I recommend to everyone the recent film, "Luther."
Posted on 12/09/2005 11:58:25 PM PST by HarleyD
The History of the Reformation…The Goose That Became a Swan…John Huss (Part 2)
The History of the Reformation… The Morning Star of the Reformation… John Wycliffe (Part 3)
The History of the Reformation…De Haeretico Comburendo… The Lollards (Part 4)
The History of the Reformation...The Little Red Bible Chained to the Wall (Part 5)
The History of the Reformation…The Cowl (Part 6)
The History of the Reformation…Rome and Romans (Part 7)
The History of the Reformation…The Door…(Part 8)
The History of the Reformation…The Three Trials…(Part 9 of 12)
The History of the Reformation…Mass Confusion & Marriage…(Part 10 of 12)
The History of the Reformation…The Law and the Gospel…(Part 11 of 12)
THE ROOTS OF THE REFORMATION (Part 2) BY KARL ADAM
THE ROOTS OF THE REFORMATION (Part 3) BY KARL ADAM
THE ROOTS OF THE REFORMATION (Part 4) BY KARL ADAM
THE ROOTS OF THE REFORMATION (Part 5) BY KARL ADAM
History Ping...
This is laughable. If Luther had read the Gospel, it never showed.
I love this piece. Luther was so human and ornery. As the writer said, a lesser man could not have taken the abuse he endured.
"Here I Stand". Amen!
I recommend to everyone the recent film, "Luther."
Book-marked for remembrance of God's faithful servant.
"...the restoration of the church is the work of God, and no more depends on the hopes and opinions of men, than the resurrection of the dead, or any other miracle of that description. Here, therefore, we are not to wait for facility of action, either from the will of men, or the temper of the times, but must rush forward through the midst of despair. It is the will of our Master that his gospel be preached. Let us obey his command, and follow whithersoever he calls. What the success will be it is not ours to inquire. Our only duty is to wish for what is best, and beseech it of the Lord in prayer; to strive with all zeal, solicitude, and diligence, to bring about the desired result, and, at the same time, to submit with patience to whatever that result may be." -- John Calvin
I was baptized as an infant & confirmed in the old ELC; then much later I was (re)Baptized as a believer. I would never quibble with him regarding infant baptism or even Consubstantiation. After being re-introduced to Luther by my ex-Lutheran (LCMS) Pastor I have read & re-read Bondage of the Will. In it Luther commended Erasmus for, alone among all his critics & enemies, recognizing the issue; which was, from Johnston & Packer’s intro, “The whole work of man’s salvation, first to last, is God’s; and all the glory for it must be God’s also.”
I STILL haven't seen "Luther". My mother saw it at the theater and said it was amazing.
"God had used Luther to restore the gospel"
"This is laughable. If Luther had read the Gospel, it never showed."
It's easy enough to say that, but it's much more difficult to prove that. Luther read the Gospel, and the Law, and the Church Fathers; his writings clearly show that. That he came up with a different conclusion is obvious. Beware of contempt for your opponents; it can lead to pratfalls in the long run.
Amen. That single, factual light-bulb recognition unites every Reformed believer who knows all of salvation, but most especially its inception and completion, is by the will of God alone.
It's either/or; black/white; God ordained/man accomplished.
Either God chose His elect from before the foundation of the world based upon NOTHING in the creature, but according to His sovereign will alone (all men being equally fallen and unable to perform anything God-pleasing), or man has some part in the acquisition of his salvation (which incorrectly presupposes some men are better, smarter, more pious than other men because they "choose" correctly.)
"Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent." -- John 6:29
Either/or.
Since so many of us started out as Arminians (the cultural bias of modern man), we've experienced firsthand this gradual, inevitable progression from Arminian to Reformed, from man to God, from 50/50 to 0/100, from me to only Him, from possibility to predestiny, from hope to true assurance.
I specifically think that Luther missed the meaning of most gospels, in particular, Matthew, as he developed his theory of salvation through faith alone. While we all agree that works done mechanically, without conversion of the heart, are not salvific, works of charity that fortify faith are clearly commanded by Christ. It is of course a gross simplification to say that Luther never read the gospels, and I say so somewhat humorously, but I think that his theory was speculative theology with narrow scriptural support in some passages in Romans and Galatians, which he interpreted in a way that contradicts the bulk of the gospel.
Scripture is clear that fallen man can do nothing God-pleasing. All his works are as filthy rags (Isaiah 64:6).
***Romans 7:18 -- "For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh; for the willing is present in me, but the doing of the good is not." ***Romans 8:5-8 -- "For those who are according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who are according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace, because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so, and those who are in the flesh cannot please God." ***1 Corinthians 2:14 -- "But a natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually appraised." *** John 3:18-21 -- "He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God."Romans 3:10-12, 23 -- "As it is written, There is none righteous, not even one; there is none who understands, there is none who seeks for God; all have turned aside, together they have become useless; there is none who does good, there is not even one.... for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God."
To say man accomplishes his own salvation by the piety of his works usurps the atonement of Jesus Christ and gives natural man an inherent righteousness he does not possess.
By Adam's fall, all men are equally condemned. Only God's grace saves anyone, ordained by Him from before the foundation of the world, according to His will alone through faith in the resurrection of Jesus Christ.
It's so much simpler than many would have it.
All of Him; none of us.
we all agree that works done mechanically, without conversion of the heart, are not salvific, works of charity that fortify faith are clearly commanded by Christ.It is not pelagianusm. Indeed, as St. Paul indicates in many passages, good works are work of the divine grace within us.
The question is (1) are good works commanded, and the scriptural answer is yes (Luke 18:18 and on); and (2) are good works when prompted by faith contributing to salvation, and the scriptural answer is yes (Math 25).
Nothing in Paul contradicts that, and of course it can't because Paul is an apostle of Christ.
You are right, but who gives us that faith? God does. God places a conscience in us with an inner law, as Paul notes; however, we cannot obey the law and would not choose the things of God unless He converted us, and this work is the work of the Holy Spirit. So far, we're on the same page.
The real difference in Protestant theology from Catholic is that we believe the work is God's alone, and man cannot cooperate in the work of salvation. Once there is saving faith, good works result (I would say that our posts to each other would be very minor examples), but that faith is planted and not infused into us.
Glad to see you agree with the Council of Trent, Canons on Justification, canon #1.
Would you say that man enabled by grace cannot cooperate in any part of his justification or sanctification?
If you said merely that the unjustified man apart from the grace of God cannot cooperate, we can agree with you. If you say that the man enabled by grace cannot cooperate, we can't.
Once there is saving faith, good works result
Why then does Christ command works in Luke 18 and Matthew 25? If faith is like a switch that can only go from Off to On position forever, why do the apostles ask Christ to increase their faith (Luke 17:5)? How and why would you want to increase what has already saved you?
Let us read this (Luke 17):
6 And the Lord said: If you had faith like to a grain of mustard seed, you might say to this mulberry tree, Be thou rooted up, and be thou transplanted into the sea: and it would obey you. 7 But which of you having a servant ploughing, or feeding cattle, will say to him, when he is come from the field: Immediately go, sit down to meat: 8 And will not rather say to him: Make ready my supper, and gird thyself, and serve me, whilst I eat and drink, and afterwards thou shalt eat and drink? 9 Doth he thank that servant, for doing the things which he commanded him? 10 I think not. So you also, when you shall have done all these things that are commanded you, say: We are unprofitable servants; we have done that which we ought to do.Note that the faith is likened to a tiny, yet miraculously powerful seed (is it why faith is "planted?). What do we do with seeds? -- We grow them. That demands work, and in fact, unceasing work. Those who wish to take a rest from working on their faith Christ condemns as unprofitable servants. This parable is directly aimed at Luther's once-saved-forever-saved theory. Do you suppose Luther read it?
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