The Neoconservative Cabal

AEI ^ | 9/3/03 | Joshua Muravchik

[Helms]

http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoconservatism

[inPhase]

"Its 20th-century heroes tend to be TR, FDR, and Ronald Reagan--Irving Kristol
Sorry but I'm not part of any group that considers FDR a hero."

Likewise, and think FDR a tragedy. Think we are homing in here though. FDR was a major SOCIAL LIBERAL. And neocons by and by are not all fiscal conservatives either. Only common theme appears to me to be Israel, for good or bad.

[William McKinley]

who have already been described as putting more stock in overwhelming force

Where?

[AndyJackson]

most of the others replying to it don't seem to have a clue as to what the author of it is really saying

Well please explain it to us simpletons, becaus I find it to be just more apalling dreck. If he has a point, he might try to come out and make it.

[AndyJackson]

From the article: By contrast, conservatives of traditional bent are more inclined to favor the use of overwhelming force or none at all, and to be more concerned with "exit strategies."

It is no wonder you cannot find it though. The statement is wrong, and you would likely miss it because the article is atrocious.

[William McKinley]

No, I missed it because I understand that paleoconservatism is not traditional conservatism. Paleoconservatism is younger and newer even than neoconservatism.

Hence your confusion.

[inPhase]

Thanks,
have my own opinion.
Prefer Times to the Post but only sample both.

I am a speed reader and read voraciously. Mental exercise.

[billbears]

Only common theme appears to me to be Israel, for good or bad.

Unfortunately, that's what I have a problem understanding sometimes. It seems the neocons are bound and determined to railroad through this 'roadmap' one way or another. And as someone that supports Israel, I can't see how giving their land to a bunch of squatters is doing anything more than making Israel acquiesce to terrorists

[AndyJackson]

the term neoconservative as it is used by the left and by the paleoconservatives has no meaning

I already know that. What concerns me is that there are people around who describe themselves as neo-cons, such as this author, who also have no clue what it means. All I can tell is that it is a tribal label. If it stands for something, this author sure doesn't know what it is.

[jmc813]

Like Pavlov's dog, they see the word "Jew" in an article they don't understand (or haven't read) and start in with their spastic accusations of anti-semitism.

They do that to cover up their liberalism on domestic issues. For fun, ask them if they think that overall the New Deal was a good thing.

[SauronOfMordor]

A neo-con, as distinct from an old-style conservative or libertarian, has no aversion to using the power of the US government to create a "better society". The main difference between them and leftists is what goals they want to achieve thru the power of government

[rdb3]

*

[inPhase]

Postmodernism doesn't give a flying ...

want copy, that's good.

[William McKinley]

What concerns me is that there are people around who describe themselves as neo-cons, such as this author, who also have no clue what it means

If you think the primary people who use the label 'neoconservative' are the people who are labelled 'neoconservative', you are delusional.

The overwhelming majority of the usage of the term comes from three groups: the liberal media, the far left fringe, and the paleoconservatives.

[ellery]

:-) Didn't mean to imply you believe what you're spoon-fed. I just learned last week that the Moonies were anti-semites, so I had to share.

[William McKinley]

I think that is a good, succinct description of the original meaning of neoconservative, especially if you meld it with the concept of most of them being converts from the left.

[zacyak]

Well please explain it to us simpletons, because I find it to be just more apalling dreck

I was just responding to those who were whining about the article being anti-semitic - I found the article itself to be a bunch of overwritten blather and I personally don't agree with the neocon worldview at all.

[inPhase]

The Washington Times is owned by


still mulling your Protocols of the Elders post.
You are at least a double agent??

no, I am just kidding too.

[AndyJackson]

Paleoconservatism is younger and newer even than neoconservatism

Paleocon refers to a branch of conservatism that has been around for a long time, regardless of how hold the term has been used. It is largely used by paleocons themselves to distinguish themselves from their neocon usurpers. This is silly, since neither they nor I can tell what neocons stand for other than some things Pat Buchanan disagrees with.

[inPhase]

ideas of the Left as well. Notably Marx

Helms I agree to the extent that Elliot Abram's writings delineate, as opposed to expose, the neocon, Judaic ideals. He is very open in his writings of the 90's. Google.