Posted on 01/10/2006 10:06:56 AM PST by Terriergal
LAKE FOREST, Calif. - This week, it was the Rose Bowl players' breakfast. This month, it will be the World Economic Forum in Davos, Switzerland. Then the President's prayer breakfast in Washington, followed by an entertainment industry conference in Los Angeles.
Rick Warren, the Southern Baptist preacher's son from tiny Redwood Valley, Calif., is much in demand these days.
The founding pastor of the Saddleback mega-church south of Los Angeles and the author of the best-selling The Purpose Driven Life, Warren is perhaps the most influential evangelical Christian in America.
With his book - the best-selling hardback nonfiction book in the nation - and Purpose-Driven Life videos and 40-day Bible study plans, Warren has created an unparalleled international network of millions of individuals and 400,000 churches, spanning faiths and denominations.
Now he wants to use his growing influence - and wealth - for an ambitious global attack on poverty, AIDS, illiteracy and disease.
"The New Testament says the church is the body of Christ, but for the last 100 years, the hands and feet have been amputated, and the church has just been a mouth. And mostly, it's been known for what it's against," Warren said during a break between services at his sprawling Orange County church campus.
"I'm so tired of Christians being known for what they're against."
Fresh from preaching to 38,000 congregants during Christmas week services, Warren was looking to the future by invoking the past.
"One of my goals is to take evangelicals back a century, to the 19th century," said Warren, 51, shifting painfully in his chair because of a back sprain suffered during an all-terrain-vehicle romp with his 20-year-old son, Matthew. "That was a time of muscular Christianity that cared about every aspect of life."
Not just personal salvation, but social action. Abolishing slavery. Ending child labor. Winning the right for women to vote.
It's time for modern evangelicals to trade words for deeds and get similarly involved, Warren contends.
At the end of his second sermon last Sunday, he reminded his largely affluent Orange County audience: "Life is not about having more and getting more. It's about serving God and serving others."
That, simply put, is his message. Give your life to God, help others, spread the word. It is the same message that Christians have been preaching for 2,000 years. Warren has updated the language, added catchphrases and five-step guides, but he readily admits "there is not a new idea in that book."
The Purpose Driven Life has sold more than 24 million English-language copies since 2002, with millions more in other languages. It has been popular with Lutherans, Catholics, Baptists, Methodists, Presbyterians, with pastors and priests using it as a Bible-study handbook.
The book figured prominently in a hostage drama in Georgia last March. Ashley Smith, held by alleged Atlanta courthouse killer Brian Nichols, said he released her after she gave him methamphetamine and read to him from the book.
Warren "is able to cast the Christian story so people can hear it in fresh ways," said Donald E. Miller, director of the Center for Religion and Civic Culture at the University of Southern California. He is "a very important figure in evangelical Christianity," part of a "trend we'll see more of," Miller said, citing Warren's independence, social activism, informality and ability to reach across racial and national lines.
"The Gen X-ers are sick and tired of flash and hype and marketing," Miller said. "The soft sell of a Rick Warren is far more attractive to them than a highly stylized TV presentation of the Christian message."
Among evangelicals, Warren is more influential than better-known and more-divisive figures such as religious broadcasters Pat Robertson and Jerry Falwell or radio psychologist James Dobson, and is often seen as the heir to the Rev. Billy Graham as "America's pastor."
Scott L. Thumma, a professor of the sociology of religion at Hartford Seminary and the author of a forthcoming book on mega-churches, said polls of church leaders often put Warren in first or second place among most-influential evangelical leaders.
"And one of the interesting things is that he crosses boundaries... . He's not just respected by the evangelical world but by many outside that world," Thumma said.
In North Philadelphia, the Rev. Herbert Lusk, the former Philadelphia Eagles running back who is pastor of the Greater Exodus Baptist Church and a prominent supporter of President Bush, brought Warren to town in November to raise money for aid to Africa. Lusk also tutored many of the Eagles' players and coaches in the Purpose-Driven Life program last year.
Lusk said Warren "took the principles that we preach about every Sunday and packaged them in a way that are palatable for Christians and non-Christians."
"The guy is a preacher's preacher... . He's the leading evangelical in the world, unquestionably," Lusk said.
Broadly defined, evangelicals are Christians who have had a personal or "born-again" religious conversion, believe the Bible is the word of God, and believe in spreading their faith. (The term comes from Greek; to "evangelize" means to preach the gospel.) The term is typically applied to Protestants.
Millions of Americans fit the definition, although estimates vary on exactly how many. Forty-two percent of Americans described themselves as evangelical Christians in a Gallup poll in April, while 22 percent said they met all three measures in a Gallup survey in May. The National Association of Evangelicals says about 25 percent of adult Americans are evangelicals.
Evangelicals are often equated with fundamentalists or the religious right, which annoys Warren. Although he's politically conservative - opposing abortion and gay marriage and supporting the death penalty - he pushes a much broader agenda and disdains both politics and fundamentalism.
Warren is a friend of President Bush and a repeat visitor to the White House. But he also met for several hours at Saddleback last month with Sen. John Kerry, the 2004 Democratic presidential nominee, to discuss issues such as poverty and the environment.
"I'm worried that evangelicals be identified too much with one party or the other. When that happens, you lose your prophetic role of speaking truth to power," Warren said. "And you have to defend stupid things that leaders do."
"Politics is always downstream from culture. I place less confidence in it than a lot of folks. I don't think that's the answer... . Politics is not the right tool to change the culture."
With his goatee and penchant for Hawaiian shirts and colloquial language, Warren embodies a laid-back approach to worship that resonates with Americans who have little allegiance to formal denominations or rituals.
His 120-acre hilltop campus, with palm trees, waterfall and meandering brook, is a kind of religious theme park, where worshipers meet in different buildings to suit their musical preferences, while watching simultaneous video feeds of Warren preaching at the main worship center.
Warren's father and grandfather and great-grandfather were all preachers. He followed their path by starting Saddleback in 1980 with his wife, Kay, and a congregation of seven. His ministry prospered in booming Orange County, as Warren went door-to-door, asking residents what they'd like in a church. For 15 years, he and his growing flock were nomads, meeting in schools, homes and other buildings. Construction started on the current campus in 1995, and Warren now has 80,000 names on Saddleback's rolls. Saddleback is a a Southern Baptist church, but it doesn't advertise the fact.
As the money has rolled in from his book, Warren said he has given most of the millions to the church and the three social-service foundations he has established. He stopped taking his $110,000 annual salary and repaid the church for his 25 years of salary since its founding. He and his wife became "reverse tithers," he said, keeping 10 percent of their income and giving away the rest, including $13 million in 2004.
This month, he is leading a trip to Rwanda, to train pastors and distribute medicine and money to battle AIDS and other diseases. It's part of what he calls his global PEACE plan (Plant a church, Equip leaders, Assist the poor, Care for the sick, Educate the next generation).
Last month, he launched the first major evangelical effort to battle AIDS, convening a three-day conference at Saddleback to mobilize American Christians to help AIDS victims and raise money to fight the disease. Part of the battle for Warren is overcoming resistance from evangelicals who view AIDS as strictly a gay disease or even as divine retribution for immoral behavior.
Warren said he sees religious institutions as more powerful forces than governments for solving the world's problems.
"I would trust any imam or priest or rabbi to know what is going on in a community before I would any government agency."
But, powerful as churches can be in working for the powerless, they can't succeed without governments and nongovernmental organizations, Warren said.
Warren predicts that fundamentalism, of all varieties, will be "one of the big enemies of the 21st century."
"Muslim fundamentalism, Christian fundamentalism, Jewish fundamentalism, secular fundamentalism - they're all motivated by fear. Fear of each other."
ONLINE EXTRA
To read the rest of the series on the evangelical movement by Paul Nussbaum, visit http://go.philly.com/religion
You are right, but when the sheep who think they are goats see how good the feast is they will come into their own.
I'm not comment on anything else except his choice of words. I assume he is smart enough to know how that phrase would be taken. I am sure he got a lot of approval for it in some quarters.
If you were to ask the congregants of such a church why they go to that particular church, what do you think the responses would look like?
Probably something like:
"I get to wear jeans"
"I like the music"
"I can drink a soda during the service"
"I can act casual"
"The sermons aren't long and preachy"
"No boring hymns"
All translate into fleshly needs, and I am not simply assuming. These were the responses received by our former pastor when he implemented the PDC model at our old church. He then sought to change the service to accommodate.
The very first step in Rick Warren's plan is to conduct a survey and find out why people in an area don't like church, then make the necessary changes to suit them. To make church more attractive to them. Correct?
The motive for the church-goer at that point becomes their personal comfort and ease, not a desire to worship their creator with awe and reverence. You've now set the standard for their future attendance, and the moment they become uncomfortable, they'll be the first ones to leave.
You've now made worship conditional, basd upon their desires and comfort. It becomes "If I can't wear jeans, then I won't go." If ___, then ___. Conditional worship.
What you win them with is what you win them to.
Just like the pop music. Who are they worshipping? the God of the Bible - the God of love, judgement, wrath, and mercy - the God who commands us to flee from our sins?
Or, are they worshipping the kindly, nonjudgemental, psychiatrist grandpa-god of contemporary desires?
If those musicians were "won" to a theology of cheap grace and man-centered worship, then that's what they'll write and produce. There's a lot of fluff in modern pop-christianity music - it's largely a mile wide but an inch deep. You can't say the same for the great hymns of old - it's like comparing Main King Lobster to genea can of tuna.
Now, don't get me wrong. I do enjoy some of the contemporary music, and it certainly does have it's place, but not in the worship service. It's better than listening to gangsta-rap and
Even if bringing in the goats gets in the way of "true worship", it is not an option. We are commanded to compel them to come in. In Calvin's day it was easy to get them to come in. They were threatened with flogging if they didn't come in. So there was no need to entertain the goats, because if they fell asleep during the sermon they would be flogged. They pretended to be sheep to keep from being beaten.
Nowadays we are still under a commandment to go out into the streets and compel them (goats, sheep, pigs) to come in. But we can't flog them if they refuse. We are also called to be fishers of men and fishermen use lures. Thus if we are going to compel them to come in we have to give them some reason to enter besides threat of violence.
Some have chosen to lure believers with the threat of a friendly smile, good music, and a decent cup of joe. If it compels some to come in, then it is in line with the commandment. If they are sheep, they will stay with the flock. If they are goats... well we may not ever know. God will separate the sheep from the goats. Or don't you believe that?
During the reformation the Magistrates would often order the legal authorities to go out into an area and find out why people weren't going to church. If they weren't infirm or on their death beds, they would be taken to the center of town where they would be flogged and placed in stocks. After a few visits from the law, these people would be very motivated to go to church every Sunday.
The motive of people back then to attend church was quite often for "personal comfort and ease, not a desire to worship their creator with awe and reverence." The powers that be set the standard for their future attendance.
Nobody complained back then about a concern that the church was filling up with goats. They fed the sheep and at the same time entertained the goats by keeping them awake by the fear of pain and humiliation.
It is not a choice. We are commanded to go into the streets and compel them to come in. We can't threaten them with violence. But we can offer them a smile and a cup of coffee and a promise that the experience may just change their lives.
How about "I come to the garden alone,
while the dew is still on the roses,
and the voice I hear,
falling on my ear,
the Son of God discloses.
And He walks with me,
and He talks with me,
And He tells me I am His own,
And the joy we share,
As we tarry there,
None other has ever known"
done to sensual waltz time,
And "The Lyrics:
Who am I that You are mindful of me
That You hear me when I call
Is it true that You are thinking of me
How You love me it's amazing
(Chorus)
I am a friend of God
I am a friend of God
I am a friend of God
He calls me friend
God Almighty, Lord of Glory
You have called me friend
(Repeat Chorus)
He calls me friend
He calls me friend..."
Not done to waltz time, just an energizing beat.
The first has a nice warm sentimental verse but lousey theology and the second has deep theological content and an up beat rhythm. Which do you prefer?
Church is the goal of evangelism, not the place for it.
Tell that to me and millions of others who were yanked off the street and compelled to come to church and who met Christ there.
Wherever two or more are gathered... Where better to meet the Lord? Where better to hear his voice? He's there already.
When Christ healed, he was not saving them from eternal damnation. He was responding to their "felt needs".
And trust me, I am no fan of the prosperity doctrine. And every large church I have been in gives me the willies (I've been to Willow Creek and Overlake). That said, If I believe a shoe here fits Warren, I'll say so. If i don't believe it does, then I'll say that too. No man is pure evil nor pure good. The only one was/is Jesus. Even the apostle Paul understood his own weaknesses.
I have yet to see any quotes by Warren here that are doctrinally incorrect, where he is trying to be quite specific. I have seen INFERENCES that would make them doctrinally incorrect. But that is different issue. And until he has the opportunity to defend himself against the monologues here I will withhold my judgement.
Two things. I am concerned when people here use the term "unbiblical methods". Second, I don't understand what one means by "watered down". If you were to take some chapters out of Galations and asked them to stand on their own, they too would appear "watered down". But they are not intended to stand alone. Like any preacher, Warrens comments that are quoted here are presented within a certain context to address a particular issue.
I am still seing no smoking gun on any major doctrinal issues. Most of it is "style" stuff.
"I assume he is smart enough to know how that phrase would be taken."
Yes, within the context. Is the context included in the quotes offered here? Are the remarks off the cuff or written speaches. It matters - before I will publicly villify any man.
Based on the attitudes of a lot of posters here, It seems as though we have a lot of Jehovas Witnesses present.
LOL great response
I hope so :)
One of the frozen chosen
They were men that saw an erosion of the gospel and took up the cause to preserve it.
I think it (the gospel) is once again under attack, but now the people that claim the name "fundamentalists" are actually not in unity on many things.
"Because the dead in Christ shall rise first.
I hope so :)
One of the frozen chosen"
Great sense of humor, but then living where you do frozen is an accurate term.
Needless to say, it has been quite a while since I read anything in the "new testament," but I don't recall women's suffrage being a big topic. As a matter of fact, I don't recall anything about suffrage (or "democracy") at all.
If I had to guess, I'd say he's exhausted all his own ideas, biblical knowledge and education. After becoming suddenly successful in his original area of expertise (if you can call it that), he has surrounded himself with advisors and sycophants who have groomed him for mass-consumption - telling him what press releases to make, what social projects to pursue, and what market segments to appeal to, to increase his influence and, market share.
Except among the fundamentalists, of course. Rick's made it plain he doesn't want our money.
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