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Mary and the Problem of Christian Unity
Coming Home Network ^ | Kenneth J. Howell, Ph. D.

Posted on 04/09/2008 12:36:13 PM PDT by annalex

Mary and the Problem of Christian Unity

By Kenneth J. Howell, Ph. D.

We are living in a remarkable age. As we approach the third millennium of Christianity in the year 2,000, we are watching a world in extremes. Amid the rapid onslaught of secularization and irreligion, we find hordes of people seeking solace in religion.

Amid the ravages of war and violence, we find the comfort and love of those who care for the poor and disadvantaged. Amid the lightning pace of modern life, we find souls searching for deeper meaning by retreating to monasteries and ashrams for solitude.

Two of the most powerful inspirations in late twentieth century Christianity are the drive toward greater unity among Christians of widely differing backgrounds (ecumenism) and the rapid growth of Marian devotion all around the world. This century has seen unprecedented efforts to bring together Christians who have been separated by misunderstanding and prejudice. And just when the ecumenical movement on a formal level seemed moribund, a new surge of grassroots ecumenism is finding ways of bringing together Catholic, Orthodox and Protestant Christians. Whatever the outcome of these efforts, the air of this last decade of the second millennium is filled with the scent of Christian unity. It seems that Christians are grasping every opportunity to reconcile their doctrinal differences and to find the sweet savor of "brothers dwelling together in unity" (Ps 133: 1).

If this is an age of ecumenism, it is equally a Marian era because no century since the birth of Christ has witnessed such an outpouring of devotion to the mother of Jesus. As many observers note, reported apparitions and locutions have multiplied, leading numerous Christians to an unprecedented devotion to the humble handmaiden of the Lord who was privileged to bring the world its Redeemer. In tandem with these grassroots movements, there is a monumental effort within the Catholic Church for the Pope to define as dogma Marian doctrines that have long been present in the Church (Mediatrix, Coredemptrix, Advocate). Whether or not the Supreme Pontiff of the Catholic Church decides to act, there is unlikely to be any diminishing of devotion to the mother of Jesus.

On the other hand, many non-Catholic Christians are mystified by such devotion to Mary. Some feel strangely drawn to honor her, but are afraid of falling into excessive focus on Mary to the exclusion of Jesus. To others, Marian devotion borders on the blasphemous. To still others, Catholics are idolaters. It is not an overstatement to say that no expression of historic Christianity has ever placed Mary in such a high position of honor as has the western Catholic tradition. And even though the Eastern Orthodox Churches have long honored Mary as the Mother of God, they do not have fully developed mariologies as the Western Church has.

The juxtaposition of ecumenical and Marian movements seems odd at best. On the surface, it appears that Mary would be the last subject chosen in an ecumenical dialogue. One might think that all the areas on which common agreement might be achieved should be addressed first, and then deal with the thorny question of Marian doctrine. Better to leave Mary until last. However, I am now convinced that questions about Mary must be addressed up front if any true ecumenism is ever to be achieved.

On a purely human level, no genuine friendship can ignore beliefs which are central to one party while those same beliefs are at best questionable to the other. Further, it is not completely honest for Catholics to pretend that Marian doctrines and devotions are not important and central to our lives. We ought to state openly that the Catholic faith does not allow the Church to ever change its defined dogmas about Mary. On the other hand, we must admit that not everything that goes on under the term Marian devotion is necessary or beneficial for the Church.

What can talk about Mary do to promote the cause of ecumenism? The answer depends on what we mean by ecumenism. One definition, and the one most common, sees ecumenism as a process of negotiation between different churches whereby one church gives up some aspect of its faith and the other partner relinquishes its claim to some of its distinctives. This process proceeds through a number of steps until a lowest common denominator is reached. The result is a church or some other official body which has a reduced form of faith and practice so that it might accommodate each respective member. This has largely been the pattern of ecumenism in the United States and the Western world for the better part of this century. In my judgment, such attempts have been a monumental failure. Mary cannot help with this type of ecumenism. The other definition of ecumenism is  not founded on the concept of negotiation, but on seeking together the truth of God’s revelation. It begins with confessing that we don’t apprehend God’s truth completely, and that we must always seek to have the mind of Christ. In this conception, unity of heart and mind does not come from negotiated agreements, but from all parties, recognizing and embracing the objective truth of God.

It is a commonplace that married couples do not achieve success by each giving fifty percent to their marriage, but by each giving one hundred percent of themselves. In the same way, Christian unity comes from full commitment to searching for truth in a spirit of humility. Ecumenism begins with recognizing that unity already exists in God, that Christ is the center of unity, and that the Holy Spirit is the operative agent in bringing Christians together. Mary has everything to do with this kind of ecumenism.

Mary: The Sign of Unity ?
How can Mary help in promoting Christian unity? Many may feel the weight of disunity among Christians and long for a greater oneness in Christ, but can Mary really give us that greater oneness? Mary has been a source of division between Catholics and Protestants for a long time. What good will focusing on Mary bring? How can Christians be one when the very Marian devotions so precious to Catholics are viewed as idolatrous by Protestants? To human eyes, it seems that almost any other Christian doctrine would be better suited to bring unity than doctrines of Mary. And if we think of Mary just as a set of doctrines, that would be true. But Mary is more than a set of doctrines. Mary is a person. She lived her life on this earth as the mother of our Lord with her own character, mind, and idiosyncrasies. These things are true regardless of what we believe about her. Mary is what she is apart from our beliefs.

There is one unmistakable fact that we must remember about the real Mary—the Son of God lived in her womb for nine months. This is how Mary can be an instrument of unity. She united the Logos, the second person of the Trinity, with His human nature in her own body. Mary united more than any human being has ever united. She united God and man in the small confines of her own womb. Ponder this amazing reality. In Mary’s womb, heaven and earth were joined, not as two separate realities, but perfectly united in the one person of the Son of God. No wonder it says that "Mary treasured all these things and pondered them in her heart" (Lk 2:19). It is a reality beyond words.

Mary was the instrument of unity for the body of Jesus Christ and this is why Mary has long been thought of as mother of the church. The church is the body of Christ and Mary was the mother of Christ’s body, both physically and mystically. It is clear from Scripture that Jesus Christ is the key to unity among Christians, but the one Savior Jesus Christ would not be what he is—the perfect God-man—without Mary’s being the means of uniting His divine and human natures in one person.

Mary’s example of obedience and discipleship also forms the foundation of unity. Mary gave herself unreservedly to Jesus her Son. Every Christian wants to be an obedient disciple of our Lord and needs examples of obedience to do so. Mary was filled with grace, and this allowed her to listen to the commands of her God without delay. Mary was on earth what every Christian will become in heaven, filled with grace. Obedience means a readiness to say YES to God, a spirit of humility that says "Let it be" (fiat). Unity cannot be achieved through negotiation. It must come through obedience to the apostolic teaching given by Jesus to Paul and the other apostles. Without a willing spirit, we can never achieve God’s desire for unity. Mary’s life of obedience and discipleship calls us to unity with God through obedience.

The unity we seek is not human but divine. Its source is the divine life of Christ the Redeemer. It is that unity for which He prayed when He said, "Father, that they might be one." This kind of unity doesn’t come from each group of Christians giving up some belief or practice for the sake of unity; it comes from each individual or group submitting to the authority of Christ and from the work of the Holy Spirit bringing oneness where it is humanly impossible. Like salvation itself, Christian unity is not within the grasp of human power. All we can do is open ourselves to the ministry of the Spirit to produce the unity that is impossible through negotiation.

It is because Mary has been such a stumbling block for Christians that a fuller embracing of her person and role will achieve a greater unity than we might expect. If we view Mary apart from Jesus, then Mary cannot help us. Yet she was never meant to be seen apart from her Son. Just as the Magi found Jesus "with his mother" (Mt 2:11), so we find Mary involved with her divine Son, cooperating in His work and plan.

We cannot solve the problem of how to be one in Christ. Not by negotiation, not by one or the other side caving in. But God can solve our problems. God specializes in the impossible, just as He once said to Mary (Lk 1:37). If the Holy Spirit can form within the womb of the Virgin Mary a new entity—the unique Godman—then He surely can bring together Christians divided by history, suspicion and misinformation. Perhaps it’s time for us to stop trying to be unified and let God do what we have failed to do. No one can see precisely how this will happen, but we know it won’t happen without embracing the fullness of salvation in Christ himself.

Mary and the Unity of the Trinity
The unity we seek does not result from negotiated agreements. Our Christian unity must be founded on truth. It must be unity of heart and mind, a permanent oneness that is not shaken by the changing tides of custom and culture. The New Testament concept of unity is nothing less than union with the Holy Trinity. Jesus our Lord prayed that the oneness of His disciples would resemble and flow from the oneness experienced by the Father, Son and Holy Spirit: "That they all may be one, Father, as you are in me and I in you that they may also be one in us" (Jn 17:21). Jesus Christ does not want our unity to be like his and the Father’s. He wants our unity to be the same as He and the Father have. 

Mary is both a sign and an instrument of the unity coming from the Holy Trinity because she bears a unique relation to each member. Let’s see how Mary is related to the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. First, however, a word of caution. In A.D. 431 the ancient Christian Church defined Mary as the Mother of God because the Church wanted to protect the full divinity and humanity of Jesus Christ. This title, Mother of God (or better Godbearer), asserted that the child in Mary’s womb was nothing less than fully God and fully man. But the title Mother of God never has been nor should be interpreted to mean that Mary is the mother of the Trinity. Mary bears a distinct relation to each member of the Trinity, but she is not the mother of the Father, nor of the Holy Spirit.

Mary is the daughter of the Father.
When Mary proclaims herself the handmaiden of the Lord (Lk 1:38,48), she is declaring her filial obedience to the will of God. The love she has for the heavenly Father shows itself in her desire to be His vessel of bringing salvation to the world. What better sign of unity than this act of submission to the will of God? If we only follow Mary’s lead, we will find ourselves united in heart as her heart was united with the heavenly Father’s heart.

Mary did not negotiate with God, bargain with Him nor seek a compromise. She acknowledged her dependence on His grace and sought to perform His bidding. The will of the Father is unity for us who profess His Son. We will have unity only when we have submitted ourselves to the Father as Mary did.

Yet Mary is more than a sign. She is an instrument of unity. How is this true? Without her obedience the Savior would not have been born. Some Christians think that if Mary had refused Gabriel’s invitation to bear the Savior, God would have found another woman. There is not the slightest evidence in the New Testament for this view. Mary freely gave herself to God’s will of giving the world its Savior. By her instrumentality Mary united the Father to the world through His Son. In a profound sense, Mary united us to the Father through the Son. And that is how we will find a greater degree of unity today. By seeking to imitate her obedience and by seeking submission to the same Father through the Son she bore.

Mary is the Spouse of the Holy Spirit.
Gabriel proclaimed that the Holy Spirit would come over her and the power of the Most High would overshadow her (Lk 1:35). This is the language of marital love (see Ruth 3:9; Zeph 3:17). Mary was united with the third person of the Trinity in order to give flesh to the second person. As the spouse of the Holy Spirit, she gave her body to the service of God so that she might receive the fullness of God. And so Mary is a sign of how we too must seek to be filled with the Holy Spirit to do the will of God (cf Eph 5:18). It is the Holy Spirit who brings Jesus Christ today just as He brought the divine Christ to the womb of Mary (cf. Jn 14:17,18). When we are filled with the Spirit as Mary was, we are united to Jesus and we become more united with one another. Mary’s union with the Holy Spirit brought us the Son who poured out the Spirit that we might be united with both Son and Spirit. Her union brings about our union.

Mary is the mother of the Son.
Through her, Christ’s divine and human natures were united into the one person that would save us from our sins. As Jesus’ mother, Mary signals that our unity will only be in and through her Son. When Paul says that Jesus was "born of a woman ... that we might receive the adoption" (Gal 4:4,5), the apostle implies that true unity comes only from being members of the same family—the same family in which Jesus is the firstborn Son.

We cannot be members of many different families that have a tolerance for one another’s beliefs and worship. No doubt tolerance for cultural and historical differences is essential, but that is still not the New Testament ideal of unity. Unity means being in the same family as Jesus ("one Lord"), having the same content of belief ("one faith"), living in the same Church body ("one baptism"). Only then can we be sure that we have the same "God and Father of all, who is over all, through all and in all." See Ephesians 4:4-6.

Mary: God’s Woman of the Hour
Now is the time for unity among Christians. As we approach the beginning of the third millennium since Christ’s birth, we see an almost unprecedented call to unity. Christian leaders the world over have caught a glimpse of Christ’s will that "they may be one, Father, as you are in me and I in you" (Jn 17:21). The desire for unity is laudable and ought to be pursued with vigor. Yet the only unity worth pursuing, the only unity that will last is the unity that already exists in the Holy Trinity. This kind of unity is not something we achieve. It is something given to us as a gift. This unity is infused in our souls and expressed by oneness of mind and heart (doctrine and love).

Truth without love is barren and sterile. Unity without truth is empty and fruitless. Jesus was a kind and compassionate man who proclaimed the truth. The Lord who wept over Jerusalem’s obstinacy (see Mt 23:37-39), and who was moved with compassion over the "sheep without a shepherd," (Mk 6:34) is the same Lord who said that the truth of His words would not pass away (Lk 21:33). If Jesus is our Lord, then we must follow with equal vigor His truth and love.

Insistence on truth at the expense of unity will not do, nor will embracing unity at the expense of truth. Truth and unity are equally ultimate. Yet even now, we must realize the impossibility of reconciling truth and unity with human schemes and ingenuity. The only way to have unity is by having unity in Truth. The truth that brings unity is Jesus Himself who is "the way, the truth, and the life" (Jn 14:6). The truth Jesus gives is the complete teaching of His will as expressed in and through the Church of the apostles.

The Church is Jesus’ idea and institution; it is part of the will of Jesus. And it is Christ’s Church that wrote and gave us the Holy Scriptures and the truths of faith passed down from generation to generation. Obedience to Jesus means obedience to Jesus’ Church. It is no accident that Christians have spoken of the Church as our mother for centuries. Classic Christianity spoke this way: the one who wants God as a Father must have the Church as a mother. Why is it necessary? Because Jesus is nurturing our faith through our mother, the Church. And that is why Mary is so important.

Jesus is our model but we must remember that even our Lord learned some of His commitment to truth and compassion from His mother. All we have to assume is that Mary lived her own words to see that this is true. She loved truth enough to consent to Gabriel’s invitation to bear the Son of God (Lk 1:38). She was filled with compassion enough to see God’s "mercy from generation to generation" (Lk 1:50). Mary was a woman of truth and love. Her commitment to God’s truth and love lead her to the unity of the Son of God. Her submissive heart that willingly embraced God’s truth and her devoted love for God brought about the unity of Christ’s human and divine natures into the perfect unity of His one divine person.

So Mary’s commitment to truth and unity is both our model and the means of our unity. She modeled our path to unity by her embrace of the divine Son within her womb. We must embrace Him too. Mary is also the means of our having unity because without her act of submission to God we would not have the one Savior who can unify us.

It is time to lay down our defensive postures, to lay aside our personal and political agendas, to give up our dearest visions for the Church and to embrace the complete will of Christ. I believe that if we could simply be like Mary on that day when Gabriel came to her, we could then say with her, "Let it be done to us according to your word" (Lk 1:38). Perhaps, she could say with us:

Lord, we are your servants.
Heal our divisions and
Let Your Son reign as Lord within.
Let Your Word dwell within us
And make us one.

 

Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen.

This article is from Ken’s new book, Mary of Nazareth: Sign and Instrument of Christian Unity. [Queenship Publishing]

 


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61 posted on 04/09/2008 6:56:01 PM PDT by narses (...the spirit of Trent is abroad once more.)
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To: OpusatFR

Thanks very much for the info and the link...

I suppose I can only say, that I am never truly surprised at the different interpretations that come from different folks, regarding the Scriptures...


62 posted on 04/09/2008 6:58:29 PM PDT by andysandmikesmom
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To: OpusatFR

Thanks for the second link as well....I guess I will have to check this stuff out, and see what I think, and make my own decisions about this stuff...


63 posted on 04/09/2008 7:00:15 PM PDT by andysandmikesmom
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To: andysandmikesmom

Good. Glad to be of help.

Good night.


64 posted on 04/09/2008 7:02:02 PM PDT by OpusatFR
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To: OpusatFR

Have a fine evening..good night...


65 posted on 04/09/2008 7:14:37 PM PDT by andysandmikesmom
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To: OLD REGGIE; Alex Murphy; alpha-8-25-02; blue-duncan; Dr. Eckleburg; ears_to_hear; Forest Keeper; ...

Wellllllllll, now, OLD REGGIE, you should know better.

1. In the first place, the RC edifice Rubber Bible doesn’t put it that way.

2. In the 2nd place, the RC rubber dictionary doesn’t have a word for “sons.” So, they HAD, JUST HAD TO BE . . . maybe cousins. Or perhaps uncles. Or maybe cousins twice removed from uncles thrice removed. Or maybe they were figments of early Protty’s imaginations already trying to sabotage Mary’s early rise as Magnificent Miraculous Earth-Mother-Goddess Mary. That’s it. Clearly a copyist error. Or the early scribe for God didn’t have the proper rubber dictionary so only THOUGHT Christ said sons.

3. Or maybe they were adopted sons—you know troubled ruffians who happened along that Magnificent Mary took to her Earth-Mother lap.

4. I mean, we can’t have Christ rushing off declaring things without them being vetted by the 400 years later RC magicsterical, now can we! What would the world come to! Think of all that political power mongering that would be at risk! So Christ could not possibly have meant SONS! The magicsterical would have never allowed it—even 400 years before their existence . . . their being omnipresent, timeless and all.

/s


66 posted on 04/09/2008 7:18:50 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: OpusatFR; Alex Murphy; alpha-8-25-02; blue-duncan; Dr. Eckleburg; ears_to_hear; Forest Keeper; ...
It is absolutely shocking that you think the Revelation of St. John Divine is a treatise on space-demon aliens in motherships.

SHOW ME
Where I said
THAT
I believed
or THOUGHT
AT ALL
that
John's
REVELATION
WAS/IS
"a treatise on space-demon aliens in motherships."

SHOW ME!

OR REPENT AND RETRACT--as y'all are so prone to say-->such an outrageous example of bearing false witness.

It's clear to me that the RC perceptual problem distorting and rubberizing Scripture, definitions, history, logic and math thoroughly all out of whack and dependability is alive and well and functioning quite as usual to render words 100% mangled with little even remote connectedness to what I wrote and meant.

Thankfully, it's no great shock beyond the brazen unbelievable audacity of it--we Prottys have learned to expect such outrageousness.

It is shocking that you interpret Ezekiel I as a space vehicle when Ezekiel spends an entire chapter describing truth.

SHOW ME where I said that was my solid, convinced, interpretation--vs an interpretation common in the literature--SHOW ME! SHOW ME.

67 posted on 04/09/2008 7:31:28 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Revolting cat!
Well,let’s just say that calling Roman Catholics ‘pagans’ ‘heretics’ and ‘idol worshippers’ among other nice things can be interpreted as an expression of anger. = = = Ahhhhhhhhhh, so personal attacks of mind reading are not sufficient outrages by the RC reps now? They have to add personal attacks of personal EMOTION READING, TOO??? One would think they'd practice a LOT more until they learned how before going public with such! LOL. Thankfully, I rarely get angry about much of anything. And writing on these threads is a lot more fun recreation than even ministry, though ministry is up there and sometimes takes priority. I don't recall the last time I broke out in a sweat writing on FR about anything to anyone. I think the Rubber dictionary is really giving the RC edifice very troubling fits again. It must be very difficult to even stay remotely in touch with the reality most folks are familiar with when even one's rubber dictionary is stretched all the way from Pluto.
68 posted on 04/09/2008 7:36:44 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: andysandmikesmom; OpusatFR

Then I guess you’ll need to ask OpusatFR.

This particular batch seems to be fantasies from that RC rep’s vivid imagination.


69 posted on 04/09/2008 7:38:21 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Quix; OpusatFR

OpusatFR, already provided me with two links, so that I can see where people who believe these types of things are coming from...


70 posted on 04/09/2008 7:40:39 PM PDT by andysandmikesmom
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To: OpusatFR; Alex Murphy; alpha-8-25-02; blue-duncan; Dr. Eckleburg; ears_to_hear; Forest Keeper; ...

Have you even been to

HTTP://WWW.ANCIENTOFDAYS.NET

????

I don’t know that they give reading lessons but there is a lot of stuff there on DVD that one can watch and listen to.

I wouldn’t guarantee that RC reps would be able to keep it all straight given the magicsterical’s centuries long mangling of logic circuits and all . . . but one could try repeatedly and maybe after a number of years begin to get it somewhat right . . . for an RC, at least.


71 posted on 04/09/2008 7:42:01 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: andysandmikesmom

Good.

I noticed.

Guy Malone is the real deal. I talked with him at length over 3 days a year ago. He loves Jesus; is Biblical, balanced, kind, generous, balanced and well researched as well experienced.

And his experts on his DVDs are top flight.


72 posted on 04/09/2008 7:47:38 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Petronski
No need to anyway, the Greys take care of that.

LOL.

73 posted on 04/09/2008 7:49:58 PM PDT by Trailerpark Badass
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To: Quix

And when I get around to it, I will check his website and make my own decisions regarding what he believes to be true...


74 posted on 04/09/2008 7:51:47 PM PDT by andysandmikesmom
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To: andysandmikesmom

I wouldn’t want it any other way.

—I’m a Protty!—

It’s the RC’s that demand soma-laced thought-conformity with the political power-mongers in the magicsterical . . . except on the odd moments when they lapse and don’t.


75 posted on 04/09/2008 7:54:08 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Quix

And regarding whether one is a Protty or an RC as you call them, I will also make my own decisions about them and their behaviors, based on what I see and read on the FR threads, and my own experiences in real life...

One mans truth that he comes to, by whatever means, may be what another man considers to be a falsehood...


76 posted on 04/09/2008 8:02:12 PM PDT by andysandmikesmom
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To: RobRoy; Quix
“”Mary was not chosen by God because she was blessed, she was blessed because she was chosen by God and Mary was the incubator””

You're putting the cart in front of the horse.

Luke 1;28 says Mary was Blessed

“”And the angel being come in, said unto her: Hail, full of grace, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women.””

Lets bring in the anti Catholic Quix and ask if he thinks Mary was not Blessed and tell us scriptures lie?

Quix- do you believe Mary was Blessed?

Quix- Do you think Mary was the incubator and not Blessed

Rob Roy- Do you think our Lord has Blessed you and not Mary?

Rob Roy-Do you think your mother was an incubator so she could produce a know it all son like you that does not square what all of the early Christians who gave up their lives believed?

Why do you think your scripture interpretations are above over 2000 years of all of the Saints?

Are you some kind of prophet who did nothing that we are supposed to follow? I see you as another Jim Jones self loving person who thinks God is guiding him

What have you done to make me believe you? Nothing!

You're posts pretty much prove this!

77 posted on 04/09/2008 8:07:58 PM PDT by stfassisi ("Above all gifts that Christ gives his beloved is that of overcoming self"St Francis Assisi)
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To: Quix
Anger is anger, and if you label the Holy Father an "Anti-Christ", you are expressing anger, or contempt or resentment, no two ways about it (you or someone else, nothing personal here.) I don't come with comments to these threads much, first because I don't know anything about theology, and if I did, I am my own priest, aren't I, and no one can question me, can they, Martin Luther, king of the Protties (as you call them)? Second, because I am secure in my faith and don't have to defend it or promote it.

But I can observe and what I am observing is anger and resentments of the Protestants at the Catholics, that oftentimes reveal more about the insecurities of these various sect members than they do about the Catholic faith and traditions. The Catholic Church does not need me to defend it and will outlive all the petty attacks as it has outlived all the Jim Jones' and Jim Bakkers, who, you will say, are not representative, but to me they and the lovely Crouch couple are. That's all.

78 posted on 04/09/2008 8:24:43 PM PDT by Revolting cat! ("I am like...Dude......do you really....like want the Sex?")
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To: stfassisi; RobRoy

Scripture calls Mary blessed—of God.

I see no reason to disbelieve Scripture, ever.

I believe Mary was blessed of God . . . as were all Believers who walked by faith with God—OT and NT.

I do not believe all the skyscrapers full of junk that the RC edifice loads onto the sliver of a balsam wood toothpick of a Scriptural foundation . . . the simple sentence that Mary was Blessed.

Reading tons of hogwash into that verse doesn’t destroy the simple accuracy and beauty of that verse.


79 posted on 04/09/2008 8:28:27 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Revolting cat!

Sounds like train-loads of hogwash, to me.

BTW, I haven’t called the chief political power broker at the Vatican an Anti-Christ.

All kinds of political and RELIGIOUS positions could end up with The Anti-Christ filling them . . . I don’t know if that one will be one such, or not.

It is interesting that the RC . . . who was it . . . Malachi Martin? saw one more Pope after this one—and that THAT Pope would be evil??? But that was an RC seer. He supposedly did get a long string of things right about a long string of Popes.

But it’s certainly not Scripture saying so . . . so I just watch, collect puzzle pieces and wait and see how God unfolds it all.

The current Pope seems like a pretty decent fellow until he gets off on all the Mary nonsense.


80 posted on 04/09/2008 8:32:08 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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