Pentagon retaliates against GIs who spoke out on TV

San Francisco Chronicle ^ | Friday, July 18, 2003 | Robert Collier, Chronicle Staff Writer

[Lijahsbubbe]

Fallujah, Iraq -- Morale is dipping pretty low among U.S. soldiers as they stew in Iraq's broiling heat, get shot at by an increasingly hostile population and get repeated orders to extend their tours of duty.

Ask any grunt standing guard on a 115-degree day what he or she thinks of the open-ended Iraq occupation, and you'll get an earful of colorful complaints.

[JoeSchem]

Eighty billion dollars for a war works out to $40,000 per each of 200,000 soldiers. You would think that some of the money for the war could go to providing the soldiers with decent living conditions. What's wrong with our government?

Oh right, it's a government. But maybe if civilians raise an outcry, the government will be forced to take care of its people.

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[DoughtyOne]

Well I guess WWII GIs really screwed up. They were in the thick of it for years.

[af_vet_rr]

It has long been a practice in American democracy that the military do not criticize the nation's civilian leaders, as Gen. Douglas MacArthur found out in 1951, when he criticized President Harry Truman's Korean War strategy -- and was promptly fired.

Although it's emphasized time and again, at least in training, that one does not do these sorts of things, perhaps some troops should have General MacArthur's example pointed out, that even a five-star can be punished.

[OldCorps]

read the article. no mention of any punishment for the soldiers who spoke out. looks like headline was overblown. Pentagon has a real can of worms with this and they have to treat this carefully, otherwise morale will get even worse than it already is.

[rogue yam]

I wouldn't have said "retaliate." It sounds to me more like they were "disciplined."

[Who dat?]

They were in the thick of it for years.

That's what I'm beginning to think. I've searched for "record deployments" and have found several that specify nine and ten month (NAVY) deployments being "records since WWII."

I'm starting to wonder about the WWII deployments, since everybody seems preoccupied with distancing themselves from being compared to them.

[Ramius]

Insubordination has a cost. Now they get to rightly learn an important lesson.

As my chief once told me: "We're out here to defend democracy, not to practice it!". :-)

[FloridaBoy]

This is a war situation. General Sherman said "war is all hell". I guess he was right. Our men and women in the service should heed to all of those who have served before them and do the job required. We have been in many (to many) countries for along time and maybe we and them get used to it.

[Lijahsbubbe]

CAREERS OVER FOR SOME "It was the end of the world," said one officer Thursday. "It went all the way up to President Bush and back down again on top of us. At least six of us here will lose our careers."

[Enterprise]

Well, I am curious as to how the RATS will react to this. When Truman fired McArthur they hailed him because a military officer should not criticize his civilian leaders. Yes, fire them, and let them who's boss, yeah, that's the ticket. So, now that soldiers are complaining, will the RATS take the same attitude? Fire them, let them know who's boss, discipline them? I mean after all, how dare military personnel complain about their civilian leaders, huh? But what do you want to bet, that the RATS will try to use this against President Bush?

[Lijahsbubbe]

I agree.

[DoughtyOne]

Here's something else to ponder. Did anyone seriously think this was going to be a two week exercise, then everone goes home? It was known beforehand that this was going to be a long haul. I see reports that our leaders thought it would be short, but I can't seriously believe they thought this.

[Recovering_Democrat]

Corp. Todd Burchard as he stood on a street corner, sweating profusely and looking bored. "We'll keep doing our jobs as best as anyone can, but we shouldn't have to still be here in the first place."

Let's turn the military decisions over to the corporals. How's that?

The San Francisco Chronicle...what a bunch of maroons. Drudge should be ashamed he put this anti-American propaganda on his web site as a headline.

[MizSterious]

Here's one indication. I was born in WWII. My dad's ship left when my mom was about 2 months along. I didn't see my dad until I was 3 years old. I've heard that other men were gone longer.

[Malesherbes]

ABC News strikes again. ABC said from day one that we were losing this war, in a quagmire, revisiting VietNahm, etc. and so they find two poor grunts in 120 degree Iraq, and finally get them to cross the line into insubordination.

[Mr Rogers]

I loathed clintoon with a passion - and said so, anonymously on FR. In private conversation, I said the same thing. In front of the troops, I said he wasn't my business.

The enlisted ought to get their wrists slapped. The officers should lose their careers - they aren't officer potential, anyways. They don't understand public criticism of your seniors is bad for discipline and morale.

[niteowl77]

I'm starting to wonder about the WWII deployments, since everybody seems preoccupied with distancing themselves from being compared to them.

At the risk of repeating earlier comments, one of my uncles left for Camp Dodge (IA) on October 5, 1943, went through basic and radioman training, left for England, waited for a ride across the channel (which he got on - I believe - June 10, 1944) and was made second scout. He was in combat from that point until VE Day, save for two short hospital stays because of German shrapnel. He was sent back to the line both times. Cotentin Peninsula, Cherbourg, Frenzerburg Castle, Ardennes, Roer River, Remagen... those were hard places, taken in all kinds of weather, some abominably bad. His outfit suffered one of the worst casualty rates in the ETO, and he was somewhat unusual in having survived the whole trip.

He was then put in the Army of Occupation, so his service did not end until 1946. And he didn't have e-mail, cell phones or some dumb-assed reporter from GayBC to let him whine about how bad FDR and Henry L. Stimson were treating him. If he bitched to anyone, it was his mates (or in letters to his widowed mother, who kept it to herself).

But I'm sure uncle's stint was an f-ing cakewalk compared to these TV hogs' duty.