Mary, Unwed Mother of Jesus, Did Not Abort the Baby

Bible ^ | 1 AD | Bible

[xzins]

Mary, unwed mother, did not abort the baby Jesus.

She did the right thing.

Joseph had his concerns, but he came around when God spoke to his heart about what he really believed.

[Corin Stormhands]

You know xzins, you really don’t want to play this card.

[xzins]

Sometimes you feel compelled to stand up for what’s right.

LIFE is right.

[SERKIT]

But did Stanley-Ann and her bigamist husband travel to a foreign land (maybe for a census), have ‘lil Barry in a humble crib, then come back to Hawaii to celebrate the burf?

[rwilson99]

I’m not sure this belongs in breaking news.

:)

[tsmith130]

I know FR has been slow lately, but this Breaking?!

[pollywog]

You know xzins, you really don’t want to play this card.

AGREED!!! I think this thread needs to die and DIE NOW!!!!

[gondramB]

Yeah... I know I personally don’t feel comfy with this line of approach...

[xzins]

It would have been wrong to abort Obama.

[Owl_Eagle]

There's a lot of ways to handle this without going down this road, xzins.

[Moomah]

Your comparison is offensive. It’s not like Joseph impregnated Mary.

[xzins]

The thread does not say that Joseph impregnated Mary.

It says the biblical truth that Joseph had concerns.

All that would be required for a mother to abort a pregancy would be for her to be pregnant. Mary was pregnant.

She chose to love the child.

[SERKIT]

It would have been wrong to abort Obama.

I would not want to see anyone aborted. I am questioning where he was really born, and if the expectant couple traveled just prior to his miraculous burf.

[xzins]

Some think he was not born in Hawaii.

Obama has not provided paperwork to prove otherwise.

[Religion Moderator]

This thread is in the Religion Forum.

If you do not wish to see RF posts, do NOT use the "everything" option on the browse. Instead, browse by "News/Activism." When you log back in, the browse will reset to "everything" - so be sure to set it back to "News/Activism."

[xzins]

How did this get to the religion forum???

I thought it got sent to freeper purgatory. :>)

[Religion Moderator]

It was moved here by moderator decision as the subject matter will no doubt take a theological turn.

[xzins]

Actually, I was hoping it would take a political turn due to religious connections.

[onedoug]

Because she was a good Jew.

[xzins]

A solid believer

[Ultra Sonic 007]

Mary was not unwed. She was married to Joseph.

Now, she was a virgin, yes, but not unwed.

[xzins]

She was unwed at the time of the conception, and she was unwed when Joseph found out about the pregnancy.

Therefore, she was ‘unwed mother of Jesus.’

[elcid1970]

Mary was certainly not an `unwed mother’. She was found with child by her prospective husband Joseph, who was reassured by G-d in a dream not to fear taking Mary as his wife.

When Mary gave birth to Jesus our Redeemer, she was a wife and now a mother.

Oh, what’s next, that old Jesse Jackson chestnut about Mary and Joseph being a `homeless couple’ while they were in Bethlehem?

[Walkingfeather]

oh please; dont make idiotic comments like this.

[xzins]

Mary and Joseph had not yet been wed. That’s simply a biblical fact.

Joseph was considering putting her away which was his option.

[xzins]

What is idiotic about it???

[Walkingfeather]

The angel Gabriel went to mary and told her she would be carrying the Son of God, is it within the scope of reason she would say...” hmmmm I might abort this child” ?

Come on you make us look like idiots when you make such a statement and tie it to a political event.

Jesus would say... “ Bless your child and sin no more.” end of story.

[IreneE]

Uh, most people don’t know that under Jewish law, Joseph and Mary were allowed conjugal visits during their engagement.

This is why there was no community uproar over Mary’s pregnancy.

The only uproar was with Joseph himself, who knew he had not slept with Mary.
Thus, God had to tell him what was up.

In a strict sense, Mary was not “unwed”. Her pregnancy was not a sin. God never even “gives the appearance of evil” when He works.

Again, under Jewish law, Joseph and Mary were not living together until they officially had the ceremony, but were allowed conjugal visits as they were betrothed.

Otherwise, the Old Testament laws would have condemned her for fornication or adultery and she would have been stoned.

This is also why Joseph was contemplating quietly “putting her away” or divorcing her — he knew he had not slept with her until the Lord made clear to him what happened.

[elcid1970]

When Mary gave birth to Jesus, she was a married woman.

In modern times, when a `shotgun wedding’ takes place, is the woman an `unwed mother’ when her child is later born within wedlock?

Likewise, Mary and Joseph did not conceive out of wedlock together. Mary conceived by the Holy Spirit.

This `Mary the Unwed Mother’ business is yet another attempt by the modern world to deny the Blessed Virgin her rightful place as the Mother of Our Lord.

[xzins]

The point is that an abortion did NOT happen, even though the man she was engaged to was pretty distraught.

But, if it seems an idiotic point to you, then go with your gut.

[xzins]

See here.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2072570/posts?page=116#116

Show me in the bible where it says conjugal visits were allowed during betrothal.

[xzins]

See here:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2072570/posts?page=116#116

Actually, I’d think those wanting to uphold the Virgin would apply the same logic that they do when they say that Joseph did not have sex with Mary after the birth of Jesus.

Would you be bothered by God having taken a married woman? Sexual relations was part of what being married meant. In the same way, the Catholic Church will consider annulling marriages that are not consummated.

Mind you, I am no scholar on the Catholic Church. You might want to ask someone like NYer or Salvation or Wagglebee

[elcid1970]

You’re not a Jesuit, are you?

[xzins]

Nope. Not even Jesuit trained.

(But a Jesuit was present at my ordination...but he was a renegade. :>)

[Diego1618]

Show me in the bible where it says conjugal visits were allowed during betrothal.

It's not there.....but it also does not condemn it. Look under..............

Promiscuity and pre marital sex

[Salvation]

Bump.

[DaGman]

The only problem with this is that Mary was married to Joseph. Not an insignificant difference between the two.

Please do not deify a political candidate.

[Salvation]

When the baby was conceived through the Holy Spirit, darn right, that baby was not going to be aborted! Mary knew something was going on.

The Prayer of the Virgin Mary
The Magnificat - The Canticle of Mary

Annunciation Fra Angelico - fresco from San Marco, Florence (detail)

 

About the Magnificat

The Magnificat [Latin: magnifies], also called the Canticle of Mary, is recorded in the Gospel of Luke (1:46-55). It is the Virgin Mary's joyous prayer in response to her cousin Elizabeth's greeting (Luke 1: 41-45). This great hymn forms part of the Church's prayer in the Divine Office (Liturgy of the Hours). When it is recited as part of the Divine Office, it is followed by the Gloria Patri ("Glory be"). The traditional sung Magnificat is Latin plainchant. One of the hymn's most glorious musical renditions is the version of the Magnificat by J.S. Bach.

The Catechism of the Catholic Church describes the Magnificat as "the song both of the Mother of God and of the Church" [CCC 2619], and explains this prayer's significance:

Mary's prayer is revealed to us at the dawning of the fullness of time. Before the Incarnation of the Son of God, and before the outpouring of the Holy Spirit, her prayer cooperates in a unique way with the Father's plan of loving kindness: at the Annunciation, for Christ's conception; at Pentecost, for the formation of the Church, His Body. In the faith of His humble handmaid, the Gift of God found the acceptance He had awaited from the beginning of time. She whom the Almighty made "full of grace" responds by offering her whole being: "Behold I am the handmaid of the Lord; let it be [done] to me according to Thy word". "Fiat": this is Christian prayer: to be wholly Gods' because He is wholly ours. [CCC 2617]

The Magnificat appears below both in English and in Latin.

My soul magnifies the Lord,
And my spirit rejoices in God my Savior.
For He has regarded the low estate of His handmaiden,
For behold, henceforth all generations shall call me blessed.
For He who is mighty has done great things for me, and holy is His name. And His mercy is on those who fear Him from generation to generation.
He has shown strength with His arm:
He has scattered the proud in the imagination of their hearts.
He has put down the mighty from their thrones,
and exalted those of low degree.
He has filled the hungry with good things;
and the rich He has sent empty away.
He has helped His servant Israel, in remembrance of His mercy;
As He spoke to our fathers, to Abraham and to His posterity forever.

Glory be to the Father and to the Son and to the Holy Spirit.
As it was in the beginning, is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen

Scripture text: Revised Standard Version - Catholic Edition

---

Magníficat ánima mea Dóminum,
et exsultávit spíritus meus
in Deo salvatóre meo,
quia respéxit humilitátem
ancíllæ suæ.

Ecce enim ex hoc beátam
me dicent omnes generatiónes,
quia fecit mihi magna,
qui potens est,
et sanctum nomen eius,
et misericórdia eius in progénies
et progénies timéntibus eum.
Fecit poténtiam in bráchio suo,
dispérsit supérbos mente cordis sui;
depósuit poténtes de sede
et exaltávit húmiles.
Esuriéntes implévit bonis
et dívites dimísit inánes.
Suscépit Ísrael púerum suum,
recordátus misericórdiæ,
sicut locútus est ad patres nostros,
Ábraham et sémini eius in sæcula.

Glória Patri et Fílio
et Spirítui Sancto.
Sicut erat in princípio,
et nunc et semper,
et in sæcula sæculórum.

Amen.

[IreneE]

I’ll put it to you this way...

How come Joseph wanted to divorce Mary when he found out she was pregnant?

...because they were already married in the sight of God and in the sight of the community.

Google it. It’s all over the web.

The holiness of God would not allow Him to break one of His own admonitions...

“Give ye not even the appearance of evil...”

Msry was not in sin. Otherwise, there would have had to be some judgment made on her pregnancy by the elders. Joseph wanted to divorce her, quietly because he thought she had been with someone else and wanted to spare her public condemnation, which would have been the case had she slept with another man.

Instead, NO ONE protested that she was pregnant. This is because everyone thought she, as Joseph’s wife of betrothal, had been with her husband in lawful conjugal visits.

I think there is a lot of household prep that had to be done before the couple started living together. I did the research on it a long time ago, can’t recall but it is all over the web.

They were not unwed. They were married just not living together. This again is why Joseph wanted to divorce her until God spoke.

[xzins]

They were not married. They were betrothed. There is a difference.

[elcid1970]

“....a Jesuit was present at my ordination. But he was a renegade.”

I rest my case. IMHO, all Jesuits are renegades (ask any reigning Pope). And I’m old enough to remember high school retreats featuring Jesuits who styled themselves as “a fighting priest who isn’t afraid to talk to urban young people”. The kumbaya was so thick you could cut it with a knife, er, switchblade.

Mary’s holy exalted place as Virgin Mother in Heaven is really not going to be affected by what some tambourine-banging post-Vatican II leftovers happen to think about her. Problem is, too many of them are now archbishops.

Are you still wearing turtlenecks instead of a Roman collar?

;^)

[xzins]

I’m not Roman....

(But, it hadn’t come up until now.)

[elcid1970]

That didn’t answer my question.

Anyway, we’re firing back and forth so rapidly, it’s obvious we both need to get off the internet and get a life. I’m outta here. Go, the Mass is ended.

Ciao, baby

[restornu]

Your comparison is offensive. It’s not like Joseph impregnated Mary.

ITA

Yet ever so often the reader runs into a Bible story that is left wanting for more, there is a obvious gap...

....leaving some to want to even question that which seems like a moral contradiction.

IMHO there is more to this Bible story!

[xzins]

The Untouchables, Sean Connery

:>)

[IreneE]

Yes I agree, but then why would Joseph seek to divorce her?

The bigger question is that God would not give the appearance of sin by having Mary impregnated, even by His spirit.

The betrothal period allowed for conjugal visits, otherwise Mary would have caused a situation that would have required her to be stoned to death.

A divorce was required in the betrothal period. They were not “unwed” in the eyes of the Lord, lest Jesus was made a bastard by the Holy Spirit!

[xzins]

Because betrothal was a real committment, but it still wasn’t quite married. If as some said, Joseph got “conjugal visits” during their betrothal, then that would be a direct attack on Mary’s virginity, wouldn’t it be?

[magdalen]

Mary was not ‘just another unwed pregnant teen’ as some have referred to her as. Rather in the marriage arrangement under Jewish custom she was already legally the wife of Joseph which is why he thought of a quiet divorce. Our Lord did not come into this world under a cloud of scandal for an unmarried pregnant woman could even be subject to stoning.

[xzins]

So betrothed to you equals the same as married. Is that right?

[Judith Anne]

So betrothed to you equals the same as married. Is that right?

No, betrothed in Christ's time among the Jewish community was nearly the same as married, and required a divorce to dissolve. Magdalen is correct.