CNN Knew of Torture Since 1991 - Did Bill Clinton Know?

NY Times ^ | 4-11-03 | EASON JORDAN

[PhiKapMom]

Interesting! Wonder who is their source -- could it be from within Iraq?

[Hegemony Cricket]

Knowing something in general is MUCH different than having specific knowledge. For example, I KNOW that OJ is the real killer, however, they would not have wanted to hear from me at his trial, because I don't have first-hand, eyewitness knowledge.

Eason Jordan, et al cnn personnel, had specific, first-hand eyewitness knowledge. This alone puts them in a position of being responsible to share this knowledge with the proper authorities. Couple this with their charge as journalists to report the truth, and you can't help but hold them partially responsible for the atrocities that have occurred in Iraq in the last twelve years. Just merely saying, "Well, everybody knew it", doesn't let them off the hook.

[TheSpottedOwl]

If in fact one of them made phone calls to the other, then yes someone would have a record of it. If they knew of this beforehand, I'm sure that they left no evidence behind. I wouldn't put anything past those two.

[the_Watchman]

"Ownership" does not necessarily mean holding the deeds to the property. The Nazi's established firm control over all the industrial capacity of the country. If something is not under your control, then you don't really own it. Mazi's called themselves socialists. I'm willing to take them at their word.

It is assumed that Nazi's were right-wing because they had major fights with the Communists, who were also attempting to take over Germany at the time. This, however, is like claiming that Trotsky must have been right-wing since he and Stalin were mortal enemies.

Perhaps a better, less ambiguous moniker, would be to label them "statists"; i.e., people who believe that the state is of more importance than individuals, who exist for the good of the state.

[TopQuark]

The name is not conclusive by itself --- that is your argument, and it is valid. But to say that a socialist party that is proud of its socialism and carries it on its banner is something else. To say that they were NOT socialist is flatly wrong.

I can tell you were the confusion comes from --- and no, it's not just the liberal plot to hide the true nature of the Nazis.

It is not one street that we have and choose to be on the left or right side of it. There are at least three dimensions: economics, politics, and culture. One can be a fiscal conservative and culturally liberal, for instance --- and that is the proper designation. It is trying to put such a square peg into a round hole that creates confusion.

Consider, for instance, Russian communists today. They are on the right of the spectrum politically, although they belong to the revolutionary, leftist, communist party. Russian nationalists --- a bunch not unlike some of our libertarians --- are cultural conservatives, but they are the revolutionaries now, who want to change everything.

The German Nazis were on the left both economically and politically but their nationalist, racist position placed them firmly on the right culturally. Because this one dimension stands out most of all in the minds of people --- camps, Holocaust, murder of civilians, burning villages of the "lower races" --- the Nazis are perceived as being on the right, as they actually were on this particular dimension.

Observe that this has nothing to do with whether one is a socialist. Marx was a globalist in terms of how the revolution was supposed to come about. Lenin instead was a "nationalist" and developed a theory of a communist revolution in one country." Nobody questions that both of them were dedicated socialists. The dimension of nationalism-internationalism is superimposed on that which defines a socialist. And along that defining dimension, Nazis were socialist and called themselves so.

[Darnright]

Bump

[The_Media_never_lie]

I still just can't believe they would do this. To fail to report torture just so they could maintain a Baghdad studio and enhance ratings.

Say it ain't so, Ted!

[TopQuark]

I think you are exactly right. Witness how Russia, which is much more close to Europe culturally, struggles with democracy for centuries. Until the last decade, it existed there for a few months --- from FEbruary to October of 1917 --- in all of its history. The values placed on individuality vs. community, on the rule of law, etc., are very different in that part of the world. These values endure and outlive even industrial revolutions.

For that reason, I too do not entertain much hope. But if we cannot make much progress it does not mean we cannot make some progress, which we definitely see in the case of Russia, for instance. My main concern is to have there a govenment that is not malevolent to us.

[hoosiermama]

"It's dough, Ted."
Money! money! money! Greed greed greed! Isn't it ironic that the left who deplore capitalism, is often tne greediest.

[Glacier Honey]

I heard / read throughout the day that CNN "fessed" up because they feel quilty or feel it is the right thing to do but does anyone think CNN might have come clean now because they are afraid now that Iraq is free the Bush administration might uncover an even bigger conspiricy? Maybe even involving the Clintons? Wouldn't be the first time someone sacrafised their life of career for the Clintons.

[LauraJean]

The only problem with that is ''why would he wan't to imform her.''

[TheGrimReaper]

I guess CNN didn't adopt ABC's "WE'RE JOURNALISTS FIRST!" policy.

(As in Peter Jennings' excuse why he and his colleagues would not wear a US flag lapel pin on-air)

When the war crimes trials begin.... Mr. Jordan needs to be on hand.

[Pharlap]

Certainly not because of his everlasting love for her. But, because of her political viability. First, last and always both of them are political animals. Remember his letter in which he expressed his loathing for the military. He did not want to serve because of his desire to retain his political viability. Also, quite frankly, because he is a physical coward. But, that's another story.

[houstonian]

Good one.

NO BLOOD FOR RATINGS!!