Posted on 01/25/2010 10:57:46 AM PST by greyfoxx39
(Excerpt) Read more at mormontimes.com ...
Ping
From the inference of the article, it doesnt’ really matter HOW Joseph Smith got the vision, whether drug induced, schizophrenic episode, or alcoholic delium, or Satanic encounter, it is only important that you are convinced that the message contained in the “vision” is valuable?
Man those who teach Mormonism are certainly deluded by something.....
“How (Joseph Smith) received it doesn’t ultimately matter to us very much,” he said.
____________________________________________________
But it does to us...
And it should to the lurkers and those who are “investigating”..
Investigator is a term given to those who are cold calls from the aggressive mormon salesman...
Note: the mormonm salesmen AKA “mormon missionaries” knock on your door uninvited, IOW they go up to a stranger’s door ..you the stranger are not expecting them nor have you asked them to come...
but they refer to you as an “investigator” as though you called them and asked them to come and tell you about mormonism..cause you are anxious to know and want to join...
They may try to force a copy of the Book of Mormon on you....
What they wont tell you is that it is fiction by a conman named Joseph Smith and his cronies that was published in order to make some quick bucks...
Some ofg it was plagurized from a story by Solomon Spaulding and some of it came from tall tales that Smith used to tell his friends and family years before.
When Smith was “writing” the book he pretended to use the same “seer stone” that he used when he pretended to look for Spanish gold in neighbors fields for a price. This time he placed to stone in a hat to “translate” a story of ancient people written in a nonexistant language he called “Reformed Egyptian” that he claimed was printed onto gold plates that nobody ever actually saw...
The fact that Smith used a rock-in-the-hat to pretend to translate the words for his book “doesn’t ultimately matter” to Hafen and his wife...
Well it matters to the rest of us...
Placemarker ... have resupplied on popcorn now.
The-Rock-in-the-Hat PING
...OK, All you Holier than Thou’s ....Try this ...
The Bible wasn’t even put together until 300 years after Christ’s Death.
All of the Gospels are believed to have been written by someone other than Mathew, Mark, Luke and John! (probably one of thier diciples, but the Authors are totally unknown)
The Council of Nicea, which defines the “Doctrine of the Trinity” was a 4th Century political arrangement which begs comparison with the Kyoto Accords, and the Global Warming Religious Movement!
Hmmm .... maybe you should turn your hypocritical eye on your own religion.
You Emperors of Ignorance ... aren’t wearing any clothes!
The Council of Nicea, which defines the “Doctrine of the Trinity” was a 4th Century political arrangement which begs comparison with the Kyoto Accords, and the Global Warming Religious Movement!
Well, teppe, how's about furnishing some sources and proof of your claims?
Those "anti-Trinitarians" who post general statements without any proof don't get a pass on these threads. This argument on post #6 was just refuted by the Inmans...Ball is in your court to throw it again, Inmans....CATCH!
Hey kid you really want to impress us ???
What was it that Joey Smith found to be untrue about Presbyterianism ???
Even better...
Why do mormons want to be known as Trinitarian Christians ???
Have you ever asked God if the Bible is true ???
Is the book of mormon translated correctly ???
Why is the Bible accepted among the mormon standard works if it is considered to be translated wrong ???
Why did Jesus bother to leave Heaven if you can become a god yourself and save your self ???
Why did Jesus bother to leave Heaven if it was all up to Joey Smith to save mankind ???
Why did Jesus shed His blood on the cross and die to save the world that God so loved if it was not going to be enough ???
Why did Jesus say to teppe, “I am the Way, the Truth and the Life. No man or woman comes to the Father except by me.” John 14:6, if there was more than one way to God ???
truth ???
Lurkers, Lds, note what this general authority of Mormonism deems as a "mountain of the Mormon gospel" -- the way the church views the disobedience of a perfect Eve:
Within the Book of Mormon lies a phrase that reads, "Adam fell that men might be..." [it doesn't say be what they are "to be"...but Mormons fill in the blank on that]. You see, the absolute wacky understanding within Mormonism is that the world's evils were something the Mormon god wanted man to do...that's right, you heard right. In fact, it's so much of a desire that I'm surprised Mormons haven't dedicated a world-wide celebratory holiday to -- the day that Eve disobeyed God and ate from the tree of knowledge of good & evil.
You see, the Lds church in one of its priesthood manuals calls the Great Fall a "Great Blessing" while one of its general authorities, active "apostle" Dallin Oaks, wrote: "Some Christians condemn Eve for her act, concluding that she and her daughters are somehow flawed by it. Not the Latter-day Saints! Informed by revelation, we celebrate Eve's act and honor her with wisdom and courage in the great episode called the Fall." ("The Choice that Began Mortality" Liahona, 2002)
Wow. As another Mormon leader phrased it, Eve's sin was a 'fall' -- but it was an "upward fall."
Only in upsidedown Mormonism...
...are falls "upward" bounding...
...are wars, murders, hate, idolatry, racism, rape, incest, sexual abuse, lust, theft, and other consequences of the fall a "blessing" to be "celebrated."...
...is the pride of wanting to become a fellow "god" of THE God a "good thing..."
[Last time I checked the Bible, the prophet Isaiah didn't exactly promote that idea (Is. 14:14-16; chapter 43; chapter 44; chapter 45)]
For the sake of non-Mormons, allow me to explain the word "mortal" from a Mormon perspective: Why do Lds believe that by Adam & Eve sinning, it wasn't simply a "fall" -- but an "fall upward" -- an event to be "celebrated"??? Because they believe that it was only by mankind sinning that they could die -- becoming "mortal." And that by becoming "mortal" they could both (finally) have kids AND rise to godhood.
From the article: When a person considers how unique the church's understanding of core doctrine differs drastically from the rest of Christianity, "It shouldn't come as a big surprise that other Christian churches don't know quite what to do with us."
(Yes, you at least have that one right, Brother Hafen)
Now exactly why -- since they've redefined so much in an upside down way -- do they want to be considered "Christians" again?
According to Hafen, one of the “mountains” of the Mormon gospel includes “...the elevated way the church views Eve. These are not ‘picky, theological details,’ he said, ‘they are life-giving differences.’”
_______________________________________________________
Celebrating Eve
Lds apostle Dallin Oaks wrote: “Some Christians condemn Eve for her act, concluding that she and her daughters are somehow flawed by it. Not the Latter-day Saints! Informed by revelation, we celebrate Eve’s act and honor her with wisdom and courage in the great episode called the Fall.” (”The Choice that Began Mortality” Liahona, 2002)
... The statements I made regarding the compilation and authorship of the Bible are common theological knowledge.
As for the Trinitarian Doctrine, look up “Trinity” in the Bible .... it isn’t there! All discussion for the last 1,700 years of the “Trinity” for 1,700 years actually refers to the Nicene Creed which coined the term.
In the first vision, Christ told Joseph Smith that all of the Creeds of Christendom were an abomination to him.
The scriptures that support the doctrine are scant, while those that support the role of God the Father and Jesus Christ the Son, as seperate individuals are voluminous. It is clear through any study of any Epistle of Paul, that he DIDN’T teach trinitarian doctrine included in the Nicean creed!
The funny thing, in my experience is that Protestant Christians, generally understand/believe the relationship between God and Christ to be similar to what was revealed by Christ himself to Joseph Smith, while thier official Chrich Doctrine is in accordance with the Nicene, Apostolic and Athenasian Creeds.
look up “Joseph Smith” or “restoration” or “mormon” or “dead dunking” in the Bible .... they aren’t there!
I just read your posts - all of them.
http://www.freerepublic.com/tag/by:teppe/index?tab=comments;brevity=full;options=no-change
You have an interesting FreeRepublic history, even though it is quite short.
Nana ..... Read the Nicene, Apostolic and Athenasian Creeds, which are the foundation of the Trinitarian Doctrine.
Trinitarian Doctrine says that God, Crist and the Holy Ghost are different faces of the same being “three-in-one, one-in-three”
Christ himself said that this doctrine was an abomination.
In the first vision, ???? told Joseph Smith that all of the Creeds of Christendom were an abomination to him.
________________________________________________
Joey Smith never identified anyone in his so called “vision” as Christ...
Just “two personages” and one said the other was “my son”...
No names...
Christ himself said that this doctrine was an abomination.
___________________________________________________
I dont know which “christ” you are refering to ...
The Christ of the Bible never said that at all...
However the Christian Jesus and the mormon jesus are two different entities...
Not the same Jesus
“There are those outside the Church who say Latter-day Saints do not believe in the traditional Christ.
No, I don’t. The traditional Christ of whom they speak is not the Christ of whom I speak.”
– LDS President Gordon B. Hinckley (LDS Church News, June 20, 1998)
As you say “dead dunking” IS in the bible “1st Cor, 15:29”.
And ... of Course, I believe that the Bible is the Word of God; however, it is not perfect!
Did you realize that about half of the quotes which Christ uses are not actually contained in the Bible?
So If Christ himself quoted scripture ... and the scripture he quoted is not in the bible ....is the Bible perfect?
Nana ... Ever wonder how most of the Jews during the time of Christ could have rejected his message because of prejudism and reliance on the Pharasee’s
....your living it, Babe.
As for the Trinity...
While you have failed to supply an source for your theory...
I have at least one from God to back up His three-in-one identity...
From the Bible, the only Word of God...
For there are three that bear record in Heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. 1 John 5:7
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.