Catholic bishop of Phoenix arrested

FOXNEWS | 6/16/2003 | John Gibson

[sinkspur]

Roman Catholic bishop John O'Brien was arrested for leaving the scene of a fatal hit-and-run accident, and his car impounded.

[Chancellor Palpatine]

I slammed into a deer back around Christmas doing 65 MPH - it did my windshield almost exactly like that one - thing is, I remember the expression on the doe's face as I slammed into her.

My car bucked and skidded sideways a little, too - and its a large sedan (she weighed about 200 lbs).

Of course, unlike His Eminence, I was sober, and stopped.

[RooRoobird14]

As a member of the Phoenix diocese, I can't tell you what a shock and nightmare this situation is. I wanted O'brien to resign before this because of his unwillingness to accept personal responsibility for the pedophile priests under his authority. Now this.

It's a nightmare, truly a nightmare. I hope and pray he pleads guilty, resigns as Bishop, and serves his jail time. What's particularly hard to take right now is the major schadenfreude party being thrown by Catholic-bashers and ex-Catholics over this. In all the fiendish glee of "I told you so" revelry, I hope these same people invest as much energy in praying for the family members of the man who was killed.

[El Sordo]

"I'm pretty funny when I'm housed."

An Irishwoman without a house is never funny.

[Dusty Rose]

...major schadenfreude party being thrown by Catholic-bashers and ex-Catholics over this.

"If they persecuted Me, they will persecute you also."If we are persecuted for our faith, we are in the company of Jesus. This whole ugly scandal just points out how vital it is to place our faith and trust in Him, not in church leaders who are bound to disappoint us. He also says we need to pray for our persecutors, and that's really hard to do. I and many others are holding all of you in Phoenix in our prayers, that He will provide you with the leadership you need, men of holiness and prayer who can minister the healing love of Jesus to all of you who are living through this nightmare. We pray also for a revelation of truth and mercy for those who would exploit this situation to bring further hurt and damage to the church.

[TotusTuus]

Deer at 19th Ave and Glendale? Sheesh.

I've seen them.

[TotusTuus]

Had Rome relieved him, he'd have never been there, drunk, to kill that man.

You know this how?

[TotusTuus]

Look, does anyone here honestly think O'Brien would have left another human being to suffer or die if he had understood what had happened?

No, I don't. A terrible tragedy happened. I'll wait for the full set of facts to come out before making judgements.

[sinkspur]

Well, Rome was obviously more concerned about being seen to bow to outside pressure than to anticipate that a bishop being accused of obstruction of justice just might mess up his head, big time.

[TotusTuus]

The Bishop is lying and everyone knows it.

No, everyone does not know it.

Since everyone on this thread seems to think they are experts at reconstructing accidents by guessing, I'll throw in mine.

The jaywalker was drunk and ran into the car (passenger side) sideswiping it. I know that stretch of road, and it is dark at night. In this scenario, the Bishop would not have seen him, or necessarily known what happened. Other posters have already posted the story of a woman who almost ran the guy over too (head on) because it was so dark.

But rather than guess, why doesn't "everybody" just wait for the full set of facts?

P.S. Bishop Thomas O'Brien is not known to be a heavy drinker.

[Robert_Paulson2]

It kind of bothers me when folks try to present moral equivalencies between a man having paid sex with a adult female prostitute, with the #na#l r#pe of a minor boy by a male adult in the confessional...

There is NO comparison. Perhaps they feel their religion is under attack.

They may be thinking "Any thing to 'defend the faith!'" and end up 'defending the indefensible..."

Even it means equating the homosexual r#pe of innocent little boys, with having sex with a prostitute.

Judah, according to Genesis, had sex with his daughter in law, tamar, while she was posing as a prostitute... that person was in the line of Christ.
God TOLD Amos to marry a hooker, named gomer. Men having sex with women outside of marriage is NOT the moral equivalent of homosexal-pedophilia.

NONE of the patriarchs had homosexual pedophilic tendencies or practiced any behaviors like them, at least they are not listed in scripture. Homosexuals were not tolerated in the old testament, under the ten commandments.

Seeing a prostitute... was.

I always thought swaggart was a phoney.
But I don't think he was a perverted sex criminal. I speculate that he was just a lonely guy, whose wife was not interested in him, for any number of reasons... and who could not resist the NORMAL temptation to interact, sexually with females. Just speculation of course.

There is no reason to believe that Swaggart sought out contact with underage males who were in his "counsel" or under the "confessional" as is the case with the current crop of folks...

These pederasts are both PHONEYS, for rejecting the faithfulness to God's commandments and rejecting the professed morality of their church, AND perverted sex CRIMINALS who hurt children.

The ones who hid them?
MY gut feelings are that they hide and protect the criminals NOT for the good of the Church, but because they too, are very likely guilty of the very same acts... and fear exposure. Perhaps some of them are even worse... one freeper pointed on this thread to me that even governor keating is afraid of them, saying they are all part of a deadly mafiosa, on an even keel with la cosa nostra... serous statement from a guy who is no stranger to death threats.

AND he is quitting over it...

I am not surprised, even broaching the subject, gets some very nasty freepermail going.

One thing's for sure, there are a lot of dissappointed Christians doubting their leadership, not Christ, per se or his Church... but the folks who are leading. Just like Christ said they would be one day... there appear to be very many "ravenous wolves" in sheep's clothing indeed.

No excuse for Swaggart though. If you cannot keep it zipped, or resist going after "strange" women, you don't really belong in Christian ministry...
However, Swaggarts sexual frustration and pursuit of sexual interaction with women is just not the moral or legal equivalent of sexually assaulting minor children of the same sex...

All of us at times, complain about the morally similarity of San Francisco cp. Sodom and Gomorrah... perhaps we need to all look a little closer to home... at the folks who PRETEND to represent Jesus... just around the corner.

I often wonder how many of the men who were r#ped by priests in the past, have turned into the Jeffrey Dahmers and Hanibal Lecters of our criminal justice system?

I got sick for three days, over my first "football physical" by a female doctor, involving a plastic glove, ky jelly, and a lot of coughing over the edge of a table... I cannot imagine what it would be, if someone had abused me as a child, in the name of God almighty...

I hardly think Swaggarts adultery with a willing female, compares to that kind of trauma on a kid's conscience for his entire life...

[Xenalyte]

What you said. Excellent post - and absolutely dead-on right.

[MARTIAL MONK]

And I saw the spaceship.

[Jim Noble]

That was another case of homosexual favoritism,the ones who raped and sodomized boys were never treated like that

I never thought it odd how harshly priests who married were treated, until I learned about the coverup of the boy molestations.

Even the nun in Boston who baptized a baby (I know her personally) was on the street with her few belongings in twenty-four hours after our brother Bernard found out what she did.

The American bishops can move very fast when they want to.

[TotusTuus]

PLEASE, get your facts straight before you pontificate to others about it.

Rainy, I think this is a gossip thread. No facts are necessary.

It is just a little humerous to see these posters make, of all people, Bishop Thomas O'Brien into the devil himself.

You know as well as I, that his Excellency is a weak leader and a tribute to mediocrity, but he is not an immoral monster.

A tragic accident occurred. Could have been any of us - and almost happened to me along that same strecth of road, on several different occasions no less.

[TotusTuus]

And I saw the spaceship.

I was wondering how long it would take before a spaceship made it to this thread.

[wideminded]

the USMC has always been about 60% Catholic

This sounds awfully high to me. I wasn't able to find the current breakdown but I did find the Marine casualty statistics from Viet Nam:

Protestant: 61%

Roman Catholic: 33%

[TotusTuus]

Okay, to play your game: The ex-bishop is involved in this same accident (occurred under 3 miles from his home). The problem of this fatal traffic accident is better how?

This situation is separate from other "issues" that has occurred in the Diocese of Phx. I don't agree with your, and others, assessment of those other issues. Don't need to bother writing about it because it will serve no purpose.

Concerning the accident: Did the Bishop leave the scene of the accident knowing what happened? That would be a bad thing. And illegal. That is the 64K question. Until the full set of facts are in, I don't know for sure. But I doubt it.

[sinkspur]

Did the Bishop leave the scene of the accident knowing what happened?

If he didn't, he should have sensed something was up when he was TOLD, on Sunday, that the police were looking for him.

Yet, he stayed on the lam for another 12 hours.

Unlike you, I think he knew what he did, he was just scared to death.

Cowardly, IOW.

[sinkspur]

Could have been any of us

You and I would have stopped.

[sinkspur]

This situation is separate from other "issues" that has occurred in the Diocese of Phx. I don't agree with your, and others, assessment of those other issues. Don't need to bother writing about it because it will serve no purpose.

It will serve no purpose other than to remind lurkers that O'Brien signed a consent agreement to relinquish control over sexual abuse cases to a layman in lieu of being indicted for obstruction of justice (for which the DA had plenty of evidence and was ready to charge the bishop).