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How the Civil War Could Have Been Avoided
vanity | 10/31/01 | vanity

Posted on 10/31/2001 4:13:33 AM PST by smolensk

Being one who definitely thinks that our Civil War was an unnecessary loss of life and property, I have finally figured out how the South could have averted war, and stopped Northern aggression in its tracks.

You see the South possessed a 'secret weapon' that it didn't realize it had. What the South should have done, in the late 1850's, is to have realized that slavery was a dying institution anyway and that it could get by for the time being with half or a third less slaves than it had.

The South could have granted immediate freedom to half of its slave population with the condition that after manumission they couldn't remain in the South, but would have to move up North. If politically astute, the South could have 'spun' this relocation requirement as simply a way of spreading 'diversity' to the North.

With this, the abolitionist movement up North would have stopped 'dead in its tracks', in my opinion, and over 700,000 lives would have been saved, and all slaves would have been gained freedom anyway before 1900 due to international pressure.


TOPICS: Editorial; Political Humor/Cartoons
KEYWORDS: dixie
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To: LLAN-DDEUSANT
Well, your wrong on several counts re "illegal" actions, etc. You may have some ground to stand on re those states that entered after the original colonies. But that was NOT deliniated in the SCOTUS decision and is thus a moot point in terms of the discussion.
101 posted on 11/01/2001 5:20:40 AM PST by Lee'sGhost
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To: LLAN-DDEUSANT
Oh I don't know. I'm a classic product of Southern education--pretty average in fact.
102 posted on 11/01/2001 5:21:43 AM PST by Savage Beast
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To: GritsDaily
This is very interesting--your evaluation and Steele's. It has a ring of truth.
103 posted on 11/01/2001 5:29:56 AM PST by Savage Beast
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To: Non-Sequitur
LMAO. You said or quoted nothing to refute my point.

"Opinion" is totally what this is about, yours, mine, the Supreme Courts, everybody's. What, you don't think the SCOTUS has never reversed itself -- it's "opinions?" Convenient that you do not acknowledge my point that the court was stacked -- how could it not be in 1869?! -- the basis upon which it is likely the court would and could reverse the weak branch upon which you stake your "opinion." Duh.

Your just another one of those egg heads who make general statements and then insult the poster.

Live with it? No problem, it's easy when you know you are right.

104 posted on 11/01/2001 5:31:29 AM PST by Lee'sGhost
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Comment #105 Removed by Moderator

Comment #106 Removed by Moderator

To: GritsDaily
Well, to begin with... People should not learn that it's a good idea to silence free speech. (E.g.--to shout down unpopular speakers on college campuses--or prevent them from speaking.)

Actually, what I said is pretty much the opposite of fundamentalism.

You're right. The U.S. needs more education in many specific fields--language skills, weapons of mass destruction, etc., et al. It also needs less indoctrination of the kind that blares constantly on television and throughout many U.S. college campuses--"Liberal" (nothing to do with "liberal" as freedom loving or free thinking)--decadent--self defeating--confused--dangerous--

I'm not falling behind economically or socially... If I were, how would you know? I'm certainly not embarrassed... And I haven't failed... Quite the opposite.

That bit about "touchy, narcissistic sensibility" is downright stupid. I won't bother to comment.

You have a silly tendency to jump to conclusions--and to some very silly conclusions.

Everything you said in this post (#105) was just plain dumb. I'm sure you can do better that that.

107 posted on 11/01/2001 6:06:10 AM PST by Savage Beast
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To: Republic of Texas
Hood? Are you kidding? Every move he made was a disaster. Now if you need a Texan, let's talk about Sam Houston.
108 posted on 11/01/2001 6:07:34 AM PST by stainlessbanner
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To: smolensk
The people of the south could have simply said absolutly no northerners can travel to Disney World unless a full surrendor occurs.
109 posted on 11/01/2001 6:11:35 AM PST by JIM O
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To: tpaine
Right On! That was a hard hittin' blow from the boys in gray....
110 posted on 11/01/2001 6:15:00 AM PST by stainlessbanner
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To: Liberty Ship
when Davis relieved Johnston after the Battle of Atlanta, the command was given to Hood

That will come as news to Johnston who on the order of Jefferson Davis was sent the following telegram on July 17, 1864:

...Lieut. Gen. J.B. Hood has been commissioned to the temporary rank of general ... as you have failed to arrest the advance of the enemy to the vicinity of Atlanta ... you are hereby relieved from the command of the Army and Department of Tennessee, which you will immediately turn over to General Hood.

The Battle of Atlanta is generally given a date of July 22, after which the city was under siege until its evacuation in early September. General Hood was commander of the Confederate forces there from July 18th.

111 posted on 11/01/2001 6:18:23 AM PST by catpuppy
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To: LLAN-DDEUSANT
Using your logic, the South had every right to secede because the Constitution does not state the obvious fact that any entity that willingly joins a union certainly has the right to quit it. Of course it's not in the Constitution, it's too obvious!

Interesting quandry you find yourself in. Either admit that the ommission in the court ruling IS PERTINENT, or admit that the fact that the right to secession was left out because it was a "simple and obvious fact."

God this is easy. I can win on your terms or mine. I love it.

112 posted on 11/01/2001 6:21:22 AM PST by Lee'sGhost
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To: catpuppy
You are, of course, correct, Sir! I misspoke.
113 posted on 11/01/2001 6:41:51 AM PST by Liberty Ship
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To: LLAN-DDEUSANT
In Massachsetts, the blacks before the Civil War were better educated than Southern Senators, and most of those were still better educated than most southerners today. Sadly, out southern dominated government has spread the Southern model of bad education throughout the Northeast.

No, you don't know YOUR history! See the statistics by McPherson in his book 'Ordeal by Fire' regarding the educational levels across the US. I suppose you might find a small fraction of a percantage of blacks who were highly educated, I'm not disputing that, but I'm looking at the whole, and you are looking at rare exceptions to the rule.

114 posted on 11/01/2001 6:48:21 AM PST by smolensk
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To: smolensk
Interesting theory but, of course, the slaves were in the South were there for a reason, namely to fill the coffers and the vanity needs of their white masters. By the 1850s, people in the South did not regard slavery as a dying institution and they were going to their best to keep it that way!
115 posted on 11/01/2001 6:52:53 AM PST by Austin Willard Wright
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To: tpaine
Then why didn't they present their case to the supreme court, get a ruling, & withdraw legally? They never even bothered to try too dissolve the union in a constitutional manner, because they knew they had no just, legal, case to present.

Because it is something you 'Yankees' can't understand. A king doesn't ask his subjects for permission to eat does he? Well, body of higher sovereinty doesn't have to go and ask permission of a lower entity to exercise that higher sovereinty.

And tell me this? Even if what you say is true, then why didn't the northeastern states who were meeting to secede from the Union in 1814 (over their disatisfaction with the War of 1812) plan to go to the Supreme Court and ask for permission? The only reason they didn't follow thru with secession is because Jefferson was able to bring the war to a close.

So what you espouse is 'bull'.

116 posted on 11/01/2001 6:53:32 AM PST by smolensk
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To: Cagey
"I'll lend you my time machine when I'm done with it. I'm using it right now to prevent the French Revolution."

You got yourself a Hindsight Device?
No $hit?
(i know...take Exlax.}

What model you using; the new *20.20*, or one of the older, outa focus models?

This guy & his *insight*?
He's gonna be real shocked to learn just how many experts are converging at this very instant to have themselves a field day.

117 posted on 11/01/2001 7:02:07 AM PST by Landru
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To: Austin Willard Wright
slaves were in the South were there for a reason, namely to fill the coffers and the vanity needs of their white masters

Actually, it had more to do with agriculture, weather, and landscape than white supremacy. Ever try to grow cotton up north, city-boy?

118 posted on 11/01/2001 7:46:03 AM PST by stainlessbanner
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To: smolensk
Your ability to reason seems to have deserted you. - 'You just can't understand' and 'bull', are laughable replies.

As to the 'rebels' of 1812, you answered yourself, - they won their point.

119 posted on 11/01/2001 8:01:16 AM PST by tpaine
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To: Lee'sGhost
The fact that you are overlooking is that when it comes to the interpretation of the Constitution the only opinion that matters it the Supreme Court's, not yours. And unless that decision is reversed by a later court then their decision is the law. And their decision was that secession was and is illegal. You will have to deal with that.

I notice that you fall back on that same old lame argument that the court was biased. Well this was the same court that issued the decision in Ex Parte Milligan which ruled that Lincoln was wrong in suspending habeas corpus in Indiana during the war. I suppose, since it was the same court, that the decision then was wrong and biased in your view as well?

If you keep patting yourself on the back the way you are, proclaiming that you are right even though you show no evidence, you are liable to pull something.

120 posted on 11/01/2001 8:08:59 AM PST by Non-Sequitur
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