I for one perform evangelism to many whom need salvation. Read the following verses carefully :
Mark 7:20-23; Matthew 7:17
John 6:44; Matthew 6:65; Mark 4:10-13; Matthew 11:27
John 10:11, 10:26; Matthew 25:32
Matthew 4:19-20, 9:9
John 6:38-40, 10:27-28
The last one is also known as Once Saved Always Saved. ONCE SAVED - ALWAYS SAVED. It is IMPOSSIBLE for believers like me to lose my salvation - no man, Pope, Priest, no one can Anathema me - that notion is false doctrine of demons.
If Unconditional Election is true why did Jesus say “”Go into all the world and preach the good news to all creation.” (Mark 16:15)? I they are already predestined to be elected, what difference does it make whether we go or not? Why preach the Gospel? They will be saved regardless. No one who is not saved will be saved if they are not foreordained as the elect.
BTW: I’m not Catholic.
interesting concept. “limited atonement” . Is that like a little pregnant? http://antinomianism-salvation.blogspot.com/
If you seek it, you can't find it.
If you find it, you can't get it.
If you get it, you can't lose it.
If you lose it, you never had it.
Sorry, but it makes about as much sense as Obama's economic policies....
Both Calvinists and Armenians use the scripture to prove their positions and have good points. Personally, I think they are both true, it is our small minds that say it is one or the other. Maybe that’s the easy way out.
“T=Total Depravity
Mark 7:20-23; Matthew 7:17 “
Hmmm...
“20And he said, “What comes out of a person is what defiles him. 21For from within, out of the heart of man, come evil thoughts, sexual immorality, theft, murder, adultery, 22coveting, wickedness, deceit, sensuality, envy, slander, pride, foolishness. 23 All these evil things come from within, and they defile a person.”
“17So, every healthy tree bears good fruit, but the diseased tree bears bad fruit. “
OK, neither passage shows total depravity. Total depravity postulates that man is so evil that God must select him for salvation, cause him to be born again, give him the Holy Spirit, and only THEN can a man repent. It claims man cannot believe unless God gives the faith to him, although saving faith is never described as a gift in the scripture.
Those verses don’t in any way show total depravity. In fact, Jesus said, “Those who are well have no need of a physician, but those who are sick.” Sick, not dead. Jesus also described us as blind and lost, not dead and unable to repent - which may be why Mark starts with, “Jesus came into Galilee, proclaiming the gospel of God, 15and saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel.”
Would you like me to continue with the rest?
I appreciate what you say, bibletruth, and I’m as hard core a Calvinist as you will find. But... is this kind of hitting people over the head with the doctrines of grace?
“And as many as had been appointed to eternal life believed.” Acts 13:48
“...just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love, having predestined us to adoption as sons by Jesus Christ to Himself according to the good pleasure of His will.” Eph. 3:4,5
“And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand.”
John 10:28,29
**these are all in your Old Testament Scriptures (Matthew, Mark, Luke, John).**
Old Testament Scripture?
Even I know better than that. LOL!
Salvation is an ongoing process throughout our lives. It is a life-long struggle...
As this verse, mentioned earlier, tells us:
“Work out your salvation with fear and trembling.” Phil 2:12.
Even St. Paul admitted that he could lose his salvation:
“...but I chastise my body and bring it into subjection, lest perhaps after preaching to others I myself should be rejected.”
1Cor 9:27
Then there is Rom 11:22, “See, then, the goodness and the severity of GOD: His severity towards those who have fallen, but the goodness of GOD towards you if you abide in His goodness; otherwise you also will be cut off.”
“...but he who has persevered to the end will be saved.” Matt 10:22, 24:13
Notice that these verses do not say that we are saved but that we will be saved...future tense. What does “persevered” mean? Why should anyone have to worry about perseverance if they are already saved?
Sorry but you are not believing the right stuff. No one taught what you believe up until Calvin showed up.
Enough of the man-centered, theological back-slapping already!
Put me down for three and a half points please....
The Gospels aren’t in any Old Testament I’ve ever read.
Mt 7:1-6.
Well, get out the ‘white out’ and look through the gospels, and the epistles (you remember, those letters written to souls that were ALREADY born again), and blot out the little word ‘if’ where it happens to kill the tulips like 2-4-D herbicide.
I don't want to be labeled Calvinist or Arminian. Rather, I want to be biblical through and through and give every text its due proportion, no matter where it falls.I think I agree with that more than anything else I read on the issue.
Please don’t use John 10 to support limited atonement. That is NOT what the context is saying.
I Timothy 2
1 I urge, then, first of all, that petitions, prayers, intercession and thanksgiving be made for all people— 2 for kings and all those in authority, that we may live peaceful and quiet lives in all godliness and holiness. 3 This is good, and pleases God our Savior, 4 who wants all people to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth. 5 For there is one God and one mediator between God and mankind, the man Christ Jesus, 6 who gave himself as a ransom for all people. This has now been witnessed to at the proper time. 7 And for this purpose I was appointed a herald and an apostle—I am telling the truth, I am not lying—and a true and faithful teacher of the Gentiles.
Who should we believe, you, or Jesus, who said, "Your faith has saved you."
Go away. Please.
And how can one read the Bible and not see that our salvation through Christ Jesus is eternal (Perseverance of the Saints).
But as far as the doctrine of Limited Atonement is concerned, I'll just leave you with this -
"But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man." (Hebrews 2:9)
What a weird way to spend your time. Don’t you have ceiling fan blades to clean, or something?
“[Calvinism] is not merely the hope of true religion in the world: it is true religion in the world — as far as true religion is in the world at all.” — B.B. Warfield