Portiuncula Indulgence can be obtained this Sunday

Catholic News Agency ^ | August 4, 2006

[NYer]

Assisi, Aug. 04, 2006 (CNA) - This Sunday Catholics can obtain the Portiuncula Indulgence by visiting any Franciscan parish or chapel around the world.

In the summer of 1216 while praying in the Portiuncula chapel outside of Assisi, St. Francis was inspired to travel to Rome and ask the Pope for an unheard-of privilege: the granting of a plenary indulgence.

Pope Honorius III granted the indulgence as a sign of the greatness of God’s love for humanity.  August 2nd was established as the date to receive the “Great Pardon of Assisi.”  Eventually, the Church modified the conditions and said the faithful could obtain the indulgence either on August 2nd or on the following Sunday by visiting any Franciscan parish or chapel throughout the world. The conditions for gaining the indulgence include praying the Our Father and the Creed, as well as receiving the Sacraments of Reconciliation and the Eucharist, and praying for the intentions of the Holy Father.

[Dr. Eckleburg]

He assured them that whoever entered and prayed with a sincere heart, their prayers would be answered. In 1985, I visited the Porziuncola. There on bended knee I asked our Lord for a special favor. Nine months later, that prayer was answered in an extraordinary way.

It wasn't where you prayed that mattered. It was the words in your heart and the goodness of Him who answered your prayer.

[adiaireton8]

What authority do you have to tell us whether some places are more sacred than others?

-A8

[Dr. Eckleburg]

You asked me not to post to you, but now you're posting to me. Hmmm...

A building made of brick and mortar and gilding is not sacred. But the RCC seems to worship all sorts of things we're admonished not to fall down to so it's no surprise you'd ask this question. It's just more idolatry.

People make up the church, not the other way around.

"Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

Wherefore also it is contained in the scripture, Behold, I lay in Sion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and he that believeth on him shall not be confounded." -- 1 Peter 2:5-6

What authority do you have to tell us whether some places are more sacred than others?

The Holy Scriptures tell all those with ears to hear.

"Now while Paul waited for them at Athens, his spirit was stirred in him, when he saw the city wholly given to idolatry.

Therefore disputed he in the synagogue with the Jews, and with the devout persons, and in the market daily with them that met with him.

Then certain philosophers of the Epicureans, and of the Stoicks, encountered him. And some said, What will this babbler say? other some, He seemeth to be a setter forth of strange gods: because he preached unto them Jesus, and the resurrection.

And they took him, and brought him unto Areopagus, saying, May we know what this new doctrine, whereof thou speakest, is?

For thou bringest certain strange things to our ears: we would know therefore what these things mean.

(For all the Athenians and strangers which were there spent their time in nothing else, but either to tell, or to hear some new thing.)

Then Paul stood in the midst of Mars' hill, and said, Ye men of Athens, I perceive that in all things ye are too superstitious.

For as I passed by, and beheld your devotions, I found an altar with this inscription, TO THE UNKNOWN GOD. Whom therefore ye ignorantly worship, him declare I unto you.

God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;

Neither is worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things;

And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;

That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:

For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.

Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.

And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead." -- Acts 17:16-31

And for good measure...

"There is no biblical norm as to where, and where not, the church should meet. The central fact is that the early concept of the church had no connection with a church building. The church was something else: a group of Christians drawn together by the Holy Spirit in a place where they worked together in a certain form..." -- Francis Schaeffer, "The Church at the End of the Twentieth Century."

[adiaireton8]

I never asked you not to post to me. (I'm not sure where you got that idea.)

I asked you what authority you have to tell us whether some places are more sacred than others, and you responded by quoting two passages of Scripture and Schaeffer. I didn't ask what authority Schaeffer has, but what authority *you* have. Any heretic can quote Scripture, as St. Vincent of Lerins shows. Even the devil can quote Scripture, and he has no authority in the Church. So quoting Scripture does not show that you have any authority to say whether some places are more sacred than others.

-A8

[Dr. Eckleburg]

So quoting Scripture does not show that you have any authority to say whether some places are more sacred than others.

As you say, any man can quote Scripture. But the "authority" (since you're looking for authority) is not in the action of quoting the words nor in the man quoting it. The "authority" resides in the Scripture itself through the illumination of the Holy Spirit.

If the Scripture quoted to you does not speak to your heart and awaken a certain Godly understanding in you, then perhaps you might pray that the Holy Spirit gives you ears to hear and a new heart with which to know your salvation.

Protestants do not believe in magical incantations, unlike in the RCC which teaches that specific words have some intrinsic mystical power in and of themselves (i.e. the priest using the "correct words" during the Lord's Supper in order to make the mass "valid.")

In Scripture, the words are used as the means by which the Holy Spirit makes Himself known to us "by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost" (Titus 3:5).

RCs bow to the "authority" of their magisterium and all the "authority" the magisterium doles out to various saints, bishops, relics and rites.

OTOH, Bible-believing Protestants bow to the "authority" of Christ alone revealed to us through the word of God. And this we know by the work of the indwelling Holy Spirit who speaks to our hearts and minds through Scripture and prayer.

Please show me in Scripture where God tells us that after Christ's resurrection some dirt is more sacred than other dirt and some buildings are more sacred than other buildings. Because the Scripture I quoted to you contradicts those faulty beliefs.

"God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;

Neither is worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things...

Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.

And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent" -- Acts 17:24-25;29-30

It looks like from these verses in Acts, you and I are called to repent of the false belief that buildings and dirt and even physical objects like statues and icons are "sacred."

It's just more idolatry, since all men are prone to creating idols of their own imaginings.

"Then shall it be for a man to burn: for he will take thereof, and warm himself; yea, he kindleth it, and baketh bread; yea, he maketh a god, and worshippeth it; he maketh it a graven image, and falleth down thereto.

He burneth part thereof in the fire; with part thereof he eateth flesh; he roasteth roast, and is satisfied: yea, he warmeth himself, and saith, Aha, I am warm, I have seen the fire:

And the residue thereof he maketh a god, even his graven image: he falleth down unto it, and worshippeth it, and prayeth unto it, and saith, Deliver me; for thou art my god.

They have not known nor understood: for he hath shut their eyes, that they cannot see; and their hearts, that they cannot understand.

And none considereth in his heart, neither is there knowledge nor understanding to say, I have burned part of it in the fire; yea, also I have baked bread upon the coals thereof; I have roasted flesh, and eaten it: and shall I make the residue thereof an abomination? shall I fall down to the stock of a tree?

He feedeth on ashes: a deceived heart hath turned him aside, that he cannot deliver his soul, nor say, Is there not a lie in my right hand?" -- Isaiah 44:15-20

Was Isaiah wrong?

[adiaireton8]

But the "authority" ... is not in the action of quoting the words nor in the man quoting it. The "authority" resides in the Scripture itself through the illumination of the Holy Spirit.

Your position, as best I can tell, is that there is no magisterial authority; only Scripture has authority. So, your statement above is just your opinion. Millions of people have opinions, and yours is just one of the millions, no more authoritative than Benny Hinn's or Joseph Smith's or Pat Robertson's.

-A8

[Dr. Eckleburg]

Your statement seems to presume there is no true and real authority.

My point is that there is most definitely an authority. I believe that authority is the Holy Spirit speaking through Scripture, as expained in Scripture and understood by all those with ears to hear.

RCs, OTOH, identify this authority as the magisterium.

[Dr. Eckleburg]

Was Isaiah wrong?

[Dr. Eckleburg]

WESTMINSTER CONFESSION OF FAITH
Chapter XX
Of Christian Liberty, and
Liberty of Conscience

I. The liberty which Christ has purchased for believers under the Gospel consists in their freedom from the guilt of sin, and condemning wrath of God, the curse of the moral law;[1] and, in their being delivered from this present evil world, bondage to Satan, and dominion of sin;[2] from the evil of afflictions, the sting of death, the victory of the grace, and everlasting damnation;[3] as also, in their free access to God,[4] and their yielding obedience unto Him, not out of slavish fear, but a child-like love and willing mind.[5] All which were common also to believers under the law.[6] But, under the New Testament, the liberty of Christians is further enlarged, in their freedom from the yoke of the ceremonial law, to which the Jewish Church was subjected;[7] and in greater boldness of access to the throne of grace,[8] and in fuller communications of the free Spirit of God, than believers under the law did ordinarily partake of.[9]

II. God alone is Lord of the conscience,[10] and has left it free from the doctrines and commandments of men, which are, in any thing, contrary to His Word; or beside it, if matters of faith, or worship.[11] So that, to believe such doctrines, or to obey such commands, out of conscience, is to betray true liberty of conscience:[12] and the requiring of an implicit faith, and an absolute and blind obedience, is to destroy liberty of conscience, and reason also.[13]

III. They who, upon pretence of Christian liberty, do practice any sin, or cherish any lust, do thereby destroy the end of Christian liberty, which is, that being delivered out of the hands of our enemies, we might serve the Lord without fear, in holiness and righteousness before Him, all the days of our life.[14]

IV. And because the powers which God has ordained, and the liberty which Christ has purchased are not intended by God to destroy, but mutually to uphold and preserve one another, they who, upon pretence of Christian liberty, shall oppose any lawful power, or the lawful exercise of it, whether it be civil or ecclesiastical, resist the ordinance of God.[15] And, for their publishing of such opinions, or maintaining of such practices, as are contrary to the light of nature, or to the known principles of Christianity (whether concerning faith, worship, or conversation), or to the power of godliness; or, such erroneous opinions or practices, as either in their own nature, or in the manner of publishing or maintaining them, are destructive to the external peace and order which Christ has established in the Church, they may lawfully be called to account,[16] and proceeded against, by the censures of the Church. and by the power of the civil magistrate.[17]

The numbered Scriptural proofs are found on the linked website.

[adiaireton8]

Your statement seems to presume there is no true and real authority.

I have no idea how you derived that conclusion. I believe that Scripture is authoritative. I also believe, that the part of Apostolic Tradition that was not recorded in Scripture is authoritative. I also believe in a living and authoritative magisterium. So according to my position, there are *three* "true and real" authorities.

I believe that authority is the Holy Spirit speaking through Scripture, as explained in Scripture and understood by all those with ears to hear.

That's almost exactly what the Mormons told me. When I rejected the Mormon teaching, they told me that I didn't have ears to ear. Before that, when I rejected the Health and Wealth gospel of some Pentecostals, they told me that I didn't have the ears to ear. Just recently some Jehovah's Witnesses came to my door, and when I started refuting their position they essentially said that I didn't have ears to ear what the Spirit is saying.

The position you are describing is a form of gnosticism, similar to Montanism. Each person follows what he or she believes the Spirit is speaking through their own private interpretation of Scripture. It is pure individualism that hides behind the appearance of submission to Scripture. But by making oneself the chief interpreter of Scripture for oneself, one is in fact one's own authority. That is why there are so many Protestant denominations; each person is his own authority. If he doesn't agree with what his pastor is saying, he just goes and joins another church that teaches what he thinks, or starts one up if necessary.

-A8

[adiaireton8]

Was Isaiah wrong?

Of course not. Your interpretation/application, on the other hand, is a different story.

-A8

[adiaireton8]

What authority does the Westminster Confession of Faith have? Why should I give a hoot what it says?

-A8

[Dr. Eckleburg]

The position you are describing is a form of gnosticism, similar to Montanism. Each person follows what he or she believes the Spirit is speaking through their own private interpretation of Scripture.

LOL. Only according to an authoritarian who bows to a word-of-mouth magisterium.

And only if every person believed something different. But they don't as evidenced by the cohesion of the Westminster Confessions. Protestants try the spirits, rightly divide the word of God, compare Scripture with Scripture and thankfully are given to understand the truth as written for all to see in the Bible.

It's just not that difficult. It's all there in black and white. And none of it includes "another Christ" priestcraft, a magical metamorphosis of the Lord's Supper, praying to idols, worshiping and/or venerating Mary, fantasies like purgatory and limbo, and most especially Scripture precludes a works-based salvation which is at the heart of the RCC.

[Dr. Eckleburg]

I also believe, that the part of Apostolic Tradition that was not recorded in Scripture is authoritative.

It's awfully difficult to prove a negative or substantiate something that, by definition, doesn't exist except in your word-of-mouth opinions.

I'll rely on the written word of God. It hasn't failed me yet.

[Dr. Eckleburg]

What authority does the Westminster Confession of Faith have?

It's authority, always second to and dependent on Scripture, comes from the fact that every word is founded on Biblical truths.

Unlike the RCC catechism which is filled with extra-Biblical suppositions, conjectures, fabrications and outright fantasies.

[adiaireton8]

It looks like from these verses in Acts, you and I are called to repent of the false belief that buildings and dirt and even physical objects like statues and icons are "sacred."

You mean this verse in Acts: "Then the Lord said to him, 'Take off your sandals; the place where you are standing is holy ground."? (Acts 7:33)

Or this verse in Acts: "so that even handkerchiefs and aprons that had touched him were taken to the sick, and their illnesses were cured and the evil spirits left them." (Acts 19:12)

In Matthew 23:17, Jesus says, "You blind fools! Which is greater: the gold, or the temple that makes the gold sacred?" So Jesus agrees that the gold is sacred.

St. Peter says, "We ourselves heard this voice that came from heaven when we were with him on the sacred mountain." (2 Peter 1:18) So St. Peter believed that mountain upon which Jesus was transfigured was sacred.

-A8

[adiaireton8]

It's just not that difficult.

You are living in a fantasy world. If it were really true that "It's just not that difficult", then all the Protestant denominations would not be divided. The facts refute you. Look around. You are in (or trying to join) the OPC, which has about 30,000 members. In your view the OPC is the denomination which, in your view, comes closest to getting it all right. So, out of all the millions and millions of Christians in the world, around 30,000 are getting it right, in your view. And yet you can claim with a straight face (I presume) that "It's just not that difficult." Dump a bucket of cold water over your head.

-A8

[adiaireton8]

It's authority, always second to and dependent on Scripture, comes from the fact that every word is founded on Biblical truths.

All the Protestant denominations claim the same thing about their respective creeds and confessions. So are they all therefore authoritative? No. So obviously that is not sufficient to give the WCF any authority. Otherwise you will have to give the Baptist confessions authority, the Lutheran confessions authority, the Anglican confessions authority, etc.

-A8

[adiaireton8]

I'll rely on the written word of God. It hasn't failed me yet.

But in your view it has failed 99.999% of the rest of Christendom, since they don't believe what the OPC teaches. You just got lucky, apparently, to be in that .001%. Amazing.

-A8

[Dr. Eckleburg]

We rightly divide the word of God and see what lines up with it. We may disagree, but there is only one truth and we all know that is the goal.

Have more trust in God and the power of the Holy Spirit to reach every man's heart whom the Lord desires.

"Hold fast the form of sound words, which thou hast heard of me, in faith and love which is in Christ Jesus." -- 2 Timothy 1:13

We cannot hear Paul's words, but we can read them.

And Christ's words, too...

"But he answered and said, Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up.

Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch." — Matthew 15:13-14