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Can Joel Osteen Help You Pay Your Bills?
CNN ^ | 12/18/09 | Christine Romans

Posted on 12/19/2009 6:37:28 PM PST by marshmallow

Houston, Texas (CNN) -- Joel Osteen strides into the former Compaq Center. Some 20,000 people are standing and singing. Purple lights softly pulse across the ceiling, and mist floats around two giant screens flashing words to the songs.

It's not a pulpit but a podium. It's not an altar but a stage. There is no cross. Instead a huge globe spins, and two massive bubbling creeks flank the stage. A lighting system softens distant corners of the massive arena and spreads colored light and smoke in strategic spots. Somehow, the space that will hold 40,000-plus on Sunday morning doesn't feel like a sports arena.

In the control room, producers watch multiple camera angles and feeds.

Smiling broadly, Osteen bounds up the few stairs to the stage, closes his eyes, lifts his hands and leads a prayer.

"God, I'm going to start this week off in faith. Expecting your goodness. Expecting to have a blessed and a prosperous week. Amen. Well, God bless you. Give him your very best today."

Welcome to Sunday morning at Lakewood Church in Houston, Texas. It's reportedly the nation's largest congregation and probably one of the most diverse places in America. One third of these churchgoers are Hispanic, one-third African-American and a quarter white. There are dozens of nationalities.

Osteen will give this sermon twice. He later said he knows immediately which segments to edit together into a sermon that will air on television to millions three weeks later.

Between services, he is signing his most recent book in the lobby, just past the bookstore that is one of the highest-grossing Christian bookstores in America.

His wife, Victoria, is co-pastor of the church and a best-selling author in her own right. In fact, the Osteens are not paid to be pastors at Lakewood, according to .............

(Excerpt) Read more at cnn.com ...


TOPICS: Current Events; Evangelical Christian; Religion & Culture
KEYWORDS: moapb; tbnhucksters
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There is no cross.

As the saying goes...."no cross, no Christ". A fitting metaphor for the Gospel according to Joel.

"If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me" isn't Joel's favorite piece of Scripture.

1 posted on 12/19/2009 6:37:29 PM PST by marshmallow
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To: marshmallow

Well, at least he doesn’t have any trouble playing his bills.


2 posted on 12/19/2009 6:39:11 PM PST by proxy_user
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To: marshmallow

When you buy his books, you’re paying his bills.


3 posted on 12/19/2009 6:40:18 PM PST by BigSkyFreeper ("The Community Organizer better stop bitching that the community is organizing." - Rush Limbaugh)
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To: marshmallow

Joel O is a fraud of monumental proportions using Christianity to pack his bank balances by tens of millions of dollars. Will these imbecile followers ever learn?


4 posted on 12/19/2009 6:42:24 PM PST by Steelfish
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To: Steelfish
Joel O is a fraud of monumental proportions using Christianity to pack his bank balances by tens of millions of dollars. Will these imbecile followers ever learn?

Amen, brutha!

5 posted on 12/19/2009 6:46:50 PM PST by Sans-Culotte ( Pray for Obama- Psalm 109:8)
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To: marshmallow
"If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me" isn't Joel's favorite piece of Scripture.

He actually talks about and personally demonstrates a surrendered life, a committed life to the Lord, and living by faith in God's grace.

Many confuse a Philadelphia church with a Laodicean church. We are living in the lukewarm Laodicean era where Christ's return is imminent. Many who view Mr. Osteen from a distance and/or don't read his books confuse his ministry with the lukewarm Christ-less, faithless, cross-less, bloodless message of the apostate church. (I wasn't sure about him either until God helped me to take a closer look.) His ministry is biblically based, founded on scriptural doctrine, anointed, and infused with faith, hope and love.

The Pharisees of Jesus' day hated him because he didn't condemn people the way they did or follow their religious dictates. They also envied him because so many followed him. Crowds or the lack thereof neither qualifies nor disqualifies a ministry. "By their fruits (not leaves) you shall know them." Inspect Osteen's fruit and see what you come with. Pharisees are notorious leaf inspectors. No different with the Pharisees of today. Our notion of holiness isn't necessarily God's holiness. Jesus is the revelation of the Father and his holiness.

6 posted on 12/19/2009 6:48:34 PM PST by Jim 0216
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To: Steelfish
Joel O is a fraud of monumental proportions using Christianity to pack his bank balances by tens of millions of dollars. Will these imbecile followers ever learn?

Please backup your words with facts.

Tell us exactly how Joel Osteen is a fraud, of course provide us with links and evidence of such as well.

7 posted on 12/19/2009 6:49:02 PM PST by adm5 (YOU CANNOT FIX CAPITALISM WITH SOCIALISM! -Glenn Beck)
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To: marshmallow
I purchased and read his book “How To Become A Better You” and enjoyed it but I stopped purchasing his books and listening to him when I found out that he didn't hold a Christmas service but instead he and his family jets off to Aspen or Vail or someplace. That his “church” doesn't have a cross proves even more that he is nothing more than a con man.
8 posted on 12/19/2009 6:49:26 PM PST by proudofthesouth (Political Correctness is being used to destroy our country/It's time to put CHRIST back in CHRISTmas)
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To: Steelfish

He and his wife are downright creepy.


9 posted on 12/19/2009 6:49:53 PM PST by Drea
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To: marshmallow

If you drop down the page which you had given the link for, you would have seen that story that Osteens saying that Obama loves the Lord. BARF!

I guess no one learned the lesson that Jim Bakker taught...


10 posted on 12/19/2009 6:51:35 PM PST by Buddygirl
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To: Drea

“He and his wife are downright creepy.”

I agree. I made the mistake of buying one of his books once but no more. Its amazing the number of books he and his wife manage to write and publish every year.


11 posted on 12/19/2009 6:54:52 PM PST by proudofthesouth (Political Correctness is being used to destroy our country/It's time to put CHRIST back in CHRISTmas)
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To: Jim 0216
He actually talks about and personally demonstrates a surrendered life, a committed life to the Lord, and living by faith in God's grace

The cross is a symbol of suffering. I'm reminded of a passage from the Book of Wisdom; “If you want to know God, prepare yourself for an ordeal.”

According to Joel......"prepare yourself for the good times".

12 posted on 12/19/2009 6:55:12 PM PST by marshmallow ("A country which kills its own children has no future" -Mother Teresa of Calcutta)
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To: adm5

Just type in “Joel Osteen Fraud” in Google and see what you get!


13 posted on 12/19/2009 6:55:12 PM PST by Steelfish
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To: Buddygirl

Heeeee Heeeeee!


14 posted on 12/19/2009 6:55:25 PM PST by Red_Devil 232 (VietVet - USMC All Ready On The Right? All Ready On The Left? All Ready On The Firing Line!)
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To: marshmallow

“hay, wood and stubble”


15 posted on 12/19/2009 6:55:30 PM PST by Doctor Don
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To: marshmallow

joel too positive everything is great for me preacher. i need some fire and brimstone to put me back in my place from time to time. no disrespect to joel just not my kind of message i need


16 posted on 12/19/2009 6:57:23 PM PST by remaxagnt (`)
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To: marshmallow; All

Excuse me, but the cross is only a symbol of Christ’s SACRIFICE for all humanity. The cross is not an idol to be worshipped.

And .. for anybody who is willing to hear, CHRIST IS NOT ON THE CROSS ANY LONGER. JESUS ROSE FROM THE DEAD - BY THE POWER OF GOD - PROVING THAT JESUS’ SACRIFICE WAS REAL AND HAD A PURPOSE. THE PURPOSE WAS TO SAVE ALL THOSE WHO BELIEVE ON HIM (CHRIST) .. not all those who believe on Joel.

I watch Joel every Sunday. I find his preaching refreshing and uplifting, and I write down all the scripture references he uses and read them for myself.

It’s only jealously to be afraid of a Christian man who owns a huge and fancy arena in which to preach. Such a person needs to be redeemed.

A good key to remember is this: If Joel is from God, nobody will be able to stop him. If Joel is not from God, God is more than capable of shuting him down. The unbelievers of this world don’t have to do anything .. God can take care of it.


17 posted on 12/19/2009 6:58:33 PM PST by CyberAnt (Healthcare is not a RIGHT guaranteed by the Constitution)
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To: adm5

Well, what leaps to my mind immediately is his interview with Larry King — when asked about why he didn’t preach about hell, he answered (paraphrased) that his congregation didn’t want to hear about it.

Christ talked about hell.

I have yet to understand exactly how Osteen expounds the Gospel on any level. Does he preach Christ, and Him crucified? Does he preach that Christians are to expect to be hated and tried?

Or, does he preach, “blab it and grab it”?

Just sayin’.

Hoss


18 posted on 12/19/2009 7:00:54 PM PST by HossB86
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To: Steelfish

Ditto Obama and Muslim lover Rick Warren.


19 posted on 12/19/2009 7:02:02 PM PST by Frantzie (Judge David Carter - democrat & dishonorable Marine like John Murtha.)
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To: proudofthesouth

Ghost writers are incredibly cheap.


20 posted on 12/19/2009 7:02:44 PM PST by Frantzie (Judge David Carter - democrat & dishonorable Marine like John Murtha.)
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To: CyberAnt

btt


21 posted on 12/19/2009 7:04:33 PM PST by Ciexyz
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To: marshmallow
I'm reminded of a passage from the Book of Wisdom; “If you want to know God, prepare yourself for an ordeal.” According to Joel......"prepare yourself for the good times".

I don't know about the "Book of Wisdom," but I know the Bible says, "Looking unto Jesus...who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross..."Hebrews 12:2. Joel emphasizes that the hard times now are meant for our good and for a future blessing God has in store. Totally scriptural.

22 posted on 12/19/2009 7:05:50 PM PST by Jim 0216
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To: Jim 0216

I don’t assume Joel is perfect.

However, I find his sermons Biblical.

I find his small groups work at maturing people in discipleship relationships in authentic Christianity.

I find the rock throwers petty, prissy, often hypocritical, pharisaical and usually rather mean-spirited.

I’ll take the Biblical fruit of Joel’s ministry over the fruit of such bad heart attitudes any day.


23 posted on 12/19/2009 7:07:15 PM PST by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: marshmallow

I seem to recall that Jesus promised his followers suffering in this life...but that kind of thing doesn’t exactly fill an arena now does it?


24 posted on 12/19/2009 7:08:03 PM PST by Trod Upon (Obama: Making the Carter malaise look good. Misery Index in 3...2...1)
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To: CyberAnt
Excuse me, but the cross is only a symbol of Christ’s SACRIFICE for all humanity. The cross is not an idol to be worshipped.

It's more than a symbol. Jesus says that anyone who would be a follower of His, must take up his own cross. The New Testament is clear both in the word and in the example of the apostles and evangelists that trials and struggles await those who follow Jesus

And .. for anybody who is willing to hear, CHRIST IS NOT ON THE CROSS ANY LONGER. JESUS ROSE FROM THE DEAD - BY THE POWER OF GOD - PROVING THAT JESUS’ SACRIFICE WAS REAL AND HAD A PURPOSE. THE PURPOSE WAS TO SAVE ALL THOSE WHO BELIEVE ON HIM (CHRIST) .. not all those who believe on Joel.

Jesus is the head of the Church which is His body. The Church militant here on earth still suffers and struggles and lives out the Passion of Jesus.

I watch Joel every Sunday. I find his preaching refreshing and uplifting, and I write down all the scripture references he uses and read them for myself.

Read a few he doesn't use.

It’s only jealously to be afraid of a Christian man who owns a huge and fancy arena in which to preach. Such a person needs to be redeemed.

Who's jealous? I fear for the Osteen "bubble".

A good key to remember is this: If Joel is from God, nobody will be able to stop him. If Joel is not from God, God is more than capable of shuting him down. The unbelievers of this world don’t have to do anything .. God can take care of it.

On that, we agree.

25 posted on 12/19/2009 7:10:18 PM PST by marshmallow ("A country which kills its own children has no future" -Mother Teresa of Calcutta)
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To: Jim 0216
Joel emphasizes that the hard times now are meant for our good and for a future blessing God has in store. Totally scriptural

What sort of a "blessing"??

Moolah?

26 posted on 12/19/2009 7:12:36 PM PST by marshmallow ("A country which kills its own children has no future" -Mother Teresa of Calcutta)
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To: Jim 0216
By their fruits (not leaves)

I like that, that's good! It instructs me on another scripture.
27 posted on 12/19/2009 7:12:40 PM PST by presently no screen name
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To: Jim 0216

As a life long born again Christian myself, Joel Olsteen is class 1-A huckster new age fraud.


28 posted on 12/19/2009 7:12:45 PM PST by Hammerhead
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To: marshmallow
Osteen is another religious con man, and many are willingly deceived by him. He is no different than Schuler or any other snake oil sales man. Osteen does not care if any of his zombies can pay their bills as long as he can live the life of luxury. Someone needs to remind him that he came into this world with nothing, and he will leave this world with nothing. Osteen may be attractive to his worldly followers, but he is repulsive to God.
29 posted on 12/19/2009 7:16:12 PM PST by Nosterrex
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To: adm5
He teaches a prosperity gospel. I don't know if I'd call him a fraud, but his ministry is very light on the gospel. I just checked his web site and to go to one of his revivals there's a $15 charge. On the front page there's no mention of Jesus, but advertisements for several of his books.

Just in my opinion, I'd be more inclined to listen to Tony Robbins than Joel Osteen. At least Robbins gives practical advice.

30 posted on 12/19/2009 7:17:20 PM PST by Richard Kimball (We're all criminals. They just haven't figured out what some of us have done yet.)
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To: Hammerhead
life long born again

Is that even possible?
31 posted on 12/19/2009 7:18:23 PM PST by whattajoke (Let's keep Conservatism real.)
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To: marshmallow
A crown of joy and God's favor is what the scripture says and what Joel preaches.

On the subject of "moolah", haven't you ever read, 3 John 1:2 "Beloved, I wish above all things that you may prosper and be in health, even as thy soul prospers."

I you don't like it, take it up with God, it's His Word. He certainly won't force you to take what his Word grants you.

32 posted on 12/19/2009 7:19:31 PM PST by Jim 0216
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To: adm5
Tell us exactly how Joel Osteen is a fraud

He takes your money and gives you nothing in return that you can't get for free. Give me a break.
33 posted on 12/19/2009 7:20:53 PM PST by whattajoke (Let's keep Conservatism real.)
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To: Jim 0216

Joel Osteen=Christianity light


34 posted on 12/19/2009 7:22:21 PM PST by az.b1bbomberfxr
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To: Jim 0216
So what are the Christians in Iraq doing wrong? Their churches are being blown up by Muslims and they have no jobs. I don't see much prosperity in their future. Just a crown of thorns. Do they need to get themselves a copy of Joel's book? Will that fix the problem?

How about the Christians who were martyred behind the Iron Curtain. What was their problem? No faith?

Osteen's shtick might fly in the air-conditioned comfort of the Compaq Center but it won't fly in the real world.

35 posted on 12/19/2009 7:26:45 PM PST by marshmallow ("A country which kills its own children has no future" -Mother Teresa of Calcutta)
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To: Hammerhead
1 Corinthians 13:13 And now abides faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.

Many don't like the scriptural message and demonstration of hope and faith in God's love. They killed Jesus because of it.

36 posted on 12/19/2009 7:27:01 PM PST by Jim 0216
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To: marshmallow; All

As the Alumnus of a 3-yr Bible school - I can assure you I have read quite a few scriptures.

And .. it was rude and presumptions of you to ASSUME I had not.

When Jesus said, take up your “cross” and follow me - He was not talking about a literal CROSS - He was talking about the burdens of life - which every person has. But .. to follow Jesus, you have to lay them down (not carry them around with you) and follow HIM, not a symbol.

Non-believers or some who believe evengelical preachers are all bad seeds should read what God has to say about judgement. If we cannot judge - then we need to have a mechanism by which to “judge” people - Jesus called it DISCERNMENT. If more people would tap into discernment (from the Holy Ghost) instead of judgement - they wouldn’t get so cranky about what other preachers are doing.

The only “bubble” Osteen is in .. is one supplied by God, and I believe God is more than capable of sustaining it.


37 posted on 12/19/2009 7:29:28 PM PST by CyberAnt (Healthcare is not a RIGHT guaranteed by the Constitution)
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To: marshmallow

Hebrews 12:2 and 3John1:2 is God’s Word. As I said, you’re going to have to take up your complaint with God.


38 posted on 12/19/2009 7:31:00 PM PST by Jim 0216
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To: Steelfish

Wow! Such ignorance. How can you possibly be a conservative.


39 posted on 12/19/2009 7:31:46 PM PST by CyberAnt (Healthcare is not a RIGHT guaranteed by the Constitution)
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To: Jim 0216

Amen and Amen!


40 posted on 12/19/2009 7:34:28 PM PST by CyberAnt (Healthcare is not a RIGHT guaranteed by the Constitution)
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To: Drea

ROTFLOL!!!!


41 posted on 12/19/2009 7:35:36 PM PST by CyberAnt (Healthcare is not a RIGHT guaranteed by the Constitution)
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To: Jim 0216
Hebrews 12:2 and 3John1:2 is God’s Word. As I said, you’re going to have to take up your complaint with God.

I don't have a complaint.

I'm just wondering what Joel would say if he suddenly found himself in front of an audience of hungry Iraqi Christian refugees in the middle of the desert instead of a group of Americans luxuriating in purple lighting and fake smoke.

"I see prosperity in your future, brothers.........LOL"

42 posted on 12/19/2009 7:35:38 PM PST by marshmallow ("A country which kills its own children has no future" -Mother Teresa of Calcutta)
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To: CyberAnt

Noticed your tagline. Did you see this thread?

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2411440/posts


43 posted on 12/19/2009 7:36:14 PM PST by presently no screen name
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To: marshmallow; All

Hmmmm ..?? Ordeal huh??

Then how come the Bible says, “Beloved, I wish above ALL THINGS that thou mayest prosper and be in good health”.

That doesn’t sound like an “ordeal” to me ..??


44 posted on 12/19/2009 7:38:54 PM PST by CyberAnt (Healthcare is not a RIGHT guaranteed by the Constitution)
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To: proudofthesouth
That his “church” doesn't have a cross proves even more that he is nothing more than a con man.

So, you have to have a cross hanging in your church to be genuine? I must have passed over that chapter and verse. It just proves that he doesn't have a cross hanging in his place of worship.
45 posted on 12/19/2009 7:40:56 PM PST by tenger (If we don't stay on 'em, they'll get it wrong -Soucheray)
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To: HossB86; All

What ..?? You’d rather hear about HELL instead of heaven ..??

And .. those who have made Jesus their Savior, are no longer interested in HELL, because they are not going there!

But .. of course, if people don’t know Jesus as their Savior, then I suspect they might be very curious about HELL.


46 posted on 12/19/2009 7:42:15 PM PST by CyberAnt (Healthcare is not a RIGHT guaranteed by the Constitution)
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To: CyberAnt
Then how come the Bible says, “Beloved, I wish above ALL THINGS that thou mayest prosper and be in good health”.

As Christians, we wish that for our brothers and sisters in Christ.

And it may happen, through God's loving providence that we do indeed prosper and enjoy good health.

On the other hand, we might find ourselves in a prison cell like St. Paul or persecuted like the Christians who lived in communist Russia.

The Gospel is not a guarantee of earthly comfort.

47 posted on 12/19/2009 7:42:50 PM PST by marshmallow ("A country which kills its own children has no future" -Mother Teresa of Calcutta)
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To: marshmallow

“I’m reminded of a passage from the Book of Wisdom;”

The ‘Book of Wisdom’???? What the heck is that? Whatever it is, it doesn’t have the authority of scripture.


48 posted on 12/19/2009 7:43:58 PM PST by webstersII
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To: Richard Kimball

Tony Robbins is a cultist!

Good luck with that!


49 posted on 12/19/2009 7:45:42 PM PST by CyberAnt (Healthcare is not a RIGHT guaranteed by the Constitution)
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To: webstersII
One of the inconvenient books that Protestants ditched from the Bible.

Catholics still have it and you can read it HERE.

50 posted on 12/19/2009 7:46:56 PM PST by marshmallow ("A country which kills its own children has no future" -Mother Teresa of Calcutta)
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