Posted on 09/20/2009 10:37:51 AM PDT by NYer
God’s knows!
You wrote:
“In Europe nothing escapes the attention of the Catholic Church hierarchy.”
I only wish. If you were right, then there would have been no scandal connected with the Polish bishops and how some worked for the secret police.
“So they know everything about the Masons ~ and they don’t seem to be particularly excited about it.”
You’re assuming a lot.
“BTW, ever since just after Napoleon plunged Western Europe into what seemed an eternity of war, the Catholics and Protestants have actually been on the same side.”
So?
“Sure, there are quibbles over details, but I’m sure that for every point of doctrine or dogma you can find some Protestant group somewhere that matches up perfectly with the Roman Catholic church.”
Maybe, but if they still disagree on salvation, the sacraments and authority, then their agreements don’t count for much in real terms.
“The big worry is about Orthodoxy. Those guys seem pretty beaten down by the Islamofascists and need recharged in some way. Maybe we could get them to join a secret society with special gold rings, little funny cars, motorcycles, and parades.”
Masonry is growing in the Muslim world.
The Knights of Columbus is just a pious society, originally a burial and mutual aid society for Catholic men in the US, that has no idependent creed or beliefs of its own. Knights believe what the Church believes, and in fact its rules and practices have to be approved by the Church, and it has Catholic priests as its chaplains. One of the reasons it has “grand knights” and things like that is because it was intended to give upwardly mobile Catholic men an alternative to Masonry.
Freemasonry has an entirely different set of beliefs that actually have very little to do with Christianity. Freemasons are deists and also believe in having a small, select group of those “in the know” who get admitted to their “mysteries.”
In the case of mainstream Protestantism, many of the members of these churches are little more than deists, anyway, and see Jesus basically as a prophet; their beliefs wouldn’t be inconsistent with Freemasonry or even Islam, for that matter. Note, I’m not saying anyone on this thread is like this, simply that mainstream Protestantism as a whole barely qualifies as Christian anymore.
Freemasonry in the US does not have to be aggressive because there is really not much a faith system that would present it with any opposition, at any rate, among the social classes it usually targets. It’s basically just a social club for Protestants who are seeking status in smaller towns and communities.
However, in Europe, many Freemasons are Communists or Communist supporters, and they are all radically opposed to the Catholic Church. And they take their odd beliefs and rites very seriously and usually insist, for example, on being buried with Masonic rites and not from a church, if they happen to be members of one.
I’m sure somewhere some non-Catholic group also has the Pope as their Pope ~ aren’t they in California? Made those funny movies about Australia and the end of the world or something.
You wrote:
“I’m sure somewhere some non-Catholic group also has the Pope as their Pope ~ aren’t they in California?”
No. There are only two churches I know of with a pope - a legitimate pope that is - the Catholic Church and the Coptic Church. All the others are pretenders and there aren’t any in California. There are anti-popes in Quebec, Montana, Kansas, Australia, England, Italy, Spain, and a few other countries.
“Made those funny movies about Australia and the end of the world or something.”
? I have no idea what you’re talking about there.
if you’re a true Catholic, the church doesn’t have to know......you know and that’s enough to make it a serious matter...!!!
34?
to be a Catholic you cannot pick and choose what you want to believe...the reason that protestants are called that is because they couldn’t handle the truth when it became inconvenient for them.....so much easier to be a protestant than a Catholic...you get to make your own rules!!!WOW pathetic
Mel Gibson’s group ~ they recognize the Pope as Pope, right?
My great-grandfather who came here from Germany was a stone mason but we’re Lutheran on that side of the family. Amway is the problem there.
You wrote:
“Mel Gibson’s group ~ they recognize the Pope as Pope, right?”
Mel Gibson’s father doesn’t. I think Mel kind plays back and forth on that point. He used to have his family attend an SSPX chapel in Los Angeles. For several years now, however, he has had his own chapel. I have no idea who the priest is who says Mass there.
You can pretty much reduce it to one rea$on the church opposes ma$onry (or is that freema$onry)
The church want$ money and hate$ the bu$ine$$ competition.
Do you imagine any of the Gibson crowd are Masons?
re post 56...you cannot be a member of the ku klux klan nor a member of the Masons and still consider yourself a Catholic...You’d better check back with your pastor and he’d best seek the opinion of someone who knows what they’re talking about...Masonry and Catholocism are not compatable....one or the other....not both. Good luck, when you figure that out. You will be welcomed home with open arms...just like the prodigal son...get your act together and get right with the church.
Definitely not.
At some point the parish matures, the people mature in their faith, knowledge increases, and it's time to bring them into the fold.
You find the Protestant Reformation happening right at the time when the last dregs of the Dark Ages were being overcome and Europe was entering into a modern economic model. The Protestant urge in France started at THE TOP with the King's own family ~ and spread to the Royals at large, and then into the Nobility. These were the educated people of power and wealth and they thought they were quite cable of doing their Pater Nosters on their own, and not necessarily in a nearby church where they'd be led in every subtle nuance of analysis of Scripture by a priest who had no more education than had they.
The Counter Reformation took note of a great deal of this although I'd suggest they may have overdone some things because today they've not only lost attendance at church sponsored services, they've lost "interest" in the whole body of belief.
It's not too late to come over to the Protestant model and use diversity of form to bring the people to a unity of belief.
You have just made the argument why Christians cannot be masons.
Quite true. I myself am a Mason, and an evangelical Christian. My wife has pointed out to me that her objection to the Craft has nothing to do with symbolic penalties but rather with taking an oath before God. I can understand this position.
However, the charge to the candidate before the obligation has always handled this issue from my point of view.
Tried. Won’t load. My Blackberry is a mess, and my service sucks here (Dallas). FR loads though. Don’t know why.
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