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While I suppose that it is true that no pope has ever made an ex cathedra proclamation against abortion, it is also true that the Church has NEVER indicated that abortion was not a sin.
1 posted on 02/12/2009 4:05:04 PM PST by wagglebee
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2 posted on 02/12/2009 4:05:40 PM PST by wagglebee ("A political party cannot be all things to all people." -- Ronald Reagan, 3/1/75)
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3 posted on 02/12/2009 4:05:56 PM PST by wagglebee ("A political party cannot be all things to all people." -- Ronald Reagan, 3/1/75)
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To: wagglebee
Catholic Assumption University of Windsor

At first glance of the title, I thought this article was referring to Catholic U. in Washington DC. A big relief to see that I misunderstood the title.
4 posted on 02/12/2009 4:10:05 PM PST by Fred (Buy on the Rumor - Sell on the Fact)
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To: wagglebee
From my blog: Pope John Paul II made three statements can be seen as infallible, according to the ordinary and universal Magisterium. The statement on the issue of abortion is below, along with some of the context from the encyclical:
61. The texts of Sacred Scripture never address the question of deliberate abortion and so do not directly and specifically condemn it. But they show such great respect for the human being in the mother's womb that they require as a logical consequence that God's commandment "You shall not kill" be extended to the unborn child as well.

Human life is sacred and inviolable at every moment of existence, including the initial phase which precedes birth. All human beings, from their mothers' womb, belong to God who searches them and knows them, who forms them and knits them together with his own hands, who gazes on them when they are tiny shapeless embryos and already sees in them the adults of tomorrow whose days are numbered and whose vocation is even now written in the "book of life" (cf. Ps 139: 1, 13-16)....Throughout Christianity's two thousand year history, this same doctrine has been constantly taught by the Fathers of the Church and by her Pastors and Doctors. Even scientific and philosophical discussions about the precise moment of the infusion of the spiritual soul have never given rise to any hesitation about the moral condemnation of abortion.

62. The more recent Papal Magisterium has vigorously reaffirmed this common doctrine. Pius XI in particular, in his Encyclical Casti Connubii, rejected the specious justifications of abortion. Pius XII excluded all direct abortion, i.e., every act tending directly to destroy human life in the womb "whether such destruction is intended as an end or only as a means to an end" [Address to the Biomedical Association "San Luca" (12 November 1944)]. John XXIII reaffirmed that human life is sacred because "from its very beginning it directly involves God's creative activity" [quote from his encylical Mater et Magistra]. The Second Vatican Council, as mentioned earlier, sternly condemned abortion: "From the moment of its conception life must be guarded with the greatest care, while abortion and infanticide are unspeakable crimes" [Vatican II's Pastoral Constitution on the Church in the Modern World Gaudium et Spes, 51.]....

Given such unanimity in the doctrinal and disciplinary tradition of the Church, Paul VI was able to declare that this tradition is unchanged and unchangeable [in his encyclical Humanae Vitae, 14.]. Therefore, by the authority which Christ conferred upon Peter and his Successors, in communion with the Bishops-who on various occasions have condemned abortion and who in the aforementioned consultation, albeit dispersed throughout the world, have shown unanimous agreement concerning this doctrine-I declare that direct abortion, that is, abortion willed as an end or as a means, always constitutes a grave moral disorder, since it is the deliberate killing of an innocent human being. This doctrine is based upon the natural law and upon the written Word of God, is transmitted by the Church's Tradition and taught by the ordinary and universal Magisterium.

No circumstance, no purpose, no law whatsoever can ever make licit an act which is intrinsically illicit, since it is contrary to the Law of God which is written in every human heart, knowable by reason itself, and proclaimed by the Church.


5 posted on 02/12/2009 4:11:20 PM PST by Pyro7480 (This Papist asks everyone to continue to pray the Rosary for our country!)
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To: wagglebee

Not to be argumentative here but doesn’t the church recognize that murder is a sin ? Just curious .....


6 posted on 02/12/2009 4:11:52 PM PST by SkyDancer ("Talent Without Ambition Is Sad, Ambition Without Talent Is Worse")
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To: wagglebee

The fruits of “theistic evolution.”


7 posted on 02/12/2009 4:14:02 PM PST by Zionist Conspirator ('Anokhi HaShem 'Eloqeykha; 'asher hotze'tikha me'Eretz Mitzrayim, mibeit `avadim.)
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To: wagglebee

This is profound hair-splitting. By asserting that a pro-abortion position is a legitimate one because it has not been asserted infallibly is as contrived as saying that murder may be acceptable, because it is not one of the seven cardinal sins.

Heck, has even human sacrifice ever been infallibly asserted as wrong?


9 posted on 02/12/2009 4:17:44 PM PST by yefragetuwrabrumuy
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To: wagglebee

Thou shalt not kill. Does the Pope really need to go Ex Cathedra on that point, Father?


10 posted on 02/12/2009 4:19:30 PM PST by RinaseaofDs
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To: All
Pinged from Terri Dailies


11 posted on 02/12/2009 4:22:24 PM PST by wagglebee ("A political party cannot be all things to all people." -- Ronald Reagan, 3/1/75)
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To: wagglebee

The deposit of faith does not just consist of doctrines that have had a specific verbal formula infallibly defined. General doctrines of faith and morals that have been taught always and everywhere in the Church are part of Sacred Tradition and must be held, as concepts, by the faithful. The sinfulness of abortion has always and everywhere been taught in the Church.


17 posted on 02/12/2009 4:33:13 PM PST by Unam Sanctam
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To: GMMAC; fanfan

Canada Ping


21 posted on 02/12/2009 4:39:49 PM PST by wagglebee ("A political party cannot be all things to all people." -- Ronald Reagan, 3/1/75)
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To: wagglebee

What doesn’t this priest understand about

“Thou shalt not kill.”?


22 posted on 02/12/2009 4:41:00 PM PST by Salvation ( †With God all things are possible.†)
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To: wagglebee

Catholic opposition to abortion and contraception is rooted in the ordinary magisterium. And THAT is infallible.


27 posted on 02/12/2009 4:47:14 PM PST by vladimir998 (Ignorance of Scripture is ignorance of Christ. St. Jerome)
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To: wagglebee

Not every infallible teaching is pronounced Ex Cathedera. For example I don’t think any Pope and the Magesterium have every made the official pronouncement that believing in the Divinity of Christ is binding on all faithful. Not because it is not but because it is part of the universal deposit of faith. The same is true of the Church’s teachings on abortion. The Church has over and over again affirmed that abortion is a sin and forbidden to Catholic faithful. Even more it is so grave a sin that indirect involvement by supporting abortion is also a sin.

This priest is a donkey’s patoot and needs a boot up his backside. What a maroon.


39 posted on 02/12/2009 5:05:22 PM PST by lastchance (Hug your babies.)
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To: wagglebee

This is all really quite simple....neither Cokie Roberts, nor the good father....really ARE Catholic....


49 posted on 02/12/2009 5:21:12 PM PST by mo
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To: wagglebee

bump


51 posted on 02/12/2009 5:26:53 PM PST by Mogwai (You say "far right" like that's a bad thing!)
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To: wagglebee

We had plans to bring Cokie Roberts to our diocese to speak at a fundraiser this Spring. Once we vetted her on abortion, it took a nanosecond to decide that the discussion was over.


52 posted on 02/12/2009 5:34:30 PM PST by veritas2002
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To: wagglebee

no ex cathedra statement yet, but coming. No doctrine is defined until violated. It is time Papa........


53 posted on 02/12/2009 6:05:58 PM PST by wombtotomb (since its "above his paygrade", why can't we err on the side of caution about when life begins?)
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Obama: “If they make a mistake, I don’t want them punished with a baby.”

55 posted on 02/12/2009 8:09:56 PM PST by narses (http://www.theobamadisaster.com/)
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To: wagglebee
Priests like this have got to go, regardless of the shortage of priests in the United States and elsewhere. They confuse people and lead them in the wrong direction.

I knew Cokie was pro-choice, but not as radically so. She was "offended" by the church's stand on partial birth abortion? I'm offended by the fact that so prominent a Catholic would voice views so despicable and in complete opposition to her faith. She should be excommunicated.

56 posted on 02/12/2009 8:30:16 PM PST by TAdams8591 (When Obama FAILS, America SUCCEEDS.)
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