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THE HISTORY OF THE SECOND AMENDMENT
Second Amendment Law Library - Valparaiso U. Law Review ^ | FR post 09-04-01 | David E. Vandercoy

Posted on 09/04/2001 6:14:22 PM PDT by vannrox

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To: backhoe
Thank you.
41 posted on 01/31/2002 11:52:25 AM PST by Double Tap
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To: Double Tap
GTBOS ( glad to be of service! )--
42 posted on 01/31/2002 12:04:41 PM PST by backhoe
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To: vannrox
I would have sworn that I bumped this way back when.

Signed, dazed and confused.

5.56mm

43 posted on 01/31/2002 12:09:08 PM PST by M Kehoe
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To: philman_36
Dude! Thanks for the flag
44 posted on 02/02/2002 6:01:14 PM PST by AtticusX
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To: D Joyce
Emailed to self.
I'm having a DUH! moment here!
45 posted on 02/03/2002 5:20:29 AM PST by philman_36
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To: AtticusX; 76Tiger
An endless search continuing AtticusX. It's all out there somewhere...GTBOS
76Tiger, I liked your uncorrected naming better.
46 posted on 02/03/2002 5:26:22 AM PST by philman_36
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To: Mercuria
My pleasure. GTBOS to you also. I see you flagged several to view also.
47 posted on 02/03/2002 5:31:16 AM PST by philman_36
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To: vannrox
Thank you for an excellent post. I very much appreciate the footnotes included. Bookmarked and printed.
48 posted on 02/03/2002 5:42:47 AM PST by M.K. Borders
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To: Mercuria
I find it strange that your reply didn't get to me. It isn't in my Self-Search list at all, I've double checked, yet there it is nonetheless. Perhaps you've got me spelled incorrectly on your list and that's why I didn't see it. I've gotten your AnnaZ flags, but for some reason not the one on this thread...thus my lateness in responding.
49 posted on 02/03/2002 5:45:25 AM PST by philman_36
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Comment #50 Removed by Moderator

To: D Joyce
I meant to say thanks and that you gave me a good means for verification of authenticity for any e-mails that I might choose to send out in the future where "document origin" might be called into question. Kind of like a copyright I suppose. Maybe someone more versed in that area of expertise will come along and aid my ignorance.
Sending it to oneself in e-mail seems like a perfect means as one's own e-mail address would preceed any others and also establishes a timeline.
51 posted on 02/03/2002 8:44:32 AM PST by philman_36
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Comment #52 Removed by Moderator

To: sig226
I'm not claiming the $1,000, but the Supreme Court has ruled that the 2nd Amendment only applies to Congress. I don't understand why the Fourtheenth Amendment does not apply.
The second and tenth counts [intent to hinder and prevent the exercise by the same persons of the 'right to keep and bear arms for a lawful purpose.'] are equally defective. The right there specified is that of 'bearing arms for a lawful purpose.' This is not a right granted by the Constitution. Neither is it in any manner dependent upon that instrument for its existence. The second amendment declares that it shall not be infringed; but this, as has been seen, means no more than that it shall not be infringed by Congress. This is one of the amendments that has no other effect than to restrict the powers of the national government, leaving the people to look for their protection against any violation by their fellow-citizens of the rights it recognizes...
United States v. Cruikshank 1876

53 posted on 02/03/2002 1:55:08 PM PST by Looking for Diogenes
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To: vannrox
Extraordinary scholarship. Bookmarked and filed. Will bump once a day or so to keep this in circulation.
54 posted on 02/03/2002 2:19:08 PM PST by facedown
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To: philman_36;SandManBR;NYThymes;BlueDogDemo;LSJohn
Here's a keeper guys.
55 posted on 02/03/2002 4:47:17 PM PST by AtticusX
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To: Looking for Diogenes
The reference is an old, 19th century one. In those days, the court made it clear, as did the congress, that the constitution granted no rights. It affirmed rights that were given by God.

In US v. Cruikshank, et al., the court found this about the second amendment: " . . .this is one of the amendments that has no effect than to restrict the powers of the national government." This was decided in 1875.

In Presser v. Illinois, the court repeated itself. The second amendment, " . . . is only a limitation upon the power of Congress and the national government, and not upon that of the states."

It is fundamental to this argument to understand the nature of the Cruikshank prosecution. Cruikshank, et al. were white supremecist, murderous scum bags. Levi Nelson and Alexander Tillman were two black men who were travelling to a political meeting to discuss a candidate. They armed themselves with shotguns, due to the times. Cruikshank and his gang accosted them. They determined Nelson and Tillman's purpose. They took away their guns. They beat them. They murdered them so they could not vote.

Can you imagine the righteous outrage that would surround such an act today? The fed's jumped into the prosecution under 14th amendment grounds. Cruikshank et al. denied Nelson and Tillman their right to vote, their first amendment right to assemble, and their second amendment right to keep and bear arms. Can you also imagine the federal government prosecuting people for denying someone their second amendment rights?

And the court held, ". . .this is one of the amendments that has no effect than to restrict the powers of the national government." In other words, the bill of rights acts only to restrict the actions of the federal government. It has no bearing on any other entity. Under this ruling, the KKK is just dandy.

Worse than that, this ruling dispenses with the states' obligations to follow the law. Under Cruikshank, and all the other second amendment decisions, they're saying that as long as the entity is the state police, not the feds, they may imprison you without cause (habeus corpus). They can torture you for interrogation and for punishment. They can force you to bear witness against yourself. They can invent laws to bar your conduct and convict you after the fact(ex post facto). They can taint your family and punish them for your crime(bill of attainder and corruption of blood).

All of these things are barred the federal government under the constitution. Until the 1930's ( I don't recall the decision) they were not applied to the state governments.

That's what those decisions say.

US v Cruikshank, et al.

56 posted on 02/03/2002 7:20:04 PM PST by sig226
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To: D Joyce
Bookmarked (but e-mail is a great idea!)
57 posted on 02/03/2002 7:23:37 PM PST by 4CJ
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Comment #58 Removed by Moderator

To: sig226
Thanks for the background. By itself, the decision is almost inexplicable.
59 posted on 02/04/2002 7:14:20 AM PST by Looking for Diogenes
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To: vannrox
bump
60 posted on 02/04/2002 7:24:44 AM PST by Mat_Helm
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