Be not Talkative

The Pilgrim's Progress ^ | 1678 | John Bunyan

[Frumanchu]

This excerpt is taken from the Christian classic, The Pilgrim's Progress by John Bunyan.

FAITHFUL: Then Faithful stepped forward again, and said to Talkative, Come, what cheer? How is it now?

TALKATIVE: Thank you, well: I thought we should have had a great deal of talk by this time.

FAITHFUL: Well, if you will, we will fall to it now; and since you left it with me to state the question, let it be this: How doth the saving grace of God discover itself when it is in the heart of man?

TALKATIVE: I perceive, then, that our talk must be about the power of things. Well, it is a very good question, and I shall be willing to answer you. And take my answer in brief, thus: First, where the grace of God is in the heart, it causeth there a great outcry against sin. Secondly-

FAITHFUL: Nay, hold; let us consider of one at once. I think you should rather say, it shows itself by inclining the soul to abhor its sin.

TALKATIVE: Why, what difference is there between crying out against, and abhorring of sin?

FAITHFUL: Oh! a great deal. A man may cry out against sin, of policy; but he cannot abhor it but by virtue of a godly antipathy against it. I have heard many cry out against sin in the pulpit, who yet can abide it well enough in the heart, house, and conversation. Gen. 39:15. Joseph’s mistress cried out with a loud voice, as if she had been very holy; but she would willingly, notwithstanding that, have committed uncleanness with him. Some cry out against sin, even as the mother cries out against her child in her lap, when she calleth it slut and naughty girl, and then falls to hugging and kissing it.

TALKATIVE: You lie at the catch, I perceive.

FAITHFUL: No, not I; I am only for setting things right. But what is the second thing whereby you would prove a discovery of a work of grace in the heart?

TALKATIVE: Great knowledge of gospel mysteries.

FAITHFUL: This sign should have been first: but, first or last, it is also false; for knowledge, great knowledge, may be obtained in the mysteries of the Gospel, and yet no work of grace in the soul. Yea, if a man have all knowledge, he may yet be nothing, and so, consequently, be no child of God. 1 Cor. 13:2. When Christ said, “Do you know all these things?” and the disciples answered, Yes, he added, “Blessed are ye if ye do them.” He doth not lay the blessing in the knowing of them, but in the doing of them. For there is a knowledge that is not attended with doing: “He that knoweth his Master’s will, and doeth it not.” A man may know like an angel, and yet be no Christian: therefore your sign of it is not true. Indeed, to know is a thing that pleaseth talkers and boasters; but to do is that which pleaseth God. Not that the heart can be good without knowledge, for without that the heart is naught. There are, therefore, two sorts of knowledge, knowledge that resteth in the bare speculation of things, and knowledge that is accompanied with the grace of faith and love, which puts a man upon doing even the will of God from the heart: the first of these will serve the talker; but without the other, the true Christian is not content. “Give me understanding, and I shall keep thy law; yea, I shall observe it with my whole heart.” Psa. 119:34.

TALKATIVE: You lie at the catch again: this is not for edification.

FAITHFUL: Well, if you please, propound another sign how this work of grace discovereth itself where it is.

TALKATIVE: Not I, for I see we shall not agree.

FAITHFUL: Well, if you will not, will you give me leave to do it?

TALKATIVE: You may use your liberty.

FAITHFUL: A work of grace in the soul discovereth itself, either to him that hath it, or to standers-by.

To him that hath it, thus: It gives him conviction of sin, especially the defilement of his nature, and the sin of unbelief, for the sake of which he is sure to be damned, if he findeth not mercy at God’s hand, by faith in Jesus Christ. This sight and sense of things worketh in him sorrow and shame for sin. Psa. 38:18; Jer. 31:19; John 16:8; Rom. 7:24; Mark 16:16; Gal. 2:16; Rev. 1:6. He findeth, moreover, revealed in him the Saviour of the world, and the absolute necessity of closing with him for life; at the which he findeth hungerings and thirstings after him; to which hungerings, etc., the promise is made. Now, according to the strength or weakness of his faith in his Saviour, so is his joy and peace, so is his love to holiness, so are his desires to know him more, and also to serve him in this world. But though, I say, it discovereth itself thus unto him, yet it is but seldom that he is able to conclude that this is a work of grace; because his corruptions now, and his abused reason, make his mind to misjudge in this matter: therefore in him that hath this work there is required a very sound judgment, before he can with steadiness conclude that this is a work of grace. John 16:9; Gal. 2:15,16; Acts 4:12; Matt. 5:6; Rev. 21:6.

To others it is thus discovered:

1. By an experimental confession of his faith in Christ. 2. By a life answerable to that confession; to wit, a life of holiness-heart-holiness, family-holiness, (if he hath a family,) and by conversation-holiness in the world; which in the general teacheth him inwardly to abhor his sin, and himself for that, in secret; to suppress it in his family, and to promote holiness in the world: not by talk only, as a hypocrite or talkative person may do, but by a practical subjection in faith and love to the power of the word. Job 42:5,6; Psa. 50:23; Ezek. 20:43; Matt. 5:8; John 14:15; Rom. 10:10; Ezek. 36:25; Phil. 1:27; 3:17-20. And now, sir, as to this brief description of the work of grace, and also the discovery of it, if you have aught to object, object; if not, then give me leave to propound to you a second question.

TALKATIVE: Nay, my part is not now to object, but to hear; let me, therefore, have your second question.

FAITHFUL: It is this: Do you experience this first part of the description of it; and doth your life and conversation testify the same? Or standeth your religion in word or tongue, and not in deed and truth? Pray, if you incline to answer me in this, say no more than you know the God above will say Amen to, and also nothing but what your conscience can justify you in; for not he that commendeth himself is approved, but whom the Lord commendeth. Besides, to say I am thus and thus, when my conversation, and all my neighbors, tell me I lie, is great wickedness.

Then Talkative at first began to blush; but, recovering himself, thus he replied: You come now to experience, to conscience, and to God; and to appeal to him for justification of what is spoken. This kind of discourse I did not expect; nor am I disposed to give an answer to such questions, because I count not myself bound thereto, unless you take upon you to be a catechiser; and though you should so do, yet I may refuse to make you my judge. But I pray, will you tell me why you ask me such questions?

FAITHFUL: Because I saw you forward to talk, and because I knew not that you had aught else but notion. Besides, to tell you all the truth, I have heard of you that you are a man whose religion lies in talk, and that your conversation gives this your mouth-profession the lie. They say you are a spot among Christians, and that religion fareth the worse for your ungodly conversation; that some have already stumbled at your wicked ways, and that more are in danger of being destroyed thereby: your religion, and an ale-house, and covetousness, and uncleanness, and swearing, and lying, and vain company-keeping, etc., will stand together. The proverb is true of you which is said of a harlot, to wit, “That she is a shame to all women:” so are you a shame to all professors.

TALKATIVE: Since you are so ready to take up reports, and to judge so rashly as you do, I cannot but conclude you are some peevish or melancholy man, not fit to be discoursed with; and so adieu.

[Frumanchu]

Prior to the above exchange, Faithful met Talkative while walking with Christian on the way to the Celestial City. At first he is quite impressed with the ostensible wisdom Talkative speaks and remarks to Christian what a "brave companion" they now have. Christian then reveals that he knows Talkative from whence he came (the City of Destruction) and that "as he talketh now with you, so will he talk when he is on the ale-bench; and the more drink he hath in his crown, the more of these things he hath in his mouth. Religion hath no place in his heart, or house, or conversation; all he hath lieth in his tongue, and his religion is to make a noise therewith." In other words, he is all talk and no action...all "faith" and no works as it were. Faithful purposes then at Christian's suggestion to dig a little deeper and what follows is posted above.

I posted this because it reminded me of many conversations that have been had in the FR Religion Forum, and because it stands as a cautionary tale to all of us about how very useless all of our lofty discourses here are apart from a living faith.

Be doers of the word, and not hearers (or speakers) only!

[Frumanchu]

Ping to a few saints.

After many years of intention without action, I've finally picked up Bunyan's The Pilgrim's Progress. I've found it to be a wonderful read, even in the original wording, and HIGHLY recommend it to everybody.

[Corin Stormhands]

Thanks for the ping. But I'm afraid to say anything...

[Frumanchu]

LOL!

[xzins]

I know that many have considered the Pilgrim's Progress a great Christian classic. I know that I'm a minority of one, but I've always thought it a bit contrived...too neat by half, so to speak.

[ksen]

This is an excellent book!

Have fun enjoying it for the first time. :)

[ksen]

I'm not looking for an argument but I'm really curious what you mean by too neat and too contrived?

[xzins]

Particularly the names....they drive me up the wall.

[ksen]

Heh, I guess he liked to make his point with a hammer. No subtle foreshadowing for Bunyan. ;^)

[ReformedBeckite]

Your doing better then I am at good intentions. I would have to find my copy of Pilgrim's Progress before I could attempt to read it.

It makes me wonder if the "City of Great Procrastination" is mentioned in the book.

[xzins]

Probably not. :>)

But it always struck me as an effort to appear to be imaginative without being so at all.

I've never been able to read the book, it gets me so aggravated. I've tried, too. "Can't do it, Cap'n'."

[Lexinom]

Hard words, these in Bunyan.

[A.J.Armitage]

Some cry out against sin, even as the mother cries out against her child in her lap, when she calleth it slut and naughty girl, and then falls to hugging and kissing it.

Note that "slut" meant something different back then.

[Salvation]

Nor be a coparer, a criticizer or a complainer.

[.30Carbine]

Be doers of the word, and not hearers (or speakers) only!

Too cool how God the Holy Word and Holy Spirit moves in us as the Body of Christ Jesus, for before I saw your thread I too in His Great Grace had posted similar truths!

Do not be quick with your mouth, do not be hasty in your heart to utter anything before God. God is in heaven and you are on earth, so let your words be few.
Ecclesiastes 5:2

Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly as you teach and admonish one another with all wisdom, and as you sing psalms, hymns and spiritual songs with gratitude in your hearts to God.
Colossians 3:16

I also have loved and benefitted from Bunyan's work, though I confess I read the modern language version edited by Warren Wiersbe (;

Thanks so much for your posting!

[.30Carbine]

Let's be proclaimers of The Word! It is the Sword of the Spirit and the Truth . . . Powerful to conduct the surgery required of every heart and real food to any who has ears to hear!

[Salvation]

**

Let's be proclaimers of The Word! It is the Sword of the Spirit and the Truth . . . Powerful to conduct the surgery required of every heart and real food to any who has ears to hear!

**

Amen!

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[COBOL2Java]

I'm reminded of St. Francis of Assisi's admonition: "Preach the gospel at all times -- If necessary, use words." :-)

[Jaded]

for later

[P.O.E.]

You might also want to try "Pilgrim's Regress" by CS Lewis. An interesting take on wandering through God's plan.