Creationism, Intelligent Design, and Evolution

Stingray blog ^ | 09/26/2005 | Michael McCullough

[DallasMike]

On Sunday September 25th, the Washington Post published a story called "In Evolution Debate, Creationists Are Breaking New Ground." Out of all the potential stories about Christians out there -- murderous persecutions in China, enslavement of Christians in Africa, the role of Christians in the Katrina cleanup -- the Washington Post chose to write this one.

Young Earth Creationists hold a very narrow construct of the Bible and claim that the earth is only 6,000 or so years old. I don't buy into that construct for the following scientifuc reasons:

• We have earthly evidence that contradict the idea of a 6,000-year old earth such as
• Ice cores from Greenland that provide a record of approximately 110,000 winter and summer cycles.
• Measurements of lead isotope ratios (Pb-206, Pb-207, and either Pb-208 or Pb-204) give statstically reliable ages for the earth of approximately 4.5 billion years.
• Given that the speed of light is relatively constant, how is that objects millions of light years away from earth can be seen? Yes, God COULD have created the light already in transit when he created the universe, but is that really like God?

God would have to be playing games with us to, say, create ice cores that are only 6,000 years old even though they show that 110,000 summers and winters have passed since the layer of ice was first created. God doesn't lie and I believe that his creation shows its true age.

The Biblical construct does not support the idea of a young earth either.

• The Bible states that the Earth is very, very old. Genesis 49:26, Deuteronomy 33:15 and the Habakkuk 3:6 speak of the "ancient" or the "age-old hills".
• The Hebrew word for day (yom)has multiple meanings in Genesis 1. Yom means: "light" as opposed to "darkness" (Genesis 1:5); "day" commencing with "morning" and ending with "evening" (Genesis 1:5,8,13,19,23,31); "day" as opposed to "night" (Genesis 1:14,16,18); "day" with no end (Genesis 2:1-4) and the period of the entire creation 'week' (Genesis 2:4).
• God does not experience time like we experience time. The psalmist wrote "For a thousand years in your sight are like a day that has just gone by..." (Ps 90:4). The apostle Peter quotes this when he says that "With the Lord a day is like a thousand years..." (2 Peter 3:8).

One of the arguments of Young Earth Creationists is that those of us who believe in an old earth are somehow limiting God by saying that God NEEDED long amounts of time to create the universe. That's a bogus argument. God didn't NEED oodles of time but he apparently CHOSE to use oodles of time. God COULD feed all Christians with manna from heaven but he ordinarily CHOOSES to use more mundane things like tasty cows and yummy potatos. Just because I bought my lunch today instead of waiting for manna to fall from the skies doesn't mean that I believe in a weak God.

Are Young-Earth-Creationists fighting the wrong battle? I think so. The whole creation saga takes up about 2 pages in my 800-page Bible. It's more concerned with "who" rather than "how" or "when." If the "when" of creation were really such an important topic, then God would have devoted more time to it in his revelation to the prophets. God appears to be much more concerned with the present and with our eternal than in the past.

The evidence indicates that the earth is very, very old. However, that's not really all that important in the scheme of things. I believe that God created the earth and all things within it. I believe that the Bible is true and inerrant. I have huge problems with Darwinism that are related to its shaky scientific foundations, not any perceived conflict with the Bible.

We need to devote our time to telling others what a relationship with Christ can do for their lives NOW and in their eternal future, not trying to convince them that the earth is 6,000 or 10,000 or 4.5 billion years old. Forget the debate about the age of the earth because that's just getting in the way. Let's put things in perspective and stick to the important topic of how Jesus can change people's lives when they accept him as Lord and Saviour. People need to personally know Jesus, not listen to debates on how old the earth is.

[DallasMike]

 

[stuartcr]

The only thing I could possibly say to either group, would be 'prove it'

[DallasMike]

Would you do me a favor and ping the Creationist list. I know that you and disagree on some points, but we both agree that Jesus Christ is the creator and ruler of the universe and I would argue that this is the important thing.

You're welcome to shoot me down or enlist others to shoot me down -- I'm not infallible and, if perceive that I'm wrong, I will gladly change my beliefs.

[wallcrawlr]

Are Young-Earth-Creationists fighting the wrong battle? I think so. The whole creation saga takes up about 2 pages in my 800-page Bible. It's more concerned with "who" rather than "how" or "when." If the "when" of creation were really such an important topic, then God would have devoted more time to it in his revelation to the prophets. God appears to be much more concerned with the present and with our eternal than in the past.

Revelation 4:11Intelligent Design
See my profile for info

[4CJ]

Forget the debate about the age of the earth because that's just getting in the way. Let's put things in perspective and stick to the important topic of how Jesus can change people's lives when they accept him as Lord and Saviour. People need to personally know Jesus, not listen to debates on how old the earth is.

Genesis being the foundation for the entire Bible, with Jesus acknowledging His part in creation, discrediting the Biblical account of creation means that God/Jesus are liars, that God is not a supernatural being, and that God doesn't know the meaning of the phrase 'evening and morning', and 'it was good'. Adam was created an adult, just as the universe was created 'with age'.

Those that prefer to believe that their existence is due to some chance is welcome to continue to do so, but I believe that God created us for a reason.

[trisham]

Interesting article. Thanks for the ping.

[DallasMike]

Thanks for the ping. Please feel free to visit my main blogsite, Stingray, if this column touched you in any way.

 

[JasonSC]

Out of all the potential stories about Christians out there -- murderous persecutions in China, enslavement of Christians in Africa, the role of Christians in the Katrina cleanup -- the Washington Post chose to write this one.

Hmmm...is it not true that the creationists are opening up another Flintstones museum?

The article is in the "Nation" section of the Post, anyway, so of course there won't be any stories from foreign countries.

[agrace]

Agreed, creation isn't just in the first few pages, it's all over the Word.

I think the problem is simply the fact that we don't fully understand the dimension we call time. We see through a glass darkly in many ways.

[onedoug]

Gerald L Schroeder, The Science Of God

[xzins]

This doesn't have one thing to do with Intelligent Design.

[GregoTX]

Good article .... Thanks D Mike.

[Uri’el-2012]

Gerald L Schroeder, The Science Of God

Bump

b'shem Y'shua

[flevit]

I will stick to your biblical reasons:

1. "very old" is subjective, you see what you "want" to see. 1000 years is very old. heck 100 years can be ancient history...I mean 9/11 seems to be ancient history.
2.YOM, is not a biblical reason. Yom can mean something like "Days of yore" but it can also mean "1 day" so in context with numbers (first,second, third) and coupled with "mornings" and "evenings" would biblically suggest just that a Day..(it actually has very similar usage to Day of English)

the Dawn of a new Day
vs.
the Dawn of the first Day.

3. read all of that section of 2 peter, it upholds noahs flood as global, it says scoffers won't believe the world was judged with water. it says they won't believe in the "second coming", that "a day is a thousand years" is in direct reference to the Lords patience..that the second coming not delayed, because the lord is slow, but because of his patience. it has nothing to do with words moses wrote a few thousand years earlier that through example God set the stage for a six days of work 1 day or rest...how many days in a week are there anyway?

you still have the problem of death before sin...what did Jesus die for...sin...why was the world created with sin in it??? it wasn't, Adam introduced sin...was Adam real?

could a "very good" world have the stench of rotting corpses, cancer and dismemberment of man and animals in it?

this argument will not provide Salvation, but it may be tough to TRUST in the Word that speaks of a literal resurrection, if it also speaks of Adam and Eve, death entering, vegetarianism, a flood that kills all land animals not on an ark. Which are not to be taken literal?

[LiteKeeper]

YEC INTREP

[DallasMike]

I will stick to your biblical reasons:

I would also like to see you -- or one of the other detractors -- address the scientific reasons. God created the universe. Why did he create it with the appearance of great age if it is less than 10,000 years old. That's not just a science issue but a spiritual issue as well.

YOM, is not a biblical reason. Yom can mean something like "Days of yore" but it can also mean "1 day" so in context with numbers (first,second, third) and coupled with "mornings" and "evenings" would biblically suggest just that a Day..(it actually has very similar usage to Day of English)

You admit that yom can mean something like "days of yore." Isaiah 30:8 says, "Now go, write it before them in a table, and note it in a book, that it may be for the time (yom) to come for ever and ever." This is just one example of the many times that yom is use to mean an indefinite period of time -- in this case, eternity. 

The word yom has multiple meanings. Use the meaning of the word that most fits with what God has shown us from his creation, It's much easier than trying to force creation to fit to a single narrow meaning of a word.

Adam introduced sin...was Adam real?

Yes, Adam and Eve were real persons.

you still have the problem of death before sin

I believe that the physical death of plants and animals existed in the world before Adam and Eve. Lions and tigers were designed to be carnivorous. Bats were designed to catch and eat flying insects. Some bacteria eat other bacteria. The Venus fly trap and the pitcher plant are examples of plants that eat insects. And why would snakes be designed with fangs and poison if it were not to be used against other animals?

Why was there the physical death of plants and animals before Adam and Eve? I don't know. One thing to note is that "the LORD God planted a garden eastward in Eden; and there he put the man whom he had formed. the LORD God planted a garden eastward in Eden; and there he put the man whom he had formed." (Genesis 2:7). God expelled Adam and Eve from the garden after the fall -- to me, that says that the Garden of Eden was a special place on the earth unlike any other place. Some have theorized that Adam and Eve were created to redeem creation from the ravages of Satan. I don't know, but it's possible.

 

 

 

[DallasMike]

Very little time tonight

I understand -- time is a big problem for me, too. Thanks for the nice note.

[flevit]

appearance of great age: would be a tradition/interpretation of man. something that man teaches. (oh but there is also the whole God will use what is foolishness in the world to humble the wise)

yes Yom, just like "Day" in english can either a literal day or a non literal time period. it is discerned by the context of the writing.
why wouldn't you use the biblical writers to help figure out the intent and context of Genesis? would God deceive all the biblical writers?
(whether it disagrees with "science" is a separate question)

IE..find the writers that refer/quote back to Genesis 1-12 and see if they took at as Plainly written...if you do you will find even Jesus and NT writers, quotes it as plain TRUTH, not only that but a foundation for his purpose and an example by which the Jews set up their work week.

[JohnnyM]

"Why did he create it with the appearance of great age if it is less than 10,000 years old."

How come God can create Adam with the appearance of age (he wasn't created a baby), but somehow it is trickery or deceit on His part to create the universe with age?

JM