PETITION: STOP PAYMENT OF SOCIAL SECURITY TO ILLEGAL ALIENS AND FOREIGN CITIZENS

Population Balance ^ | 6/11/03 | n.a.

[Mark Felton]

PETITION TO CONGRESS
to
STOP PAYMENT OF SOCIAL SECURITY BENEFITS
TO ILLEGAL ALIENS AND FOREIGN CITIZENS

WHEREAS the Bush Administration plans to give away at least 345 billion dollars of Social Security money...to be used to pay lifetime benefits to any Mexican citizen who has worked in the United States...legally or illegally, living in the United States or not...

Read and Sign the Petition Today!

 

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!!!URGENT ALERT!!!
MORATORIUM BILL
INTRODUCED

— Great Opportunity to Reduce Numbers —

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A superb bill, which would "effect a moratorium" on many categories of immigration and set strict limits on others, was introduced by House Immigration Caucus Chairman Congressman Tom Tancredo (R-CO).

H.R. 946 would reduce legal immigration from an average of over 1 million per year (1.5 million were admitted in 2001!) To about 300,000 per year for 5 years. Since the legal immigration flow is more than twice the estimated annual illegal immigration flow of 500,000, if passed this bill would reduce the total flow by about half.

This opportunity to push a moratorium bill is not to be missed because it addresses legal immigration across the board (and not just a few categories–an approach which plays right into the opposition's hands).

Pushing a moratorium is critical because it:

1. Increases the pressure to reduce all immigration numbers.

2. Increases the pressure on Congress to stop bad bills such as the proposed bill granting Social Security benefits to illegal aliens.

3. Helps resist illegal alien amnesty bills. Immigrant admissions of any kind serve as a magnet for more family members to come illegally.

4. Increases our National Security: Consider that the National Commission on Terrorism said, "The massive flows of people across U.S. borders make exclusion of all foreign terrorists impossible". (June 2000) Reducing numbers is essential to ensuring National Security.

5. Is another tool to stop the de facto "stealth" amnesty of illegals being pushed by the Bush administration and Mexican officials through the acceptance of matricula ID cards.

TO MAINTAIN MOMENTUM ON THIS BILL, IT IS CRITICALLY IMPORTANT THAT WE ACT NOW AND PUSH AN IMMIGRATION MORATORIUM AS OUR FIRST PRIORITY.

[Lady Eileen]

bump...thanks for the post.

[firewalk]

Bttt

[John Beresford Tipton]

"TO ILLEGAL ALIENS AND FOREIGN CITIZENS"

This title must surely overstate what the petition contains. No one can reasonably intend to stop payments to foreign citizens who came here legally and paid into the Social Security System. Not only would that be unfair to them but the US is treaty-bound to not screw them, not to mention that foreign countries would retailiate against the numerous US citizens working overseas.

[Dubya]

bump

[joesnuffy]

WHEREAS the Bush Administration plans to give away at least 345 billion dollars of Social Security money...to be used to pay lifetime benefits to any Mexican citizen who has worked in the United States...legally or illegally, living in the United States or not...

President Bush is for this?????

[Spiff]

This title must surely overstate what the petition contains. No one can reasonably intend to stop payments to foreign citizens who came here legally and paid into the Social Security System. Not only would that be unfair to them but the US is treaty-bound to not screw them, not to mention that foreign countries would retailiate against the numerous US citizens working overseas.

The foreign, alien, non-citizen workers did not "pay into" the Social Security system. Yes, they paid what is called Payroll Taxes (FICA, etc). They did not pay into a pension. Payroll Taxes are immediately spent by the current recipients of Social Security and Medicare. You do not pay into a system and carry an account. When you go on Social Security you are receiving the Payroll Taxes confiscated from the paychecks of the current workforce. Paying payroll taxes DOES NOT entitle you to later receive a portion of the taxes collected from the workforce.

If I worked a few years in France and returned to the USA I would not expect to receive any benefits of their socialist system when I hit 65 decades later.

[LiteKeeper]

What part of the word "illegal" is not understood?

[Mark Felton]

"President Bush is for this?????"

Yes, it was one item of discussion with Fox many months ago. There was initially a firestorm from conservatives but Bush is unmoved and is waiting for things to cool off before proceeding.

[Mark Felton]

US citizens that work in foreign countries must pay the taxes of that country without receving the welfare benefits of citizenship.

[Geezerette]

My name, address and comment has been sent to this poll.

God help our state if this treason continues!!

g in Arizona

[Geezerette]

I said "poll"... I meant "Petition"! Sorry!

g

[Joe Hadenuf]

Bump!!!!!!!!

[lilylangtree]

Petition signed.

[inquest]

This title must surely overstate what the petition contains.

No it does not. If you prefer a more credible source, how about Fox News: "The Bush administration has reportedly completed a draft of a treaty between the U.S. and Mexico that will give the Mexican government at least $345 billion in Social Security payments for Mexicans who have worked in the U.S. legally and illegally."

Of course, it's no secret that this administration has been all but encouraging illegal immigration from Mexico. This is one area that has exposed the administration's outright lying, as when Ashcroft claimed the power to indefinitely detain illegal Haitian immigrants who themselves do not pose a threat to national security, for the supposed reason of discouraging illegal immigration. Here they are encouraging it on one end, and then using the problem they create as an excuse for a power grab.

[Joe Hadenuf]

Not only would that be unfair to them

This country has been raped by millions of illegal aliens. Frankly, I don't give a damn what's unfair anymore. They have no respect for our laws, they have invaded our country. The American people have been brutalized by this epic attack on our sovereignty.

[John Beresford Tipton]

I was referring to foreign nationals, legally here in conformance with our laws, who had made contributions to the Social Security system.

[Joe Hadenuf]

Can I be truthful here?

I am sick of foreign nationals. I don't give a damn where they are from. Too many Americans are out of work, the economy is in a ditch, and with the amount of people outside this country that hate our guts, we ought to reform our legal immigration policies immediately!!!!

Enough of this immigration insanity!

[BRITinUSA]

The foreign, alien, non-citizen workers did not "pay into" the Social Security system. Yes, they paid what is called Payroll Taxes (FICA, etc). They did not pay into a pension. Payroll Taxes are immediately spent by the current recipients of Social Security and Medicare. You do not pay into a system and carry an account. When you go on Social Security you are receiving the Payroll Taxes confiscated from the paychecks of the current workforce. Paying payroll taxes DOES NOT entitle you to later receive a portion of the taxes collected from the workforce.

Are you sure about that ? I am a foreign national working in USA, I get a Statement of Benefit from Social Security every year. I have a social security number and the benefit sheet lists the benefits that I will get when I retire.

[american spirit]

Oh, it get's even better than we think....according to Cong. Ron Paul (TX) the fedgov wants to give illegals credit for time THEY WORKED IN MEXICO to add to their quarters worked in the USA to enable them to acquire even more benefits! He's been trying to publicize this lunacy for several months now.

[Spiff]

Are you sure about that ? I am a foreign national working in USA, I get a Statement of Benefit from Social Security every year. I have a social security number and the benefit sheet lists the benefits that I will get when I retire.

That's an estimate of what you MIGHT get. There's no guarantee that the rates will still be the same or that the system will even exist when you retire.

Social Security is a pay-as-you-go system. Money is confiscated from our paychecks and put into the system, current retirees collect from that. I have no account accruing money and neither do you. The statement of benefits is a ruse to keep you and everyone else fat, dumb, and happy.

As for you citizenship, sucks to be you for not being a U.S. citizen. You can't vote here, among other things. You aren't a citizen so you can't enjoy the benefits of citizenship. Why would you expect to collect anything from money confiscated from the paychecks of American workers? Just because money was confiscated from your paycheck!?

[supercat]

Why would you expect to collect anything from money confiscated from the paychecks of American workers? Just because money was confiscated from your paycheck!?

Such a claim is no more or less valid than the claims of anyone else receiving SS.

SS is a process by which the current generation of retirees "borrows" money from the current generation of workers, with the promise that future generations of workers will repay it.

In any other context, that sort of arrangement would be termed fraud.

[speekinout]

I am a foreign national working in USA, I get a Statement of Benefit from Social Security every year. I have a social security number and the benefit sheet lists the benefits that I will get when I retire.

I think you deserve the SS benefits. That's the way the system works. For years, much of our SS payments went to people living in Poland who had worked here.
That said, the SS system is crummy, and I hope Bush manages to reform it.

We're taking 15% or so from every worker with the promise that future workers will pay off the "loan". You loaned your money, too.

[goldilucky]

Yes he is all for this! When he first took office, I knew he would eventually do this to us.

A good example of this are non-citizens serving in our U.S military! As of last July, Pres. Bush implemented an order that would waive delays for citizenships for non-citizens serving in the U.S. military. Congress would help ease the path of citizenship for these illegals who enlist in our military. What is worse is that on May 7th of this year, the House Judiciary Committee made allowances for non-citizens to undergo interviews and oaths at foreign embassies rather in in the United States. This is absolute treason! These illegals are not protected under the Fourteenth Amendment because they were not born in the U.S.

[goldilucky]

How are you able to get SS benefits if you are not a citizen of the United States?

[FITZ]

I don't know if Bush is for it ---President Fox of Mexico is demanding that anyone who ever worked in the US be allowed to collect our Social Security ----as far as I know all Bush said was he would "think about it".

[goldilucky]

The NWO has never been a conspiracy but a fact that as it was implemented as far back as 1861 and gradually took over our money system in 1933 to make it complete.

The idea of Social Security derived from Germany under Hitler who was a national socialist (right-winger). The only difference between what he stood for and what America stands for today is that America has become an international socialist country which is equal to communism.

[FITZ]

If you stold someone's social security number and illegally used it, I don't think you deserve any reward at all for doing that. You committed a felony crime and should be treated like a felon.

[ATOMIC_PUNK]

THE ACTUAL BILL

Social Security for Americans Only Act of 2003 (Introduced in House)

HR 489 IH

108th CONGRESS

1st Session

H. R. 489

To amend title II of the Social Security Act and the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 to provide prospectively that wages earned, and self-employment income derived, by individuals who are not citizens or nationals of the United States shall not be credited for coverage under the old-age, survivors, and disability insurance program under such title, and to provide the President with authority to enter into agreements with other nations taking into account such limitation on crediting of wages and self-employment income.

IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

January 29, 2003

Mr. PAUL introduced the following bill; which was referred to the Committee on Ways and Means

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A BILL

To amend title II of the Social Security Act and the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 to provide prospectively that wages earned, and self-employment income derived, by individuals who are not citizens or nationals of the United States shall not be credited for coverage under the old-age, survivors, and disability insurance program under such title, and to provide the President with authority to enter into agreements with other nations taking into account such limitation on crediting of wages and self-employment income.

Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled,

SECTION 1. SHORT TITLE.

This Act may be cited as the `Social Security for Americans Only Act of 2003'.

SEC. 2. LIMITATIONS ON COVERAGE OF INDIVIDUALS BASED ON EARNINGS OF INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE NOT CITIZENS OR NATIONALS OF THE UNITED STATES.

Section 215(e) of the Social Security Act (42 U.S.C. 415(e)) is amended--

(1) by redesignating paragraphs (1) and (2) as subparagraphs (A) and (B), respectively;

(2) by inserting `(1)' after `(e)'; and

(3) by adding at the end the following new paragraph:

`(2) For purposes of subsections (b) and (d), in computing an individual's average indexed monthly earnings, or in the case of an individual whose primary insurance amount is computed under section 215(a) as in effect prior to January 1979, average monthly wage, such individual shall not be credited with--

`(A) any wages paid to such individual after December 31, 2003, while such individual is not a citizen or national of the United States, or

`(B) any self-employment income derived by such individual during any taxable year beginning after December 31, 2003, while such individual is not a citizen or national of the United States. '.

SEC. 3. REVISION OF AUTHORIZATION FOR TOTALIZATION AGREEMENTS.

(a) IN GENERAL- Section 233 of the Social Security Act (42 U.S.C. 433) is amended to read as follows:

`INTERNATIONAL AGREEMENTS

`SEC. 233. The President is authorized to enter into agreements (subject to the other provisions of this title and of chapters 2 and 21 of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986) establishing arrangements between the United States and any foreign country for the purpose of resolving questions of entitlement to, and participation in, the social security system established by this title and the social security system of such foreign country. Any such agreement shall take into account the limitations on the crediting of wages and self-employment income under section 215(e)(2). '.

(b) EFFECTIVE DATE; TERMINATION OF EXISTING AGREEMENTS- The amendment made by subsection (a) shall apply with respect to agreements taking effect after the date of the enactment of this Act. Any agreement in effect on such date which was entered into under section 233 of the Social Security Act (as in effect immediately before such date of enactment) shall terminate on December 31, 2003 (or as provided in such agreement, if earlier).

[CyberAnt]

What is it about AMERICAN CITIZEN that the rest of the world has such a hard time dealing with? NO OTHER NATION on the face of the earth - gives payments of any kind to anyone who is not a CITIZEN of their country. However, everybody seems to feel America HAS TO give money to everybody - regardless of whether they are an AMERICAN CITIZEN or not.

[CarmelValleyite]

Now there's an idea I can happily support!

[Risa]

>>WHEREAS the Bush Administration plans to give away at least 345 billion dollars of Social Security money<<

About a month ago, I posted an article to Free Republic on this topic, and the forum moderator pulled it almost immediately. Reason: no

The one response to the article that did get through accused me of fear-mongering.

I assumed the forum moderator as well as the responder had some information I didn't possess, i.e. they knew Bush had no intention of raiding social security of 345 billion dollars.

regards,
risa

[goody2shooz]

I responded to a post concerning that issue and it wasn't pulled. Are you sure yours wasn't a duplicate?

[Redbob]

Where can I sign ON PAPER, in person?

On-line petitions aren't worth the paper they're printed on.

[cinFLA]

Perhaps we should stop collecting SS taxes for illegals and foreign citizens???????

[cinFLA]

The foreign, alien, non-citizen workers did not "pay into" the Social Security system. Yes, they paid what is called Payroll Taxes (FICA, etc). They did not pay into a pension. Payroll Taxes are immediately spent by the current recipients of Social Security and Medicare. You do not pay into a system and carry an account. When you go on Social Security you are receiving the Payroll Taxes confiscated from the paychecks of the current workforce. Paying payroll taxes DOES NOT entitle you to later receive a portion of the taxes collected from the workforce.

Boy. You sure blew that post.

[cinFLA]

How would you like it if you worked in another country and they "confiscated" your money and put it into a pension program but only their citizens wer elible to withdraw payments. You would probably scream to high heck!

[PRND21]

Frankly, I don't give a damn what's unfair anymore.

Pssst...You're a Democrat.

[Joe Hadenuf]

Yeah PRND21, I'm a Democrat....

DOH!

[liberalnot]

it's interesting how mexico--the government and the culture, dominated over by a white, european elite-- pushed the united states to be "fair" to their emigrants.

make no mistake about it, mexico is a very racist country. there are few opportunities for the dark-skinned, indian mixed bloods. that's why they come here, for opportunities that their country denies them.

recently el presidente fox signed an anti-discrimination law. i doubt that it will have much effect because racism in mexico is deeply rooted. also, there are not the competing pluralistic demands of various ethnic and religious groups, nor the safeguards like the u.s. constitution. mexican law is napoleonic law and bribes will get one far.

[kuma]

Done.

[Born on the Storm King]

Here in Spokane Russian grandmas and grandpas (babushkas and dedushkas) are coming here by the thousands, steal all the low income housing and receive $800 per month SSI, disability, because they'll never learn how to speak English. It's an absolute disgrace!

I should explain myself a little also (see my bio.) I was a Russian translator in the US Army. When they started coming here in the early '90's, I palled around with them for a while since I can speak Russian---no longer because I started losing my American friends---they all hate them!

[Risa]

>>I responded to a post concerning that issue and it wasn't pulled. Are you sure yours wasn't a duplicate?<<

That's a good question. I searched for a duplicate, and didn't find one at the time. Also, the reason given for the pull was a simple 'NO,' rather than 'duplicate.'

On the other hand, my search skills have been less than stellar on free republic, so the article may well have been a duplicate at the time I posted it.

regards,
risa

[MeekOneGOP]

[WhiteGuy]

WHEREAS the Bush Administration plans to give away at least 345 billion dollars of Social Security money...to be used to pay lifetime benefits to any Mexican citizen who has worked in the United States...legally or illegally, living in the United States or not..

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.........and yet, so many here are wearing the knee-pads...

I don't get it.

[OREALLY]

How can an illegal alien get a social security number to pay social security???? This does not sound credible.

[inquest]

And would I be in this hypothetical country legally or illegally under this particular scenario you have in mind?

[texgal]

I went to the website and want to know something more about the organization. While I agree with the petition, something about the site bothers me. No way to tell who these guys really are and who's behind them. Do you know who is behind this website?

[george wythe]

I am a foreign national working in USA, I get a Statement of Benefit from Social Security every year. I have a social security number and the benefit sheet lists the benefits that I will get when I retire.

You're absolutely right. The US pays Social Security to people from many countries.

The United States has bilateral Social Security agreements with 20 countries. The agreements improve benefit protection for workers who have divided their careers between the United States and another country. Following is a list of the agreements the United States has concluded and the date of the entry into force of each:

Country	Entry into Force
Italy	November 1, 1978
Germany	December 1, 1979
Switzerland	November 1, 1980
Belgium	July 1, 1984
Norway	July 1, 1984
Canada	August 1, 1984
United Kingdom	January 1, 1985
Sweden	January 1, 1987
Spain	April 1, 1988
France	July 1, 1988
Portugal	August 1, 1989
Netherlands	November 1, 1990
Austria	November 1, 1991
Finland	November 1, 1992
Ireland	September 1, 1993
Luxembourg	November 1, 1993
Greece	September 1, 1994
South Korea	April 1, 2001
Chile	December 1, 2001
Australia	October 1, 2002