The Bottom of the "Slippery Slope"

9/27/01 | Pakrman

[cristo40]

I must differ with you; As one who has worn the uniform, I would gladly do so again to protect my country. My son asked me the other day if we do go to war will I get called back to active duty. I told him that I would volunteer but not to woory the Air Force probably does not need the services of an overweight 40 year old. But the point is that there are literally millions of men just like me who would die if necesary to defend tyhe principles upon which this country was founded. Yes, we have in recent years grown apathetic, and complacent, and concerned only with ourselves. but this is not a permannent condition, as we are now seeing. Please feel free to email me with comments.

[Storm Orphan]

Last time I checked we didn't shoot theives.

"We" don't. I do. And it's legal in Texas.

Suppose someone stole some bread because their children were going hungry...just suppose...would you shoot them?"

Your need does not constitute a just claim on my property.

[Pakrman]

Oh we have the ability to defend and retaliate, of that I have no doubt, but the question that bugs me the most is how many do we have to kill to call it a victory? We will never get these terrorists to capitulate like Germany did, they will never surrender on the deck of a battleship as the Japanese did.

The audacity of their attack serves notice that these guys are dead serious about winning, about making us back down, about putting America in it's place.

[Pakrman]

"Your need does not constitute a just claim on my property. "
Just answer the question...would you shoot someone who stole bread for their hungry child?

[Storm Orphan]

You evade the point at hand. You demanded equality of outcome.

I reminded you the only guarantee you have of equality is equality before the law.

Equality of outcome requires a violation of individual rights.

[Storm Orphan]

I don't care if it's for their starving grandmother.

If you break into my house you are simply committing suicide. I don't care whether you want a crumb of bread
or to rape my wife. If you break into my house you show you have no respect for my property, and hence will show no respect for my life.

Once you violate my property rights, I don't care what your motives are.

[Pakrman]

"You evade the point at hand. You demanded equality of outcome. "
I do not. I demand an equal voice in that court and my voice does not carry the same weight as those who purchase large legal firms to say their piece - those whose "position" offers them certain protections from some prosecutions.

[jwalsh07]

I agree with you concerning people respecting the troops. Just want to keep it all clear.

[an amused spectator]

HOW ARE WE GOING TO WIN? What are the victory conditions in this war?

After reading over this post, I've come to the conclusion that you're very confused. Tell me, do you live in the big city, or are you a country boy?

I'm guessing city. Over the last couple of weeks, I've been marveling at the "judgement" of our attackers.

If they would have nuked Des Moines, The Big Apple and The Left Coast would probably have yawned.

Instead, the terror boys decided to kill thousands of registered, voting Blue Zoners.

Now, The Blue Zone has got patriotism, AND religion - two things they would have scoffed at a month ago.

We Heartland country folk have always been "ready to roll" against this country's enemies. Now, our brothers and sisters on the coasts have rediscovered their true allegiance.

May God have mercy on the murderers, because they ain't getting any from us.

[NewLand]

Your comment to Long Cut...

"...your world has just one lane and it is your way or nothing"

...again, this is self desciptive on your part. You show zero commitment to principle. This is the lazy man's way of getting their own way all the time. You appear to be a Grand Master of this "art".

People like Long Cut who make a commitment to SERVE are the epitomy of compromise and tolerance...because they do so out of their own will to be led and directed by others in order that we all can be protected, and thus benefit.

That concept is also known as SACRIFICE. Please describe your most recent committment to something that required sacrifice on your part, where others besides yourself benefitted? If you cannot, then you have no place blaming the world around you.

[Storm Orphan]

You demanded equality of outcome. "

I do not.

From your original post: Prosperity must apply to all in our nation or it really applies to no one

From your second response: Until the playing field is level, there will always be a great many dividing lines in the society - don't try to tell me that everyone in the country "plays fair" and everyone has exactly the same OPPORTUNITY as everyone else - that is just not true and you know it.
21 Posted on 09/27/2001 19:25:46 PDT by Pakrman

The only thing the goverment is supposed to guarantee is equal protection under the law.
It fails in that sometimes, but that is all you get.

You have demanded equality of opportunity. You can't have it. Some are born richer, smarter, or luckier than others. Government can't help that, nor should it.

[Pakrman]

"I don't care if it's for their starving grandmother. "

and that just about says it all...

Thank you all for a lovely debate. I am very glad it was kept clean, and full of usefull information. I wish you all the best in the future, and God Bless America.

[Storm Orphan]

No problem. I know we're on the same page on that issue.

And I am against them serving openly, too.

[Storm Orphan]

Please explain how one person's pitiful need constitutes a just claim on the property of another?

Are you saying theft is justified?

[Pakrman]

"HOW ARE WE GOING TO WIN? What are the victory conditions in this war? "

No one touches this question at all

[Pakrman]

"And I am against them serving openly, too. "
just curious - who is "them"

[Storm Orphan]

Unrelated issue from a thread that was pulled.

I ask you again, Please explain how one person's need constitutes a just claim on the property of another.

[Pakrman]

"Please explain how one person's pitiful need constitutes a just claim on the property of another? Are you saying theft is justified? "

I don't really believe that you would shoot someone for stealing bread for their child or grandmother..I just don't believe your hear is that cold.
No, theft is not justified, but keeping people starving and thirsty is not justified either, and this country has played those games with other nations and we will continue to do so in the future, famine and thirst are powerful political weapons we wield just as we toss smart bombs.

[Conservative til I die]

Starved for attention, huh.

[Pakrman]

"Unrelated issue from a thread that was pulled. "
who is them?
who do you not like