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Houston Taqueria Shooting: Legally Justified Killing or Simply an Execution?
Legal Insurrection ^ | 01-10-2023 | Andrew Branca

Posted on 01/11/2023 10:17:36 AM PST by absalom01

The question now, of course, is whether the shooter’s use of deadly defensive force to stop Washington’s armed robbery was justified on the legal merits.

The answer? Yes, maybe, and almost certainly not.

Confused yet? Let’s clarify.

 

BASICS OF LEGAL JUSTIFICATION FOR USE OF DEADLY FORCE UNDER TEXAS LAW

Shooting someone dead is, of course, normally a crime. Under Texas law, and the law of every other state, however, the use of deadly force upon another might be legally justified, and not a crime, if it meets the conditions for deadly force defense of persons—meaning either defense of self or defense of others. ...

Importantly, the legal conditions for justification must be met for each individual use of deadly force in the encounter—meaning, in this case, for each round fired by the shooter–and that’s where we arrive at the “yes, maybe, and almost certainly not” nature of whether this shooting is lawful.

The bottom line, of the nine rounds fired by the shooter at Washington, the first four were almost certainly legally justified, the second four may be legally justified, and the ninth and final shot almost certainly was not justified, based upon the only evidence currently available to us, which is the surveillance video of the encounter.

 

 

For purposes of this commentary and legal analysis, I’ll be addressing the shooter’s use of force as three distinct use of force events, each needing their own legal justification in order to be lawful.

Use-of-Force #1: The first four shots fired, roughly from the start of the video to 0:10 seconds.

Use-of-Force #2: The second four shots fired, roughly from 0:10 to 0:14 seconds in the video.

Use-of-Force #3: The ninth and final shot fired at about 0:16 seconds in the video.

 


(Excerpt) Read more at legalinsurrection.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events; US: Texas
KEYWORDS: banglist; ccw; deadlyforce
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To: tnlibertarian
I look at it this way: if the robber had come into the restaurant and not robbed people, would he have been shot and killed by the customer?

If he was waiving around a gun, but didn't rob anyone? Yes.

101 posted on 01/11/2023 12:00:48 PM PST by Yo-Yo (Is the /Sarc tag really necessary? Pray for President Biden: Psalm 109:8)
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To: Carl Vehse

“How do you know?”

Beyond a reasonable doubt. If a reasonable person could conclude the shooter had reason to believe the bastard was already dead, then the prosecution would have failed to convince the jury.

I’m one of those who would have a very hard time convicting this guy of ANYTHING. In the heat of the moment, might he have gone too far? Maybe. Maybe even probably. But I’d have a REALLY hard time voting to convict him of anything.

Which may be why I wasn’t on the last jury I was called for. If I served, I’d try to follow the law, but in modern America, “the law” has become a suicide pact manipulated for the benefit of the evil. I’d try but I think the shooter did everyone a favor.

BTW - I carry a 5 shot revolver and I HOPE I’d have the self-discipline to obey every aspect of the law. And I pray God that I never need to find out!


102 posted on 01/11/2023 12:07:27 PM PST by Mr Rogers (We're a nation of feelings, not thoughts.)
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To: central_va

“In the so-called wild west shooting anyone in the back, even a criminal, got you a rope necktie.”

Not big on real history, eh?


103 posted on 01/11/2023 12:08:22 PM PST by Mr Rogers (We're a nation of feelings, not thoughts.)
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To: absalom01
Florida law protects its citizens better than Texas. To wit:

"A person is justified in using or threatening to use deadly force if he or she reasonably believes that using or threatening to use such force is necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the imminent commission of a forcible felony. A person who uses or threatens to use deadly force in accordance with this subsection does not have a duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground if the person using or threatening to use the deadly force is not engaged in a criminal activity and is in a place where he or she has a right to be."

104 posted on 01/11/2023 12:10:14 PM PST by bruoz
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To: DesertRhino

Back shooters are cowards.


105 posted on 01/11/2023 12:14:39 PM PST by central_va (I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn...)
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To: central_va

Bullshit.


106 posted on 01/11/2023 12:15:33 PM PST by NorthMountain (... the right of the peopIe to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed)
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To: central_va

Seriously!? That was not a boxing match, he was fighting for his life. In a life-or-death situation, I’m going dirty. You can go for the nice eulogy, I’m going home to my family.


107 posted on 01/11/2023 12:18:15 PM PST by stevio (Fight until you die.)
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To: Gay State Conservative

The coup de gras was administered. The question is was the armed robber already dead when the last shot was fired?

Forensics can actually figure that out. If he was dead it’s moot.


108 posted on 01/11/2023 12:20:21 PM PST by Clutch Martin ("The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right." )
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To: Gay State Conservative
From what I saw one shot would have been justified...maybe even two.

Then what? You're just watching a video, you weren't there with your body charged with adrenaline while another potential victim was sitting at a table at the back left corner of the video.

What do you think he was thinking as the thug was advancing towards him with a gun?

You certainly wouldn't qualify as an expert witness since it's unlikely you ever experienced a life threatening event as that. And if you were there, I doubt you would have yelled at the samaritan to stop shooting after the first or second shot.........LOL!

109 posted on 01/11/2023 12:21:48 PM PST by Hot Tabasco
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To: stevio

The back shooter was sitting at a table and the loser was leaving heading for the door.. I SAW the video. I could be wrong. A jury is NOT going to like this.


110 posted on 01/11/2023 12:25:05 PM PST by central_va (I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn...)
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To: 9YearLurker
The last shot, at least, was a guarantee of execution. deadly threat terminated.
111 posted on 01/11/2023 12:28:04 PM PST by Hot Tabasco
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To: NorthMountain

He’s a coward, whether or not he is a second degree murderer will be up to a jury. Definitely it was not first degree murder.


112 posted on 01/11/2023 12:28:20 PM PST by central_va (I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn...)
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To: bruoz

Very close to the law in Texas, where there is also no duty to retreat.

See TPC Sections 9.31 and 9.32

As a random aside, it often surprises people to learn that ultra-liberal California also does not impose a duty to retreat for lawful self-defense.

Critical to know the law.


113 posted on 01/11/2023 12:30:16 PM PST by absalom01 (You should do your duty in all things. You cannot do more, and you should never wish to do less.)
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To: Ez2BRepub

Some years back in Tampa a homeowner found a dead guy in his driveway. When the police arrived, an elderly gentleman walked up and said that he had shot the guy because the man had suddenly jumped out of the bushes and tried to rob him. The police asked why he hadn’t remained at the scene. The gentleman explained that he was walking home after grocery shopping and he didn’t want his ice cream to melt so he had continued home.


114 posted on 01/11/2023 12:31:27 PM PST by bruoz
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To: absalom01

Citizens are not professionally trained LEOs and these lefties who come after people who act in self defense are criminals themselves. Only criminals believe in disarming honest people. When someone pulls a weapon and threatens to harm others that person has forfeited all rights in that moment. If some citizen acts maybe too zealously in self defense, that’s just too bad.

But the judges and prison guards need jobs. Thus all the fake angst over criminals being blown away.


115 posted on 01/11/2023 12:31:38 PM PST by Seruzawa ("The Political left is the Garden of Eden of incompetence" - Marx the Smarter (Groucho))
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To: DesertRhino; central_va

There is a hero shop-keeper here in Washington state that stopped a mall shooter. He ran to the shots with his gun in his holster. Saw the shooter, pulled his gun and yelled at the shooter to stop - shooter shot him and he is paralyzed for life.

However, after being confronted the shooter did stop shooting and he ran and hid in a store and the police found him quickly.

Never saw the shouted warning as a wise thing to do with a gun already in their hand. That next “moved muscle” might be the trigger finger with the gun pointed at a person.

And pulling a gun on a bad guy with his gun in your face is a bad idea. The old guy in the video waited for his chance and took it.


116 posted on 01/11/2023 12:31:40 PM PST by 21twelve (Ever Vigilant. Never Fearful.)
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To: Fido969
He either shouldn’t come forward

He already has and is cooperating with the authorities.

117 posted on 01/11/2023 12:32:37 PM PST by Hot Tabasco
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To: central_va

You’re making yourself look even stupider than usual with that “coward” nonsense.


118 posted on 01/11/2023 12:33:15 PM PST by NorthMountain (... the right of the peopIe to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed)
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To: Ez2BRepub

Some years back in Tampa a homeowner found a dead guy in his driveway. When the police arrived, an elderly gentleman walked up and said that he had shot the guy because the man had suddenly jumped out of the bushes and tried to rob him. The police asked why he hadn’t remained at the scene. The gentleman explained that he was walking home after grocery shopping and he didn’t want his ice cream to melt so he had continued home.


119 posted on 01/11/2023 12:33:24 PM PST by bruoz
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To: 21twelve

This “shooter” had a fake gun and wasn’t an active “shooter”. BIG DIFFERENCE.


120 posted on 01/11/2023 12:33:53 PM PST by central_va (I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn...)
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