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U.S. agency confirms sinking of USS Liberty was accident
Haaretz ^ | 9/7/2003 | Nathan Guttman

Posted on 07/08/2003 4:33:17 PM PDT by Courier

U.S. agency confirms sinking of USS Liberty was accident

By Nathan Guttman, Haaretz Correspondent

WASHINGTON - New documents released this week by America's National Security Agency support Israel's version of a long-festering controversy between the two countries: Israel's sinking of an American spy ship, the USS Liberty, off the coast of Gaza during the 1967 Six-Day War.

Israel has always said it had no idea the ship was American, but conspiracy theorists and anti-Israel propagandists still claim Israel sank the ship in the full knowledge that it was American.

The documents, originally defined as top secret, were made public by Florida Judge Jay Cristol, who

has been investigating the Liberty incident for years and published a book on the subject last year. On Monday, the NSA gave him a transcript of conversations held by two Israeli Air Force helicopter pilots who were hovering over the Liberty as it was sinking, and these tapes confirm Israel's claim that the sinking of the ship, which killed 34 American servicemen and wounded 171, was a tragic error.

After the Liberty was bombed by both the Israel Air Force and the Israel Navy, the two helicopter pilots were summoned from their base to assess the damage and evaluate the possibility of rescuing the surviving crew members. An American spy plane, which had been sent to the area as soon as the NSA learned of the attack, recorded their conversations, which took place between 2:30 and 3:37 P.M. on June 8, the third day of the war.

The spy plane also recorded the orders radioed to the pilots by their supervisor at Hatzor Base, which instructed them to search for Egyptian survivors from the "Egyptian warship" that had just been bombed - thus supporting Israel's claim that it had believed the ship was Egyptian when it ordered it attacked. "Pay attention. The ship is now identified as Egyptian," the pilots were told.

Nine minutes later, Hatzor informed the pilots that it was not an Egyptian warship, but an Egyptian cargo ship. Only at 3:07 were the pilots first informed that the ship might not have been Egyptian at all: Hatzor told them that if they found Arabic-speaking survivors, they should be taken to El-Arish, but if they found English-speaking survivors, they should be taken to Lod. "Clarify by the first man that you bring up, what nationality he is, and report to me immediately," the supervisor instructed, according to the transcript. "It's important to know."

Then, at 3:12, one of the pilots informed Hatzor that he saw an American flag flying over the wounded ship. He was asked to investigate and determine whether it was really an American ship.

This is not the first time such transcripts have been made public: Israel gave its own recordings of the pilots' conversations to the British television station Thames in 1987. But conspiracy theorists charged that Israel had doctored the tapes before handing them over to the station in order to hide the fact that it sank the Liberty intentionally. No such imputation can be made about these new transcripts, as they were never in Israeli hands.

Israel has always said it attacked the Liberty, which America sent to the region to gather intelligence on the progress of the war, because it believed it was an Egyptian supply ship ferrying supplies to the Egyptian troops that Israel was then fighting. When it discovered the error, it immediately informed the Americans, apologized and paid compensation to the victims' families.

The incident was investigated by inquiry commissions in both Israel and the United States, and both concluded that it had, indeed, been a tragic error. Nevertheless, the controversy never died. In 1979, one of the survivors, James Ennes, published a book accusing Israel of bombing the American ship deliberately. Ennes claimed an Israeli spy plane had hovered over the ship all morning and had surely identified it as American, since the American flag was clearly visible.

A later book, written by James Bamford, charged that Israel sank the ship in order to keep America from learning of its plans to attack Syria, and further claimed that the NSA had tapes of conversations among Israeli pilots that not only confirmed this, but also proved that the tapes released by Israel had been doctored.

Another claim that appears frequently on the dozens of Internet sites devoted to the affair is that Israel sank the ship to conceal a mass murder of Egyptian soldiers on the Sinai peninsula.

In its letter to Cristol, the NSA stressed that, contrary to the claims that often appear in such books and Web sites - that the agency has tapes from both the Liberty and from a nearby American submarine that confirm Israel's guilt - the only tapes that exist were those made by the spy plane and given to Cristol this week.

"It's the last piece of intelligence that remained classified, and every rational person that will read it will understand that there is no truth in these conspiracy theories against Israel," Cristol said Tuesday. But he added: "Those who hate Israel, who hate Jews, and those who believe in conspiracy will not be convinced by anything."

Cristol, a former U.S. navy pilot and legal officer, began investigating the Liberty incident 14 years ago. Since publishing his book, which vindicates Israel, he has received threats and been accused of being an Israeli agent. "I take this lightly, but I am saddened to learn that there is this kind of hate toward Israel," he said.


TOPICS: Breaking News; Foreign Affairs; Government; Israel
KEYWORDS: accident; bloodlibel; israel; nsa; sixdaywar; ussliberty
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To: adam_az
I already read it. I believe the American Saliors.
81 posted on 07/08/2003 5:46:29 PM PDT by Dubya (Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father,but by me)
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To: Courier
How do we know that the helicopter pilots weren't part of an Israeli deception operation, either as a planned element of the attack, or an after-the-fact hastily thrown together CYA move. The Israelis are certainly capable of it.

And no, I'm not an anti-Semite - I sympathize with Israel for the most part, because I believe our interests are coincident, and because I admire the fortitude of Israeli citizens and soldiers in the face of long-standing adversity. But only a fool would believe that, when those interests diverge, they would place American interests above their own. To those fools, I have only one word to say: "Pollard."
82 posted on 07/08/2003 5:46:42 PM PDT by LouD (Line, Tag, Multipurpose - One (1) each)
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To: Courier
Well, I am pro-Israel, but I think it was attacked on purpose. I'm not excusing it, but the reason for attacking it was that Lyndon Johnson was about to interfere, yet again, against Israel at a critical moment, and the Israelis attacked the ship in order to cut off Johnson's ears, as it were, and give themselves a little more time to achieve their military objectives.

That was a terrible thing to do, but on the other hand the United States has done some pretty terrible things to the Israelis.

The honorable thing would be to admit the sins on both sides and try to behave better in the future, but Socialists seem to have an absolute compulsion to cover things up. For that matter most governments tend to cover things up, and the Bush government is not exempt.
83 posted on 07/08/2003 5:47:06 PM PDT by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: drlevy88
Yeah, rapid succession events under high stress stack up in the brain, get mixed in order, forgotten, confused with other experiences, things imagined... the bad info re-ingrained by recounting in the calmer time afterwards (and still we execute people on one eye witness but that's a side rant)

Very important, and very different than calling the eyewitnesses liars. Also remember we are talking about eyewitnesses who were mostly BELOW DECK otherwise they would have been strafed and/or napalmed to death.
84 posted on 07/08/2003 5:47:19 PM PDT by adam_az
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To: djf
LOL...that may be the most blatantly biased and inaccurate article I've ever read. (For one, the USS Liberty did not sink). ...But don't let that stop you. You have a mission, you know.
85 posted on 07/08/2003 5:49:09 PM PDT by Mr. Mojo
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To: Dubya
WHICH of the american sailors do you believe, and which statements make you think the attack was deliberate?

How do you address the fact that many of the statements contradict each other in material detail? Which of the contradicting statements have you chosen to believe?

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/942571/posts?page=84#84
86 posted on 07/08/2003 5:49:14 PM PDT by adam_az
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To: DaughterOfAnIwoJimaVet
The thing is that they are not liars.

They were attacked by Israel and if they hate Israel it is very understandable.

The issue is not whether they were attacked.

The issue is whether it was a deliberate attack on an American ship.

there is no way on God's Earth, these men know what was in the Israelis' mind.

Now we know.

Cold hard AMERICAN evidence shows that it was inadvertent.
87 posted on 07/08/2003 5:52:19 PM PDT by Courier (Quick: Name one good thing about the Saudis.)
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To: adam_az
Did Israel know the ship it was firing on 36 years ago—here, after the attack, listing from a deadly torpedo hit—was the USS Liberty? Today, top former U.S. intelligence officials are saying "Yes."
CLICK FOR STORY.

88 posted on 07/08/2003 5:52:19 PM PDT by Dubya (Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father,but by me)
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To: Adrastus
I am a friend of Israel with the exception of this incidence. I agree with you and that is all that I can comment on this sad situation.
89 posted on 07/08/2003 5:52:19 PM PDT by Grampa Dave (Stamp out Freepathons! Stop being a Freep Loader! Become a monthly donor!)
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To: LouD
"How do we know...." What a bunch of tinfoil hat crap that is.

Here is your reading homework - Look up the term OCCAM'S RAZOR.

90 posted on 07/08/2003 5:52:19 PM PDT by adam_az
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To: Dubya
You seem like as much of a RINO as your namesake who is increasing the size of the welfare state that once was America, and paying millions to Palestinian terrorists.
91 posted on 07/08/2003 5:52:23 PM PDT by adam_az
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To: DaughterOfAnIwoJimaVet
The thing is that they are not liars.

They were attacked by Israel and if they hate Israel it is very understandable.

The issue is not whether they were attacked.

The issue is whether it was a deliberate attack on an American ship.

There is no way on God's Earth these men know what was in the Israelis' mind.

Now we know.

Cold hard AMERICAN evidence shows that the attack was inadvertent.
92 posted on 07/08/2003 5:52:23 PM PDT by Courier (Quick: Name one good thing about the Saudis.)
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To: Dubya
You seem like as much of a RINO as your namesake who is increasing the size of the welfare state that once was America, and paying millions to Palestinian terrorists.
93 posted on 07/08/2003 5:52:24 PM PDT by adam_az
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To: Burkeman1
Complete horsechips. The testimony of the men on that ship is uniform. It was attacked for OVER AN HOUR by both Israeli torpedo boats and aircraft! It was flying the flag unlike the liar Israeli excuse said. Whom do you believe?

Good points....and when did the Egyptian "navy" ever pose a threat to Isreal?

94 posted on 07/08/2003 5:53:52 PM PDT by clockwork
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To: You Gotta Be Kidding Me

With exception of the fact that the Liberty didn't "sink" I agree.

I think I will believe the people who were there and saw what transpired as opposed to those who called off air support and tried to bury the whole event in the first place.

NOW THAT was "paranoid" in my book.

I am willing to believe there was a fog of war component to this somewhere, it wouldn't make sense any other way.. But not that everyone on board is a huge anti-semite and that our guy's are in effect just lying for the hell of it.

Why would they do that? I suppose they are ALL "anti-semites" and Jew haters?

95 posted on 07/08/2003 5:54:48 PM PDT by Jhoffa_ (BREAKING: Supreme Court Finds Right to Sodomy, Sammy & Frodo elated.)
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To: All
The following sixteen facts, prepared and presented by an
experienced prosecuting attorney, are undisputed:



1. At all times on June 8, 1967, during the fourth day of the
Arab-Israeli "Six Day War," USS Liberty, a neutral ship, remained in
international waters.



2. USS Liberty carried no offensive armament and only four .50 cal.
machine guns as a defense against boarders.



3. On the morning of June 8, 1967 USS Liberty was over flown by
Israeli reconnaissance aircraft, and POSITIVELY identified by an
Israeli pilot not just as a U.S. Navy ship, but as USS Liberty
specifically.



4. The Hague Convention on Naval Warfare prohibits attacks on
neutral ships on the high seas.



5. The government of Israel stated that they ordered ships and
aircraft to the location of USS Liberty because they had received
reports that IDF forces on the shore were being shelled from the sea.



6. The Israeli motor torpedo boats (MTBs) claimed to have detected
USS Liberty on their radar initially at a distance of approximately
28 miles. The maximum range of the MTB radar units was just 16 miles.



7. The MTBs calculated the speed of USS Liberty initially at 30
knots and then a few minutes later at 28 knots. The maximum speed of
USS Liberty was 20 knots, and the ship was at that time barely making
way at five knots.



8. The Israeli aircraft, which should have been looking for a ship
with offensive armament with sufficient range to bombard the shore 15
miles away and traveling at high speed, instead found a converted
cargo ship, with no offensive armament, and moving at approximately
five knots.



9. USS Liberty presented no obvious offensive threat, nor was she
attempting to flee the scene. Indeed, US sailors were sunbathing on
the deck.



10. Prior to the start of the attack (1358 local time), USS Liberty -
still in international waters - was never positively identified as a
hostile ship.





11. Rather than wait for the MTBs to arrive and positively ID the
ship, the aircraft launched an attack on USS Liberty.



12. The pilots of the attacking aircraft claimed that they were
unable to see the 5' by 8' red, white, and blue US flag flying
approximately 100 feet above the bridge of the ship, yet one of the
pilots stated that he saw a .50 cal machine gun, painted gray, on the
deck.



13. The Israelis claim that the aircraft finally saw a U.S. flag on
Liberty at approximately 1422 and they called off the attack.



14. At 1436, the MTBs launched a torpedo attack on USS Liberty,
launching five torpedoes, one of which hit USS Liberty amidships,
killing 25 men.



15. The MTBs continued to circle USS Liberty, firing on the ship
until at least 1510, when they claim that they saw Liberty's US flag
for the first time.



16. The Israeli attack was broken off almost immediately following
an unencrypted broadcast by USS Saratoga that she had launched
aircraft to come to the aid of Liberty.





The Israeli government has never explained why it was necessary to
attack an unthreatening ship on the high seas without waiting a few
more minutes until their surface ships arrived to positively identify
it. This was a gross violation of the laws of war. There is simply no
rational explanation for the attack having been anything other than
planned and deliberate.



Reference was made to Mr. Cristol's website www.libertyincident.com.
When visiting this site, please keep in mind that while Mr. Cristol
traveled to Israel 15 times to interview IDF personnel, he had only
brief conversations with a few USS Liberty survivors. He has claimed
to have interviewed quite a few individuals who dispute that they
were ever interviewed by Cristol. The facts alleged on Cristol's
website are often contradictory.



One of the individuals who disputes ever having been interviewed by
Cristol about the attack on USS Liberty, is Captain Ward Boston, the
JAG officer for the court of inquiry. He has recently broken his
silence on this subject. In a recent published interview, Captain
Boston contradicted Cristol's claims of comments attributed to
Admiral Isaac Kidd and stated that Kidd has opined to him that he
thought that Cristol was "an Israeli agent."



Also bear in mind Cristol's somewhat misleading biography, which
suggests that he was a combat pilot during the Korean war (he
wasn't).
96 posted on 07/08/2003 5:55:04 PM PDT by Dubya (Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father,but by me)
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To: Courier
I have emailed the Haaretz to that effect. I do not have a bone to pick with either you or others on this event or this thread. I do have a bone to pick with irresponsible or sloppy and nebulous journalism, however.

Thanks for the post.

97 posted on 07/08/2003 5:55:44 PM PDT by NormsRevenge (IN ZOT WE TRUST! ........... http:www.DRAFTTOM.com)
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To: Cicero
and the Israelis attacked the ship in order to cut off Johnson's ears, as it were

And as one report goes, Johnson's inadvertent mouth (the Egyptians were somehow managing to intercept the American recommunications -- not a shining moment for the CIA).

98 posted on 07/08/2003 5:56:47 PM PDT by drlevy88
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To: adam_az
When you are wrong and can't back up what you say, you resort to name calling do you. It don't brother me. It just shows what you are. As for W I like him and I am proud to be compaired to him. However I had the Name W before him.
99 posted on 07/08/2003 5:58:05 PM PDT by Dubya (Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father,but by me)
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To: Courier
So if a Hebrew paper uses the term "sink", which has many meanings in English then that means NSA Top Secret real time recorded transcripts are a lie?

Anyone seen these transcripts or any report other than by this paper which has an agenda? I havent heard a word from the NSA, CIA, State or anything.

If Israel is our friend and would never do this, why then do we have one of their spys in our jail.

100 posted on 07/08/2003 5:59:44 PM PDT by Dave S
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