Lutheran (ELCA) Ping!
Posted on 10/17/2007 8:07:13 PM PDT by lightman
CHICAGO (ELCA) -- In his final report to the Conference of Bishops of the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America (ELCA), the Rev. Lowell G. Almen, ELCA secretary, shared some reflections about the strengths of the ELCA and specific concerns for its future. Almen also commented on how he has changed his mind about the size and role of the ELCA Church Council, the church's board of directors.
Almen made the comments Oct. 6 to the Conference, an advisory body of the ELCA consisting of the 65 synod bishops, presiding bishop and secretary. The conference met here Oct. 4-9.
Almen, 66, had told the conference that his final report would include some reflections about his more than 20 years as secretary. He announced one year earlier that he would not seek another term as secretary. His terms ends Oct. 31. David D. Swartling, Seattle, was elected at the 2007 ELCA Churchwide Assembly to succeed Almen.
Expressing gratitude for the formation of the ELCA, Almen said, "I believe that we as members of the ELCA are better equipped now to face the challenges and struggles that await us in the coming years and decades -- that is, better equipped together than what would have been the case if we had remained in our separate predecessor (church) bodies."
He also expressed appreciation for the ELCA Confession of Faith in its governing documents. He noted, among other things, that the ELCA is part of the "whole Church catholic."
"That is a crucial awareness for us, I believe," he said. The ELCA must be aware of its responsibility within the international Lutheran community and the wider ecumenical community, Almen said.
ELCA seminaries should be treated as a crucial element in any strategic planning for the ELCA's future, and strategic planning for the seminaries "ought to reflect the responsibilities of that institution for the health and well-being of this church," he said. The ELCA secretary warned that the ELCA faces a danger if the seminaries produce "entrepreneurs" operating in the church rather than candidates "willing to be agents of this church" serving as ordained ministers.
Because there's a need to develop deeper synodical and churchwide relationships, ELCA governing documents should be amended to provide for one member of the Church Council from each of the 65 synods, Almen said.
Roles of churchwide advisors are not entirely clear, Almen said, adding he'd rather the ELCA have a larger voting membership on the council.
"I imagine greater engagement of council members with units by certain council members serving on program committees of a reduced size. And I envision the elimination of various advisory categories to allow extra funding for a larger number of voting members who would engage fully in smaller program committees and regular council committees," he said.
Almen mentioned other specific concerns he had about the ELCA:
+ The ELCA must determine why there has been a dramatic decline in membership in various places, especially in the past five years. He cited declining birth rates among members as a key reason.
+ Factors affecting levels of mission-support income for synods and churchwide ministries must be examined.
+ The ELCA Conference of Bishops should act in the interests of the whole church and not so much on specific local interests. "I sensed in the early days of the ELCA a deep awareness of this broader duty of the Conference of Bishops. In the years since then, there have been a few times when that awareness has not been as evident. Those examples of an occasionally narrow perspective trouble me," he said.
+ There exists "an inadequate understanding of ordination … in places within this church," he said. The power to ordain resides in the whole church, and it is not to be treated as an individual "right" but a "rite" of the ELCA, Almen said.
+ Almen expressed concern about how a bylaw that provided for "ordination in unusual circumstances" has been practiced, arguing that neither the bylaw requirements nor the related policy "are being observed conscientiously." He was especially critical of last-minute requests for exceptions after ordinations had been scheduled, saying "that the whistle needs to be sounded loudly on that game of last-minute requests and written statements that do not meet the criteria listed in the policy."
+ Almen said, if a solid foundation is provided in a new social statement on human sexuality, he hopes "that a way may be found to acknowledge particular ministry needs and the gifts of those who are now precluded under the ministry standards as currently stated."
For information contact: John Brooks, Director (773) 380-2958 or news@elca.org http://www.elca.org/news
ELCA News Blog: http://www.elca.org/news/blog
That could be a quantum shift, if adopted.
"+ The ELCA must determine why there has been a dramatic decline in membership in various places, especially in the past five years. He cited declining birth rates among members as a key reason."
Or it could be the disgust of many at the headlong race toward adopting the gay agenda and its childless hedonistic culture.
+ Almen said, if a solid foundation is provided in a new social statement on human sexuality, he hopes "that a way may be found to acknowledge particular ministry needs and the gifts of those who are now precluded under the ministry standards as currently stated."
Almen has now "come out" as a Bp. Rogness disciple of "ordination to place" or "local option", or, in plain English, "the only standard is that we have no standard."
A pity tragedy that an otherwise fine churchman would end his career by walking in the way of former PBp Herbert Chilstrom.
Despite protestations to the contrary by the revisionists, ELCA is in Lockstep and on the same road with the ECUSA, just a few blocks behind. Because "contextual" and 'critical' hermeneutics have hollowed out theological education, there is no set of core beliefs sufficient to hold the conglomeration together. If train-wreck fans want to see the cancer in progress go to http://www.alpb.org/forum/index.php/ and peruse a few threads.
Yes, alpb.org/forum seems to have been taken over by four trolls (Charles Austin, Brian Stoffregen, “Bergs”, and John Dornheim—the last no longer a Lutheran) almost completely ruining what had been a bastian of orthodoxy and a safe haven for the battle-weary.
In the ELCA's headlong rush to become socially relevant instead of Biblically relevant, they find themselves to be completely irrelevant.
What did John Dornheim become?
If the albp online forum had the same rules about trolls/disruptors as FR, and/or if others on the forum would adopt the same aggressive labeling of trolls as trolls as those of us in the pro-Serbian group of FR, the trolls would disappear.
As it is, I just skip the disruptor posts on albp forum. But there are all too many replies to the disruptors by legitimate forum participants, and those should not exist either.
The albp forum disruptor Charles Austin is a former New World Order Times (New York Times) reporter—it figures! And he is in with the Higgins Road mis-leaders, and writes quite a few articles for “The Lutheran”. So, unlike the pathetic-loser FR trolls, he is a troll with power. Yikes!!
Declining birthrates my rump. It would take about an hour to tell them why they are shrinking. But it will never be said to them by the people they will ask.
Quite a lot of comments posted on Reformation Day, including a backhanded compliment from Charles Austin
"2. Their "interpretations" seem pretty solid whether or not I think those who post there are jerks."
Looks like the ELCA troll who was posting this summer has revealed himself on ALBP! As he indicates, I (and others) never tried to get him banned. But I gave him a taste of how we deal with trolls on the pro-Serbian FR threads.
ALBP posters should know that they DO interacts with several Lutheran Freepers in other forums and in off-screen life, under our real names. But we disguise ourselves on FR by using more outrageous language than in real life.
BOTH alpb and FR get the orthodox message to ELCA Lutherans who need it, but in different ways (and to different audiences). The disruptor posts on albp distract from that message, or even from coherent arguments that people who are too busy to filter out the distractions can follow.
And, in my case, if they would read some of my FR Lutheran-Orthodox posts, they would know where I’m really coming from.
Probably a silly question, but why would any Orthodox Christian care about what is said on “ALPB”?
So, should I be reading what you folks are saying about us swarthy Orthodoxer types, in lurker mode of course?
Actually, they aren’t saying very nice things about Freepers, from what I have seen so far.
It looks like albp poster Don Hanson is sticking up for us, and is also exposing Charles Austin for exactly what he is!!!! Austin is not the only denizen of Higgins Road and liberal synodical offices who does such things, either. Our poor synod, which was once orthodox and blessed with greatness, has similar horrible goings-on. Kyrie eleison!
In past albp threads, several posters have noted the disruptive effect of at least Austin’s and Brian Stoffregen’s posts. (A “troll” is the same thing as a “disruptor”, which is my preferred term.) Disruptor posts (and non-disruptors’ necessary reactions to them) have greatly lowered the value of the albp forum for Orthodox Christians, and for others of God’s people—Lutherans included. (The “Lutheran Forum” magazine is still very worthwhile, however.)
What we, acting as Freepers, say about disruption on alpb is no different from what several thoughtful orthodox alpb posters have said already. It just seems to be hitting home more, perhaps because of the “outrageous language” and screen names.
As for my disparagement of the “New York Times”, it has nothing to do with some shallow “I’m a conservative and the NYT is liberal” argument. One has only to look at my tag-line to see the reason. The New World Order Times not only bashes Serbs and supports stealing their historic lands, but backs the whole evil “The World is Flat” globalist agenda. Some of the same NWO highhandness is exercized by ELCA mis-leaders when they, for example, forced that intolerable feminist liturgy down our throats. It is that move that is forcing me and many others out of the ELCA.
The alpb forum thread on FR goes on and on and on.
So far, not only the layman Don Hansen, but also Pastor Rob Moskowitz and the poster with the screen-name Sublime_Harbinger have stood up for us Freepers. A most hearty thanks to all of you. And may God bless you abundantly for your worthy witness.
Sublime_Harbinger says:
.....I just read the original link to the other Forum [FR], and while I’m not sure I’d want to spend alot of time over there, I do agree that there is a rampant amount of trolling and personal attacks that go on here. I’m a member of several different forums across cyberspace, and a moderator for a set as well, and some of what passes for discussion here would earn warnings and bans elsewhere. The thread, if nothing else, is a good reminder for us to watch out language, so to speak.....
So Sublime_Harbinger agrees with us that the alpb forum has become infected with disruptor posts.
As if to prove both Sublime_Harbinger’s and our contention, the entire thread has degenerated into a mud-fest of personal attacks. The good moderator Richard Johnson finally had to weigh in with a reminder to “love one another”. We’ll see if that gentle reminder cools some of the passions over there.
The revisionist posters on alpb have been doing what they accused us “freeper creepers” of doing. But have been doing it BIG TIME!!!! That is typical of “mainline” revisionists—accusing others of doing what they’re doing, a la the beginning of Romans 2!
The revisionists on alpb accuse us Freepers of being “hateful” and “unloving” for telling the truth that they do not want to face. That is reminiscent of the bashing of leading theologian Karl Donfried in “The Lutheran” by the ELCA revisonists, also for telling the truth. (How convenient that Pr. Donfried was being put up for Presiding Bishop, to oppose the revisionist Mark Hanson.) Of course, the alpb forum revisionists would NEVER equate bashing us with bashing Karl Donfried, since we are only lowlife “freeper creepers”. But they forget that we are not profesional gutter-journalists, but Lutheran lay leaders and orthodox Lutheran pastors. So the “freeper creeper” label is just, once again, a lame excuse to avoid facing the truth. “Mainline” revisionists are good at making lame excuses!!!
And ELCA revisionist mis-leaders show hateful, unloving behavior all the time. In our once-great synod, we have a fast diminishing number of faithful STS pastors. These are regularly bashed in synod assemblies and blacklisted by our revisionist “bishop” and the “bishop’s” cadre of sycophantic pastors and lay leaders. The “crimes” of the STS pastors for which they are punished include opposing the feminist liturgy and “gay” ordinations and “blessings”, and attempting to get orthodox voting members for CWA’s elected. (Of course, “Lutherans Concerned’s” lobbying efforts are NEVER opposed by our revisionist “bishop”.)
We have lost several STS pastors in our synod to retirement and other ways by which they leave the active pastoral ministry. Of the two STS pastors in the synod whom are left and whom I know, one (who is older) cannot wait to retire and become a Roman Catholic, and the other, who is under 40 and has a young family, doesn’t know what he is going to do. All this is the fruit of the hateful, unloving, bashing behavior of the revisionists. And there is NOTHING more unloving than saddling the flock of the ELCA with that intollerable feminist liturgy, and those “altered” hymns designed solely to satisfy a small cadre of mean-spirited feminists!!!!
So the revisionist posters on alpb do not have a leg to stand on when they label Lutheran FreeRepublic posters as “creeps” and “haters”. They should apologize to us at once, and more importantly apologize to the flock that God has entrusted to them for their gross mis-leadership!!!!
And if the moderators of the alpb forum wish to restore its quality, they shoud recast it as an orthodox forum only. Then readers like me who only have a limited amount of time will be able to benefit from the forum, without having to filter out the disruptor posts and the reactions that they generate.
“The revisionists on alpb accuse us Freepers of being “hateful” and “unloving” for telling the truth that they do not want to face.”
HS, as we Greeks say, these are not serious people. If you want to run with a tough crowd like Orthodox Serbs (or any Orthodox Christians for that matter), you’ve got to be ready to laugh at sissies who whine that other people are “hateful” and “unloving”. In my village even the old ladies and little children would snicker at that. Good heavens!
So, I’m having trouble getting on ALPB this weekend. Is it just me, or are they down?
The alpb site has been up again since yesterday, and the sorry thread (sorry with some exceptions, anyway, like those who say that they agree with our theology and point of view) goes on and on and on and on. Finally, the good moderator Peter Speckard (an LCMS pastor and young theologian) has come up with a moderate, fair, and sensible solution to the endless and nasty debate between Don Hansen and Charles Austin.
Here’s what the ELCA revisionist operative and former New World Order Times reporter Charles Austin is saying about FreeRepublic now:
......This thread started when someone brought in that pig-sty of commentary elsewhere on line, and - as I predicted - we all got splattered by its mud, some more than others, and some seem to enjoy rolling in it.....
Consider the source!!!!
Oh well, in a few days I will be attending a retreat led by an Orthodox abbess, in anticipation of the Nativity Fast. It’s just what is needed to wash off all the mud and garbage that the ELCA has thrown at us this past year, and begin preparing for Christ’s Nativity.
Never trust your sources. I do not envision leaving the ELCA at any time in the near future. There is much work to do there and much work to be done by the ELCA in the world.
It is unfortunate that this sorry list is still breathing.
John Dornheim
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