Posted on 05/30/2010 2:09:35 PM PDT by Salvation
A-ffirm!
A mystery is something that is unknown or unexplained. The Trinity is not a mystery. A “wonder”, perhaps. But not a mystery.
That's right!
In Genesis, when God cast Adam and Eve from the Garden or questioned them about why they hid and delivered His judgement on them, it would seem He would do it face to face.
Christodelphians have issues with the Trinity. So does Church of God Abrahamic Faith.
Study to show thyself approved. :)
But does the “I am” comment refer to him being God or just a part of God’s plan??
Now God is defined in the OT as the Great I Am. So is it “
Before Abraham was born, God.
Something to ponder....
But when you see me, you see my father. His influence, his personality, his ways...... Did Jesus mean this literally or metaphorically???
I believe Genesis 3 is parable and that every person that lived is in the position of Adam and Eve. Keep in mind that the DOD were not challenged by a cherubim waiving a flaming sword to and fro in Iraq. That's because the Cherubim represents the physics of this world, which prevent men from "living forever" by their own hand.
"But when you see me, you see my father. His influence, his personality, his ways...... Did Jesus mean this literally or metaphorically???
Literally. Jesus is the person who is God.
The Garden was destroyed in the Flood.
The flood is also a parable. Placing an angelic being in charge to guard a magical fruit tree in a place to be destroyed later is an exersize that indicates arbitrary planning, contradictory purpose and limited foresight. Had it rained for 40 days and 40 nights, the average temp of the Earth would have been -40 degrees. Also, Mie scattering, the process that causes the rainbow is a physical process that depends on the fundamental physics of this world and was present from the beginning, ~13.8b yrs. ago.
This thread is about the Trinity. Note that Jesus is the creator and ponder the following scripture which indicates that everything God said used parable.
Matt 13:34-35, "Jesus spoke all these things to the crowd in parables; he did not say anything to them without using a parable. So was fulfilled what was spoken through the prophet:
"I will open my mouth in parables,
I will utter things hidden since the creation of the world."[Psalm 78:2]"
We'll have to disagree on that.
The disagreement is with science and Matt 13:34,35.
I don't have a problem disagreeing with 'science'. AGW for example. As for the Matthew verses, Jesus did speak in parables. I believe God's Word in the telling of the creation. I don't see where that was referred to as a parable.
Jesus is God. The crowds are men that hear the word of God, which, was spoke then written. Matt 34,35 is exclusive, there are no exceptions. With that, the passage is equivalent to:
Matt 13:34-35, "God spoke all these things to men in parables; he did not say anything to them without using a parable. So was fulfilled what was spoken through the prophet: "I will open my mouth in parables, I will utter things hidden since the creation of the world."[Psalm 78:2]"
"I don't have a problem disagreeing with 'science'. AGW for example."
GW involves exaggerations about temperature and energy changes that are less then 0.3%. Mie scattering is something that is inherent in the physics of this world which contradicts the plain language account given in Gen for the birth and existence of the rainbow. As I said, the average temp of the world must have been -40 at the end of 40 days of rain. There is no way to get around these facts.
As the Creator of the world and all its physical laws, of course it is possible to get around those ‘facts’. At any rate, I enjoyed the conversation with you despite our disagreements.
If that's so, then the physics of this world is arbitrary and acts according to statements equivalent to, A ≠ A, and God's own logic fails, by containing contradictions. In particular, Matt 13:34,35 absolutely contradicts plain readings of the Genesis stories of the Garden and the Flood.
Does your reason give you insight into the unsearchable counsels of God? Job 38.
Questions are asked in Job 38. They can be and have been answered and are certainly not unsearchable. Reason is what it is, and no limitations placed on reason.
I'll assume you refer to some of the questions God asked Job, and not the unknown counsel of God. For man has a hard enough time examining himself than to believe he can comprehend all the workings and thought of the Almighty.
For instance:
4 "Where were you when I laid the earth's foundation? Tell me, if you understand. 5 Who marked off its dimensions? Surely you know! Who stretched a measuring line across it? 6 On what were its footings set, or who laid its cornerstone-
Good question here, I know the answer to the first part. I wasn't there and God spoke it into existence. How, no clue nor does any man since none were there at the time either. All we have is God's account through Moses.
Or:
19 "What is the way to the abode of light? And where does darkness reside? 20 Can you take them to their places? Do you know the paths to their dwellings? The third question in this series; can you? No, yet God halted the setting of the sun for the Israelites to do battle. Josh 10:13. Reason has its limits and its place is suppressed when faced by questions only God knows the answer to.
By the way, I found this nugget:
Job 42
1 Then Job replied to the LORD :
2 "I know that you can do all things; no plan of yours can be thwarted.
3 You asked, 'Who is this that obscures my counsel without knowledge?'
Surely I spoke of things I did not understand, things too wonderful for me to know.
4 "You said, 'Listen now, and I will speak; I will question you, and you shall answer me.'
5 My ears had heard of you
but now my eyes have seen you.
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