Breaking News: Cardinal Law to resign

[Royal Guardsman]

On CNN now

[O6ret]

I don't really appreciate some of the Catholic bashing that goes around on this site.

I don't really agree that it is Catholic bashing. But whatever you wish to call it, the criticism was (and is) much deserved.

At virtually every level, from predator parish priests to culpable cardinals, the RCC as an institution has failed the very people that they would profess to serve. In many instances it has been proven that they were only serving themselves.

Moreover, aside from those such as Law (who are as guilty as the perps for aiding and abetting their criminal activities) the silent parish priests, the ones who knew but looked the other way, must also share the blame.

The common denominator is leadership. More pointedly, a failure in leadership.

The audit trail starts in many Podunk parishes and can be traced right on up to Rome. Through it all the RCC leadership has demonstrated a willingness to tolerate this little "secret" of theirs. Even as it grew more and more out of control, and their efforts to hide it failed, they did nothing to stop it. They did nothing to get at the root of it. They did nothing to protect the people. They were only interested, it seems, in protecting themselves.

Instead of searching for a solution they implemented a policy of secrecy and played a shell game with the guilty. And when that began to fail, but even while the problem was spreading, they threw money at it. And then more money. Money that wasn't theirs!!

And now that the scandal is broken wide open and they realize that there isn't enough money, they want to declare bankruptcy, which is nothing more than a legal ploy designed to once more deny the rightful complaints of those who have been assaulted.

And most confounding, in the face of all this, they are still stonewalling. They can't seem to find the collective resolve (or voices) to rid themselves of this evil. To disinfect every Podunk parish; to cast out every predatory priest; to follow every lead, even if the thread winds its way through the basilicas and cathedrals; to cleanse the seminaries.

Catholic bashing indeed!

[ImphClinton]

Catholic Clergy reminds me of the Capitol One add.

A bunch of monkeys living LARGE on other's money.

Law's lifestyle could support thousands if not millions of poor people throughout the world.

[Atlantian]

Will Law stay in Rome and avoid the mess?

[rightwingbob]

Its about time this shmuck resigned. He is a disgrace to Christianity. He should be arrested as well, for his aiding and abetting of child molesters.

[Cousin Eddie]

I believe the "Catholic bashing" referred to has to do with the bashing of the faith itself as opposed to the people in the hierachy.
There is plenty of blame so spread toward many in the clergy regarding the scandal, but when people on FR start claiming that Catholics aren't Christians, that we worship Mary (not so!), that we're heretics, etc., etc., that's Catholic bashing.

Listen, I'm a Roman Catholic. I'm not an evangelical, an Episcopal, a Baptist, a Lutheran, a Jew, a Muslim, a Morman, or anything else; but I respect other's right to practice their faith. Obviously I disagree with some tenets of other faiths (or else I would join that other faith), but I don't disparage their beliefs or faith. I do not claim that any non-Cathlic Christian is not a Christian with some stupid argument such as "Catholicism was the original and the rest left the 'true faith'." That would be absurd and I don't believe it. But it is a fact that Catholic bashing exists on Free Republic aside from anything to do with the molestation scandal.

[Argus]

One bishop down, about a hundred to go.

[MissAmericanPie]

Yeah, I heard he was going to open the "Love em and Leave em" day care center.

[Man of the Right]

I revere the Catholic faith and the Pope. I'm a Protestant. Also, I'd like to see the most aggressive criminal prosecution of Law in legal history.

[MattAMiller]

I'm not Catholic, or religious. But this stuff pains me. It's nice to think that there was a body of people who devoted there lives to good works, who were dependably honest and loyal to a strict moral creed. I don't agree with much of it. But I thought they could be trusted to live it.

Many (most?) still can I think. But there's obviously something deeply wrong.

[George W. Bush]

There is plenty of blame so spread toward many in the clergy regarding the scandal, but when people on FR start claiming that Catholics aren't Christians, that we worship Mary (not so!), that we're heretics, etc., etc., that's Catholic bashing.

In some regions of the country, Catholics themselves are the ones who claim they aren't Christians. It's a cultural separation thing. They'll say things like "I'm not Christian, I'm Catholic". Of course, they're not denying Christ, merely an association with non-Roman churches. Oh, and you may not worship Mary yourself but I do think that some Catholics do judging by some of the loopy things they write. That's a problem internal to your church so deal with it yourself. And doctrinal bashing is hardly restricted to only the church of Rome. Mormons and Muslims and Baptists and liberal Protestants get a heaping share as do the Arminian and Calvinist strains in all the non-Roman churches. And we see spirited (sometimes mean-spirited) criticism of particular churches from both outsiders and from within their own conservative ranks here at FR. For instance, you may resent Rome-bashing by non-Roman sources but you also have to deal with criticism of Rome from liberal RC's and from traditionalists. They're all here at good ol' FR.

Good says me.

It's healthy.

If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen and quit yer bitchin'. If your hierarchy likes to claim exclusive franchise to salvation, then you drag all Christians into these matters. Protestants don't get in that situation because they can't (but the same things would happen to us if our leadership was in the same position with a similar hierarchical control system).

The religious discussion threads here at FR are vital to FR's health. Even many conservatives fail to recognize it. I certainly once did.

No discussion of liberty and the innate rights of man can be literate or informed without recognizing the essentially Christian nature of the God-given rights of a free and godfearing people. The Founders knew this well and still nearly made the mistake of introducing state-sponsored religion.

Here at FR, a little doctrinal scrapping is to be expected provided it isn't unrelentingly rude or results in stalking other posters from thread to thread. Another thing that I've found is that disputing with others here at FR over doctrinal matters actually has given me a deeper appreciation for the history of these disputes and the motives of those who began various strains of doctrinal belief.

[BunnySlippers]

Please clarify. You provide no link so is it the previous "Cardinal Law OFFERS to Resign" or Cardinal Law Resigns which is TOTALLY different?

[RnMomof7]

In some regions of the country, Catholics themselves are the ones who claim they aren't Christians. It's a cultural separation thing. They'll say things like "I'm not Christian, I'm Catholic". Of course, they're not denying Christ,

I live in such an area..Catholics here say that to distinguish themselves from the 10% or so that is not Catholic..LOL

If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen and quit yer bitchin'. If your hierarchy likes to claim exclusive franchise to salvation, then you drag all Christians into these matters. Protestants don't get in that situation because they can't (but the same things would happen to us if our leadership was in the same position with a similar hierarchical control system).

Amen

[Cousin Eddie]

First reply got lost, here goes again.

1. Catholics who say "I'm Catholic, not Chirstian" often has to do with semantics. If people are talking about evangelicals, then it's natural to say this...meaning "I'm not an evangelical Chirstian." It goes without saying in some conversations.

2. There's nothing wrong with spirited discussion about doctrine...it's healthy and I agree it often promotes better understanding of various faiths. I was referring to the vitriol sometimes displayed on FR towards many faiths, not just Catholics. Frankly, freepers can do better. For example, we don't need to be told we're going to hell and that we're heritics along with Jews, traditional Protestants, Hindus, etc. because we haven't become 'born again' the way a particular freeper defines 'born again'. (Please don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that only evangelicals bash other faiths...I've seen supposed Catholics bash other faiths here on FR...it's all wrong. You're correct, we do have loopy Catholics...every faith has them.) I love a spirited discussion as much as the next person, but if the person on the other side wants to treat me as the scum of the earth, I've got better things to do. My point is that there are some freepers (albeit a tiny minority) that love to bash one faith or another, and it's a waste of bandwidth and people's time. It's also wrong.

3. The 'exclusive franchise on salvation' was written by a controversial cardinal. He doesn't have the final say, just as Al Haig didn't have the final say for Reagan and O'Neil didn't have it for Bush. There are people in every institution that don't tow the 'party line.' Personally I don't personally know any Catholics that espouse that view (obviously I can't read people's minds). Obviously there are some who believe it (heck there are people in nearly every religion who believe that outsiders can't attain salvation). I certainly don't and every Catholic I've ever spoken to thinks that Cardinal was wrongheaded.

[George W. Bush]

3. The 'exclusive franchise on salvation' was written by a controversial cardinal.

Reread Dominie Iesus. The bishop of Rome seems to differ with you in this matter. Those misguided non-Roman evangelicals who signed ECT eventually discovered this as well. If you think it through, Rome really cannot hold any other position. Their doctrinal system really does require it. Rome has many times described itself as "always the same". For those who read the history of the various churches, we know this and don't expect anything else. Given their doctrine, Rome isn't free to change their claim.

Actually, much as I disagree with the doctrine of the Roman church, I don't believe anything can stand in the way of the Father if He has determined to extend His grace to save any man, whether he attends no church or a Roman church or any other. We Calvinists are pretty big on God's sovereignty that way.

If we more doctrinally-rabid Baptists/evangelicals/Protestants were to succeed in more or less imposing every doctrinal correction we might wish upon the church of Rome, that alone could not save a single soul. Sometimes in an FR debate, even some Calvinists seem to believe that correct doctrine suffices to salvation. But it can't. It is God's own Holy Spirit that draws men to Him, not the particular reading of any man's reading of the Word.

Salvation always remains in God's hands and that should be sufficient cause for any of us to reflect that however strongly we may feel we have discovered an ancient and universal truth of Christian belief or practice or sacrament, that God remains sovereign and He saves who He wills, at His discretion. Whether we like it or not or whether we think any particular person or organization is worthy of His effort. It's funny how that works. God is no respecter of men. Especially of those who claim to be His spokesmen. He seems able to speak well enough for Himself through His Word and His Spirit to those to whom He has given ears to hear and eyes to see.

[BunnySlippers]

I've been warching the news shows tonight and Cardinal Law has not yet indicated that he is going to resign. He MAY welll resign but no news yet contrary to the title of this post.

[W1_hooyah]

I'm a devout Catholic in this diocese; very disgusted by this whole thing. I was very proud when I read the letter from 60 area priests calling on Cardinal Above-The-Law to resign, especially when I saw my own pastor as one of those who signed the letter.

[Caipirabob]

Church bathrooms just got a whole lot safer for alter boys.

[Caipirabob]

I can assure you that the subject of the bashing has nothing to do with Catholics but more the enemy infiltration of the Catholic Church by perverts who parade around as Catholics.

It's the true Catholics who serve the Church that are making this "good start" with the Cardinal happen.

[blue jeans]

You may want to see him prosecuted... but I really doubt anything more will happen other than the resignation.

Who knows?

[scannell]

Now it is time for the Pope to step down not due to his age, but due to his complicity in issuing the original instructive memorandum instructing the Bishops to transfer the peophiles if they have been identified and caused a scandal, but to not transfer if they are caught, but it hasn't become a scandal.