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Major scandals in Catholic Church
Montreal Gazette ^ | March 22, 2010

Posted on 03/22/2010 6:21:30 AM PDT by Gamecock

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1 posted on 03/22/2010 6:21:30 AM PDT by Gamecock
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To: Dr. Eckleburg; Alex Murphy; blue-duncan; P-Marlowe; xzins; the_conscience; Dutchboy88; Quix

A scorecard, for those who just can’t keep track.


2 posted on 03/22/2010 6:24:44 AM PDT by Gamecock (We aren't sinners because we sin, we sin because we are sinners. (R.C. Sproul))
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To: Gamecock

Imagine you were a member of the Mafia and you were found to have raped a child. You wouldn’t have the life expectancy of a house fly.


3 posted on 03/22/2010 6:26:37 AM PDT by BiggieLittle
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To: Gamecock

In the meantime, Islam endorses Pederasty.


4 posted on 03/22/2010 6:29:16 AM PDT by MuttTheHoople (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/9c/TeddyVWad.jpg)
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To: Gamecock

Gee, you guys are really active today. This must be about the third time a thread on this has been posted.

One thing that really surprised and depressed me when I started to read FR was to learn how much Protestants hate Catholics.


5 posted on 03/22/2010 6:30:26 AM PDT by livius
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To: MuttTheHoople

True.

But we are talking about Rome.


6 posted on 03/22/2010 6:31:52 AM PDT by Gamecock (We aren't sinners because we sin, we sin because we are sinners. (R.C. Sproul))
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To: livius

Our country is going down the drain and what inspires some here? It’s telling, isn’t it?


7 posted on 03/22/2010 6:33:17 AM PDT by trisham (Zen is not easy. It takes effort to attain nothingness. And then what do you have? Bupkis.)
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To: livius

***This must be about the third time a thread on this has been posted.***

If Priests would stay away from children we wouldn’t be having this conversation, would we?

***One thing that really surprised and depressed me when I started to read FR was to learn how much Protestants hate Catholics.***

What in the world does this have to do with “hating Catholics?”

Priests molest children.
The church ignores the fact that priests are are molesting children.

You feelings of martyrdom at the hands of FR Protestants are misplaced.

Just out of curiosity, how much of the money you gave to your local parish went to clean us this mess?


8 posted on 03/22/2010 6:44:24 AM PDT by Gamecock (We aren't sinners because we sin, we sin because we are sinners. (R.C. Sproul))
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To: trisham
Our country is going down the drain and what inspires some here? It’s telling, isn’t it?

He's a one trick pony

One trick is all that horse can do....

9 posted on 03/22/2010 6:46:07 AM PDT by Lorica
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To: trisham

If you are so worried why aren’t you burning up the phone line to your representatives instead of lurking on the Religion Forum FR?


10 posted on 03/22/2010 6:46:35 AM PDT by Gamecock (We aren't sinners because we sin, we sin because we are sinners. (R.C. Sproul))
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To: Gamecock

Does the truth hurt that much?


11 posted on 03/22/2010 6:47:30 AM PDT by trisham (Zen is not easy. It takes effort to attain nothingness. And then what do you have? Bupkis.)
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To: livius
One thing that really surprised and depressed me when I started to read FR was to learn how much Protestants hate Catholics.

I have discovered that, unofficially, that about a fourth of Protestants are Protestants specifically for their hatred of Catholics. Love of Jesus comes a distant second to these types.

To the credit of the other 3/4 of Protestants, they'd like people like Gamecock to shut their piehole and focus on the enemy (atheists, radical muslims, liberal secularists, etc) rather than allies.

When I first joined FR, over ten years ago, there were a few blatant KKK types that I had booted off of this site. I haven't seen it in quite some time...I think they've learned what lines can not be crossed and what is tolerated. Unfortunately Catholic bashing won't get you banned on this site.

12 posted on 03/22/2010 6:47:55 AM PDT by kidd (Obama: The triumph of hope over evidence)
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To: Lorica

Exactly right.


13 posted on 03/22/2010 6:48:03 AM PDT by trisham (Zen is not easy. It takes effort to attain nothingness. And then what do you have? Bupkis.)
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To: Lorica

So do you endorse the behavior of Priests?

That’s the way it seems when you attack the messenger and not the horrible damage done by Roman Catholic Priests over the decades.


14 posted on 03/22/2010 6:48:11 AM PDT by Gamecock (We aren't sinners because we sin, we sin because we are sinners. (R.C. Sproul))
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To: Lorica

Here’s a thread worth reading:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2476815/posts


15 posted on 03/22/2010 6:49:33 AM PDT by trisham (Zen is not easy. It takes effort to attain nothingness. And then what do you have? Bupkis.)
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To: kidd

***I have discovered that, unofficially, that about a fourth of Protestants are Protestants specifically for their hatred of Catholics. Love of Jesus comes a distant second to these types.***

Somehow I think speaking out against PEDOPHILES is exactly what Jesus would have done.


16 posted on 03/22/2010 6:50:15 AM PDT by Gamecock (We aren't sinners because we sin, we sin because we are sinners. (R.C. Sproul))
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To: Gamecock
So do you endorse the behavior of Priests?

That’s the way it seems when you attack the messenger and not the horrible damage done by Roman Catholic Priests over the decades.

Do you find yourself in a false dilemma often?

That's the way it seems when that oddity is offered as rebuttal to a comment about one-trick ponies.

17 posted on 03/22/2010 7:02:18 AM PDT by Lorica
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To: trisham
Here’s a thread worth reading:

Read it already - wonderful story!

18 posted on 03/22/2010 7:03:56 AM PDT by Lorica
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To: livius

I believe it truly shows that Satan is terrified of the Catholic Church.


19 posted on 03/22/2010 7:05:23 AM PDT by tiki (True Christians will not deliberately slander or misrepresent others or their beliefs)
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To: trisham
Does the truth hurt that much?

You're probably just like most freepers - an excellent multi-tasker. :)

20 posted on 03/22/2010 7:08:32 AM PDT by Lorica
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To: Gamecock

Yeah, but on FR speaking out against Protestant pedophiles will get you banned.


21 posted on 03/22/2010 7:11:01 AM PDT by tiki (True Christians will not deliberately slander or misrepresent others or their beliefs)
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To: Lorica

I do my best. :)


22 posted on 03/22/2010 7:12:57 AM PDT by trisham (Zen is not easy. It takes effort to attain nothingness. And then what do you have? Bupkis.)
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To: trisham
I do my best. :)

Don't be modest! You really CAN call your congressman and lurk on the religion forum at the same time! Not everyone can do that, ya know...

23 posted on 03/22/2010 7:14:50 AM PDT by Lorica
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To: tiki
Who has been banned doing that?

The HUGE difference is I speak out against anyone who harms children.

FRoman Catholics circle the wagons if anyone dares say anything that is less than complementary about Rome. Want proof? Just visit this thread.

24 posted on 03/22/2010 7:16:12 AM PDT by Gamecock (We aren't sinners because we sin, we sin because we are sinners. (R.C. Sproul))
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To: Lorica

I live in Massachusetts. Our congress critters have us on “ignore”.


25 posted on 03/22/2010 7:17:24 AM PDT by trisham (Zen is not easy. It takes effort to attain nothingness. And then what do you have? Bupkis.)
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To: tiki

I think the abuse of children by Roman Catholic clerics, and the defense of the Rome on this issue, shows that Satan has taken over the Roman Catholic church.


26 posted on 03/22/2010 7:17:53 AM PDT by Gamecock (We aren't sinners because we sin, we sin because we are sinners. (R.C. Sproul))
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To: Gamecock

You have a personal agenda and don’t pretend that it is something else.

You are a Catholic basher and we all know it.

Don’t be so high and mighty thinking that you are doing the Lord’s work. The people on this forum are not stupid.


27 posted on 03/22/2010 7:18:17 AM PDT by kidd (Obama: The triumph of hope over evidence)
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To: livius

“One thing that really surprised and depressed me when I started to read FR was to learn how much Protestants hate Catholics.”

I have had the exact same experience and reaction.

Much of it is beyond “debate” and “discussion” and has become an agenda.


28 posted on 03/22/2010 7:18:48 AM PDT by Running On Empty ((The three sorriest words: "It's too late"))
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To: trisham

Ouch.


29 posted on 03/22/2010 7:18:53 AM PDT by Lorica
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To: Lorica

It’s frustrating.


30 posted on 03/22/2010 7:21:00 AM PDT by trisham (Zen is not easy. It takes effort to attain nothingness. And then what do you have? Bupkis.)
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To: kidd

You beat me to it by seconds :-)


31 posted on 03/22/2010 7:21:58 AM PDT by Running On Empty ((The three sorriest words: "It's too late"))
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To: Gamecock

When have you spoken out about Protestants who DAILY harm children? I’ve never seen one article that you’ve posted.

There is an adage...Pot calling the kettle black.

I actually think some people just post anti-Catholic stuff because they crave attention for themselves and to get people to talk to them any way they can...but that is just my opinion.


32 posted on 03/22/2010 7:23:32 AM PDT by tiki (True Christians will not deliberately slander or misrepresent others or their beliefs)
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To: Running On Empty; livius

Let us hope that it is just a vocal few, although I confess that at times the sheer volume seems to indicate otherwise.


33 posted on 03/22/2010 7:24:14 AM PDT by trisham (Zen is not easy. It takes effort to attain nothingness. And then what do you have? Bupkis.)
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To: kidd

Why is it FERCs would be thrilled to never hear about the scandal in their church. Any posting of the abuse of Children by Roman Catholics priests and the cover up is Roman Catholic bashing.

It seems to me if you spent your time demanding this problem be fixed, once and for all, we “Catholic bashers” wouldn’t have anything negative to say.

Blaming your institutional problems on Protestants doesn’t fix a thing.


34 posted on 03/22/2010 7:26:49 AM PDT by Gamecock (We aren't sinners because we sin, we sin because we are sinners. (R.C. Sproul))
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To: Running On Empty

***Much of it is beyond “debate” and “discussion” and has become an agenda.***

Defending children from abuse is a good agenda.

Your church should try it some time.


35 posted on 03/22/2010 7:28:11 AM PDT by Gamecock (We aren't sinners because we sin, we sin because we are sinners. (R.C. Sproul))
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To: Gamecock
The HUGE difference is I speak out against anyone who harms children.

A Google search of freerepublic. com of "by Gamecock" comes up with 676 entries.

A Google search of freerepublic.com of "by Gamecock" AND "NAMBLA" comes up with ZERO entries.

You are a hypocrite

36 posted on 03/22/2010 7:28:42 AM PDT by kidd (Obama: The triumph of hope over evidence)
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To: Gamecock

What about the Rabbi in Brooklyn who is accused of abusing children a few weeks ago. I didn’t see your speaking out on that occasion. Few if any take you thoughts seriously but they are good for some laughs.


37 posted on 03/22/2010 7:30:57 AM PDT by bronx2
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To: Running On Empty; livius
“One thing that really surprised and depressed me when I started to read FR was to learn how much Protestants hate Catholics.”

I have had the exact same experience and reaction.

Much of it is beyond “debate” and “discussion” and has become an agenda.

To be fair, it's a relatively small number of posters, but the ones who are really anti-Catholic hold little or nothing back. In doing so, they offer nothing useful or productive - only vitriol and hatred for the Church.

The anti-Catholics (both the Christian and the Secular ones) are all too happy to throw any and all of the bishops, right up to the Pope, under the bus before actually finding out whether or not there is any guilt to be had.

It is Alinsky's tactic at its finest - and those who choose to use it make themselves the devil's willing assistants.

38 posted on 03/22/2010 7:31:31 AM PDT by GCC Catholic (0bama, what are you hiding? Just show us the birth certificate...)
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To: livius
One thing that really surprised and depressed me when I started to read FR was to learn how much Protestants hate Catholics.

Same here.

I suppose the main element of surprise comes from the fact that we don't harbor these feelings toward Protestants. Certainly, growing up, the attitude was "They're decent people, certainly fellow Christians, though they have a few things wrong with their theology." There was definitely a sense that we're all in together, viz., the effort of living out the Gospel in our own lives, and bringing it to others.

Generally speaking, when the masses get into hysterics about something, it's a good sign they're wrong. Global warming Climate change, for example. Turning off that noise and assessing the situation calmly and rationally is the cure for this. The same is true for these trumped-up scandals. Having to go back 20, 30, 40 years to dig up cases ought to raise a red flag. In most of those cases, the accused is long dead and so cannot defend himself. But all that business about the right of the accused to face his accuser is just for whiny civil libertarians, I suppose. Suspending statutes of limitations, which are in place because memories fade and evidence disappears over time, is fair game, but only if Catholics are targeted. In New Hampshire, they tried to introduce legislation to force priests to break the seal of the confessional, first amendment rights be damned.

If the bishops had insisted that each and every one of these accusations be subject to the standards of a court of law, almost none of the claimants would have a case. In fact, the John Jay study shows a significant drop-off in accusations (not all of which are likely to be true) after the mid 1980's. But the mission of the Church extends beyond civil justice to moral justice, and if an internal investigation suggested a case had merit, the bishops settled them instead of spending the money on court fees and attorney fees. It's the honorable thing to do, but the Church will not be given credit for that. The pay-outs do not come from the tax payers, nor from the personal wealth of the clergy, which is minimal, but from parish funds, which means, ultimately, from the parishioners and their ancestors who donated the money to establish their parishes. Their reward is bankrupt dioceses and closed churches.

Now, you might think that on a conservative site, dedicated to Constitutional restoration, our separated brethren would have enough presence of mind to see that Catholics' rights are jeopardized by these actions. You'd think that they'd realize that if our rights are in danger, so might theirs be in the days to come. You'd think they'd notice the timing of these media events, and realize that they are staged to discredit the Catholic Church, which has been most vocal in its defense of the unborn, of traditional marriage, of the integrity of the family, and of subsidiarity (essentially states' rights in the US). You'd think they'd realize that destroying all these things is the agenda of the Leftists here in the US and in the EU, and that if the Church is weakened the Left is strengthened. You'd think they'd understand that jumping on this politicized bandwagon is injurious to their own cause.

You'd think that, but if you did, apparently you would be wrong. The irrational hatred for the Church on the part of certain people on FR trumps everything else. It's sick, and it's sad, and it's not going to stop.

As our republic continues to degenerate into socialism and fascism, we can either stop slinging mud at each other and join forces against the decline, or we can sit back and watch it fail.

39 posted on 03/22/2010 7:31:33 AM PDT by cantabile
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To: tiki

For starters, I am not here everyday.

When I post a thread I don’t go digging into archives. It is on the front page. Hence this thread.

When I see a thread on FR on Protestant abuse on FR I chime in, and I certainly don’t blame Catholics for the problem.


40 posted on 03/22/2010 7:32:13 AM PDT by Gamecock (We aren't sinners because we sin, we sin because we are sinners. (R.C. Sproul))
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To: bronx2

I obviously didn’t see that.


41 posted on 03/22/2010 7:33:14 AM PDT by Gamecock (We aren't sinners because we sin, we sin because we are sinners. (R.C. Sproul))
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To: cantabile
As our republic continues to degenerate into socialism and fascism, we can either stop slinging mud at each other and join forces against the decline, or we can sit back and watch it fail.

***********************

Exactly right.

42 posted on 03/22/2010 7:33:53 AM PDT by trisham (Zen is not easy. It takes effort to attain nothingness. And then what do you have? Bupkis.)
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To: Gamecock
Blaming your institutional problems on Protestants doesn’t fix a thing.

A Google search of freerepublic. com of "by Gamecock" comes up with 676 entries.

A Google search of freerepublic.com of "by Gamecock" AND "Catholic" comes up with 363 entries.

54% of all articles you've posted are anti-catholic.

Don't pretend you're something else.

43 posted on 03/22/2010 7:34:23 AM PDT by kidd (Obama: The triumph of hope over evidence)
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To: GCC Catholic
To be fair, it's a relatively small number of posters, but the ones who are really anti-Catholic hold little or nothing back. In doing so, they offer nothing useful or productive - only vitriol and hatred for the Church.

Agreed. And I think this handful of posters has managed not only to alienate Catholics, but some of their more thoughtful, less vitriolic non-Catholic brethren.

44 posted on 03/22/2010 7:35:44 AM PDT by Lorica
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To: Gamecock; livius
livius - ***One thing that really surprised and depressed me when I started to read FR was to learn how much Protestants hate Catholics.***

Catholics have to get in line. The Protestants hate Mormons, Atheists, Jews, etc. etc. I think it is an inferiority complex.

45 posted on 03/22/2010 7:35:57 AM PDT by LeGrande (The government wants to make a new Government program (Health Care) to fix Medicare and Medicaid.)
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To: kidd

As one of FR resident secularists, it’s a shame you see me as the enemy.

I’m not.

Oh, and come Easter, my 18 y/o daughter will be in full communion with the Catholic church. Her choice, with full support from her secularist dad (who will certainly be in attendance for the event).


46 posted on 03/22/2010 7:38:35 AM PDT by dmz
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To: dmz
Oh, and come Easter, my 18 y/o daughter will be in full communion with the Catholic church. Her choice, with full support from her secularist dad (who will certainly be in attendance for the event).

God bless her! And God bless you too. :)

47 posted on 03/22/2010 7:39:36 AM PDT by Lorica
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To: cantabile
I suppose the main element of surprise comes from the fact that we don't harbor these feelings toward Protestants. Certainly, growing up, the attitude was "They're decent people, certainly fellow Christians, though they have a few things wrong with their theology." There was definitely a sense that we're all in together, viz., the effort of living out the Gospel in our own lives, and bringing it to others.

Don't take it the wrong way... there are lots of Protestants here who don't harbor anti-Catholic feelings. And there are a few Catholics who can be over-the-top too (and at times, admittedly, that has been me).

You'd think that, but if you did, apparently you would be wrong. The irrational hatred for the Church on the part of certain people on FR trumps everything else. It's sick, and it's sad, and it's not going to stop.

Bingo. It's irrational, and at times, maybe even diabolical (certainly that's the case for some anti-Catholics in the world at large). But the key is learning to pick battles wisely, and knowing when to let the other person's words stand on their own - when they've gone off the reservation entirely, the other FReepers and lurkers can generally tell.

Welcome to FR, by the way.

48 posted on 03/22/2010 7:40:07 AM PDT by GCC Catholic (0bama, what are you hiding? Just show us the birth certificate...)
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To: livius

While some Protestants may hate Catholics, not all do. This is an issue that crosses the different denominations of Christianity.

Within the Protestant community there are roughly as many paedofiles as in the RCC (Roman Catholic Church - just a standard abreviation, no lessening or insult intended). However, having pointed out the parity in numbers, there is another problem that the RCC has that isn’t shared by Protestants and that is the Bishops. For most Protestant ministers there is no worldly authority above them and the sin is with them alone. In the RCC where a Bishop is aware of the problem with a priest then the Bishop will share in sin if he does nothing to stop it. The Bishop commits other sins when he covers it up (essentially conspiracy).

For too long the Bishops hid things and denied justice to the victims. Also it appears that quite often the Bishops worked together to hide things. The extremes of this conspiracy is what makes it stand out so much more than similar situations in other churches. To many it seems the Pope[s] have been aware for a very long time and chose to do nothing, which brings the whole church into question. This is just too big for any decent person to ignore and titillating enough to ensure that people pay attention.

Now let’s be fair. This problem isn’t limited to the RCC. It is a cancer inflicting itself upon all of Christianity [however, I do believe it is worse in the RCC]. The teachings of the RCC absolutely condemn such behaviour. The design of Pope - Cardinal - Bishop - Priest (yes I skipped a few) does not cause this behaviour, and should actually help keep it from occurring.

What can be done to keep this from happening? I honestly don’t know. This type of sickness is in the individuals. Only by making the RCC a place that won’t work for their desires we might have success. However, please remember that there is probably a significant number of Bishops that have this problem as well and how to deal with them is another problem all together.

I truly believe the unmarried clergy has given freaks a respectable place to hide among decent young men who seek to do God’s work. Perhaps this should be reviewed as this is a choice of the RCC. Eastern Catholics and Orthodox have a married clergy, but unmarried Bishops (and the unmarried Bishops are a source of embarrassment for these faiths, but a needed step to avoid nepotism)

The seminaries need to be cleaned out. The priesthood is for those that wish to be married to the church (or see paragraph above). Sexual deviancy should have immediate dismissal.

The parishes need to be cleaned out (although I do believe this is already being done). No mistresses, gay lovers or children.

Bishops need to be held accountable. If they faced jail time instead of recall to Rome, they might think about their actions ahead of time.

Please feel free to add to this list, especially those of the RCC as you suffer most when your church commits evil.


49 posted on 03/22/2010 7:45:11 AM PDT by JosephW (Mohammad Lied, People die!)
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To: dmz

Please see my original post.

My problem is with “liberal secularists” (I was quite careful to include the word liberal). What you do with your own life is your own business. The kind of relationship that you want to have with God is between you and God.

When some liberal tries to force secularism on my children then I have issues.

No sir, I do not see conservative secularists as any kind of enemy because I know you respect individual rights. And I respect it right back. We will be allies against liberals, but we won’t discuss religion.


50 posted on 03/22/2010 7:46:07 AM PDT by kidd (Obama: The triumph of hope over evidence)
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