy acting as administrators.

96 posted on 11/13/2018 1:11:14 PM PST by stevem
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To: ssaftler

They win when led by a Corsician (Napoleon) or a woman (Joan of Arc).


97 posted on 11/13/2018 1:17:53 PM PST by Vigilanteman (ObaMao: Fake America, Fake Messiah, Fake Black man. How many fakes can you fit into one Zer0?)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Perhaps not WW 1 but why DeGualle was so perpetually angry at the ‘Anglo-Americans).
98 posted on 11/13/2018 1:20:16 PM PST by robowombat (Orthodox)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
He's 1000% right and the French know it. They had some who resisted but the majority were appeasers. They didn't get the moniker-cheese eating surrender monkeys for nothing.
And before I am accused of being anti-French, my grandparents came from the South and North of France in the 1700's. My dad fought there in WW2 and would have loved to have visited ancestral places but couldn't. He always said later that the only bad thing about France itself was that it is full of French people. Guess he didn't see the irony or maybe our ancestors were tougher.
99 posted on 11/13/2018 1:20:17 PM PST by ClearBlueSky (ISLAM is the problem. ISLAM is the enemy of civilization.)
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To: Regulator
You're normally a pretty good poster, so I'll provide a little information that might cause to give you pause.

The point of DeGaulle's June 18, 1940 speech (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_of_18_June) was:

(a) Admitting the Germans got the jump on France; (b) conceding that the Germans held the main French territory (France itself); but (c) insisted that the war could be carried on from the many and far flung components of the still extant empire.

A similar comparison would be if the USA was occupied, but patriots still held TX, AK & HI. Would the war be over?

A second and very important point is this: because Hitler had driven out all the Jews, the Nazis never even began preliminary investigations into atomic weapons.

While the US was of course first, both FR & UK were were right behind. While we can't re-write history, without the development of atomic weapons, the Germans were going to be eventually defeated.

100 posted on 11/13/2018 1:20:48 PM PST by semantic
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