Fed's attack Texas church and burn it to the ground.....

PBS - WGBH/Frontline ^ | 1995 | PBS

[woollyone]

"...read any CREDIBLE book..."

Yeah supercat...come on now, you know, the ones that the liberal press prints for NPR shows to highlight and help sell.

lol

[ContentiousObjector]

no this whole thing started when heavily armed criminals opened fire on federal law enforcement,

[Cultural Jihad]

What's really, really upsetting is to remember, as we all do daily if not hourly, when Sultan Mehmed the Conqueror captured the Castle of Babovac and ended the Kotromanjic Dynasty and thereby conquered the kingdom of Bosnia in 1463.

[ContentiousObjector]

Christ you guys are lazy,

Watch and learn, http://video.pbs.org:8080/ramgen/wgbh/pages/frontline/waco/chsix_hi.rm

[pupdog]

The Waco massacre is proving to be one of those defining moments in modern America. How people react to the mind-bogglingly barbaric ATF-FBI fiasco in Texas sets the remaining eagles apart from the growing herd of sheep in the United States. You can tell the quality of a person by whether he sputters over the incident or jumps through logical hoops to defend the conduct of "the authorities."

-Get Indepedent, 7/5/99

And that's why I like seeing this topic come up here. It's a fantastic way to find out exactly who at FR is worth listening to and who isn't. So thank you for posting it, and thank you to the apologists, for kindly letting me know that I can henceforth ignore you.

[Vinnie]

Fact: When the ATF showed up the cult members opened fire on them murdering ATF agents in cold blood

Bull----. The Feds pulled up in a canvas covered trailer. They shot the dogs.
Koresh opened the front door w/ a baby in his arms.
One of the agents shot him, killing the baby.
The rest of the agents opened fire on the door as it was closing.
The Davidians opened fire.

Some time later when the agents had enough, they signalled to the Davidians that they were through.
The Davidians ceased firing and allowed the agents to gather the dead and injured and leave.

Once BATF agents had been killed the feds couldn't let them get away with it.

The original raid was a huge fed mistake. They could have arrested Koresh any time he was in town but no, they had to make an example of them.

The raid was to showcase what would happen to any Right wing group that got too militant. IMHO

[ContentiousObjector]

the so called "Liberal Press" is alot more credible than anything put out by the conspiracy theroy industry

[the_daug]

What criminal enterprise did they engage in?

Say "self defence"

[N8VTXNinWV]

Well, all I have to say is (IMHO), unless you've lived in or around Waco, you don't know the Davidians. I lived in Waco and 15 miles from Waco. There was trouble at their "compound" every weekend. They would have shoot-outs all the time, fighting over who was the son of God. I hate that innocent people were killed because of Vernon Howell. But, I know not ALL were innocent of the actions that followed.

[quidnunc]

Josef Stalin wrote: Thats just what the Gestapo and SS wished their populace would embrace. So your point is.........

My point is that is you shoot or threaten to shoot at law enforcement offers under any circumstances it's almost certainly going to turn out very badly for you.

This is a fact regardless of one's attitudes towards federal, state or local police powers.

In the final analysis when you shoot at a cop you become an outlaw.

[bribriagain]

"getting shot in the back while fleeing wasn't an appealing choice"

While I support the FBI, the way the Clinton Justice Dept. handled Waco was nothing short of criminal. Nothing justifies the slaughter of innocent women and children.

[sinkspur]

the differance is those militia groups are sunshine warriors trying to cheat on their taxes, they were not sociopaths prepared to die to get out of filing a tax return

You don't give a sociopath the opportunity to turn into a psychopath.

Howell jogged, he went into town, and he was on good terms with the McLennan County sheriff.

But an obscure Texas sheriff arresting a guy who had stockpiled bunches of guns and who owed taxes wouldn't have been very glamorous, would it?

For the life of me, I don't know why the federal government didn't use local resources to resolve this problem.

Howell wasn't a menace to society; he was just a small-time loser with a bunch of pathetic saps gathered around him with no life.

[supercat]

no this whole thing started when heavily armed criminals opened fire on federal law enforcement,

Was that before or after the law-enforcement entered the premises?

If before, what evidence do you have to back up that claim, especially given that (1) the plan was for disjoint teams to enter the building throwing concussion grenades ahead of them while another team shot the dogs; (2) the teams had no sort of radio or other contact with each other. If after, was the initial entry, as conducted, legal or illegal?

[aruanan]

They are not "unchecked."

Oh? The murderers of all those people (including Randy Weaver's family) are all walking around free. That's pretty unchecked.

[quidnunc]

Vinnie wrote: The raid was to showcase what would happen to any Right wing group that got too militant. IMHO

No, at the time there was serious talk of eliminating the BATF and dividing its duties among other federal law-enforcement agencies.

The raid was intended to be a showcase for the BATF's capabilities and to prove that it was still relevant.

[bribriagain]

"The Feds shot first, and all the Davidians were acquitted of the charge of Murder. Facts are stubborn things.... L"

What he said.

[sinkspur]

I lived in Waco and 15 miles from Waco. There was trouble at their "compound" every weekend. They would have shoot-outs all the time, fighting over who was the son of God.

And the Sheriff handled it, didn't he?

Do you call in the BATF when a local bar has a problem with fighting and mayhem?

Howell was itching to put his apocalyptic vision into motion, and the FBI and BATF, stupidly, gave it to him.

[ContentiousObjector]

Osama Bin Ladens neice is a night club singer, do you want to put her on trial for 9/11?

The 9 survivors were NOT involved in the murder of the federal agents, that is why they were aquited

[nanny]

But an obscure Texas sheriff arresting a guy who had stockpiled bunches of guns and who owed taxes wouldn't have been very glamorous, would it? For the life of me, I don't know why the federal government didn't use local resources to resolve this problem.

As a very sweet black lady that I used to know and loved very much would say , "I 'no 'ats right!!"

Do you remember the neat little tobacco chewing Texan that brought in the 'railroad killer'?

[_Jim]

the work of McNulty should be considered for a National Science Foundation grant

Oh brother - no way!

What McNutty did was *not* in way deserving of reconition or a grant!