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To: Freedom'sWorthIt; XeniaSt; Brad's Gramma; FourtySeven; NYer; Quix; Dr. Eckleburg; topcat54; ...
It's very interesting to read on this thread the viewpoint of a Jewish Rabbi who is now a "completed" Jew = a Christian - who obviously would not agree that the promises and prophetic Words spoken by God's prophets have already beenfulfilled or are being fulfilled in the church of Jesus Christ where all we who believe in Jesus Christ and who are In Christ are ONE in Christ, there is no distinction between Jew and Christian, that dividing wall has been torn down.

The leaning I have in the Spirit is that God keeps all of His promises – every, single, one. Concerning the subject you raised, those promises include this:

But this [shall be] the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

Thus saith the LORD, which giveth the sun for a light by day, [and] the ordinances of the moon and of the stars for a light by night, which divideth the sea when the waves thereof roar; The LORD of hosts [is] his name: If those ordinances depart from before me, saith the LORD, [then] the seed of Israel also shall cease from being a nation before me for ever.

Thus saith the LORD; If heaven above can be measured, and the foundations of the earth searched out beneath, I will also cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, saith the LORD. - Jer 31:33-37

The structure of “all that there is” whether spiritual or physical, cosmos or quantum - are both unknown and unknowable. The sun, moon and stars still give light. Therefore, the above promises are still in effect - the seed of Israel has not been cast off.

Moreover, Israel’s situation vis-à-vis God was spoken in the Song of Moses (Deuteronomy 32) – which is a history of the future of Israel and includes a prophesy of God’s salvation extended to the Gentiles and the cause of it. The Song of Moses will be sung in heaven along with the Song of the Lamb.

They provoked him to jealousy with strange [gods], with abominations provoked they him to anger. They sacrificed unto devils, not to God; to gods whom they knew not, to new [gods that] came newly up, whom your fathers feared not. Of the Rock [that] begat thee thou art unmindful, and hast forgotten God that formed thee.

And when the LORD saw [it], he abhorred [them], because of the provoking of his sons, and of his daughters. And he said, I will hide my face from them, I will see what their end [shall be]: for they [are] a very froward generation, children in whom [is] no faith.

They have moved me to jealousy with [that which is] not God; they have provoked me to anger with their vanities: and I will move them to jealousy with [those which are] not a people; I will provoke them to anger with a foolish nation. For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains. - Deuteronomy 32:16-22

But I say, Did not Israel know? First Moses saith, I will provoke you to jealousy by [them that are] no people, [and] by a foolish nation I will anger you. - Romans 10:19

I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but [rather] through their fall salvation [is come] unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy. - Romans 11:11

And they sing the song of Moses the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb, saying, Great and marvellous [are] thy works, Lord God Almighty; just and true [are] thy ways, thou King of saints. – Revelation 15:3

As the above indicates, prophesy is more than a little important. All the signs were there but they could not see.

We are in the same boat in reference to prophesy. It requires spiritual discernment. Faith and reason are complimentary, but reason cannot substitute for faith.

Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee. Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in. Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: For if God spared not the natural branches, [take heed] lest he also spare not thee.

Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in [his] goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off. And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again. For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural [branches], be graffed into their own olive tree?

For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: For this [is] my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. As concerning the gospel, [they are] enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, [they are] beloved for the fathers' sakes. – Romans 11:18-28

In sum, God does not forget Israel or His promises to Israel. So whatever our understanding of End Times Prophesies, we ought never boast against the branches, after all, Israel is honored in the new heaven and new earth as we can see in the description of the New Jerusalem:

And had a wall great and high, [and] had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are [the names] of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel: On the east three gates; on the north three gates; on the south three gates; and on the west three gates. And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb. – Revelation 21:12-14

Maranatha, Jesus!!!

21 posted on 11/01/2007 9:47:48 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: Alamo-Girl

thank you for your summaries. Yes, Romans 11 is clear (to me at least) that one day “all Israel will be saved”. And that God’s calling cannot be revoked.

You put it all very well. Amen!

25 posted on 11/02/2007 7:51:38 PM PDT by Freedom'sWorthIt
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