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Couple suing Southern Baptist Convention
wcyb.com ^ | 24 October 2011 | Nash

Posted on 10/24/2011 5:28:01 AM PDT by Cronos

A Metro Nashville Council member is suing the Southern Baptist Convention for $1.5 million.

Ron Nollner and his wife, Beverly, filed the lawsuit against the nation's largest Protestant denomination and related entities last week.

The lawsuit states the two went to New Delhi as missionaries in 2009 and were hired by the Virginia-based International Mission Board of the Southern Baptist Convention to oversee construction of an office building there.

However, the lawsuit claims they were fired after Ron Nollner complained about illegal and unsafe building practices at the job site and said the project's architect and builder were paying bribes to get approvals for completion.

A spokeswoman for the International Mission Board said the board hasn't received a copy of the complaint, but believes in treating all personnel with integrity.


TOPICS: Current Events; Evangelical Christian
KEYWORDS: baptist; egotists4god; eyeplanks; nutburgers; pharisees; southernbaptist
We really are a sue-happy nation...
1 posted on 10/24/2011 5:28:12 AM PDT by Cronos
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To: Cronos
the project's architect and builder were paying bribes to get approvals for completion.

Uhhhh....

Well....

Hmmmmm

Since that is standard operating procedure for 99% of the world, someone should have explained it to him. I would have started by quoting Proverbs 17:8 "A bribe is a charm to the one who gives it; wherever he turns, he succeeds."

2 posted on 10/24/2011 5:35:18 AM PDT by Anitius Severinus Boethius
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius

I was going to say it is too early to tell either way, but yeah, unfortunetly this is just business in most places of the world.


3 posted on 10/24/2011 5:39:25 AM PDT by nerdwithagun (I'd rather go gun to gun then knife to knife.)
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius

Maybe they are mad that they didn’t get a cut.


4 posted on 10/24/2011 5:39:34 AM PDT by riverrunner
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To: Cronos

So he went to New Delhi and was surprised to see unsafe building practices?

Really?


5 posted on 10/24/2011 5:45:40 AM PDT by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: Former Fetus; Bockscar; Graybeard58; JLLH; Outlaw Woman; StarCMC; AZ .44 MAG; prairiebreeze; ...

Baptist ping


6 posted on 10/24/2011 5:46:26 AM PDT by WKB (Anything Obama: "What a revoltin' development this is")
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius

I see....and you believe this is an endorsement of the practice?

Proverbs 17:8 “A bribe is a charm to the one who gives it; wherever he turns, he succeeds.”


7 posted on 10/24/2011 5:46:49 AM PDT by G Larry (I dream of a day when a man is judged by the content of his character)
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To: driftdiver; WKB; Outlaw Woman

and he sues the entire Baptist convention HERE in the States. Doesn’t make any sense...


8 posted on 10/24/2011 5:53:55 AM PDT by Cronos (http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2787101/posts?page=58#58)
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius
I would have started by quoting Proverbs 17:8 "A bribe is a charm to the one who gives it; wherever he turns, he succeeds."

The Bible elsewhere condemns bribery. I would take this as an observation, not a prescription.

9 posted on 10/24/2011 5:55:13 AM PDT by Lee N. Field ("And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to promise" Gal 3:29)
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To: G Larry

No, I believe it’s a statement of fact. Another statement of fact is that most cultures do not see bribes as corruption (I believe they are, but I’m referring to how other cultures view them). They believe it is perfectly acceptable for you to have to bribe an official to get permits and the like through the system.

These things should have been explained to the couple before they headed over there.

Many of the Missionaries I know refer to bribes as “unexpected taxes”, since a tax it is.


10 posted on 10/24/2011 6:00:11 AM PDT by Anitius Severinus Boethius
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius

I believe their complaint was that the bribes served to official overlook UNSAFE BUILDING PRACTICES!!

Much different than simple greasing the skids!


11 posted on 10/24/2011 6:05:04 AM PDT by G Larry (I dream of a day when a man is judged by the content of his character)
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius

Amen.


12 posted on 10/24/2011 6:05:04 AM PDT by Tainan (Cogito, ergo conservatus sum)
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To: Lee N. Field
Paul covered the topic of whether Christians had to adapt to the world around them to some extent in order to serve God effectively.

1 Cor. 9: " 19 Though I am free and belong to no one, I have made myself a slave to everyone, to win as many as possible. 20 To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law. 21 To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God’s law but am under Christ’s law), so as to win those not having the law. 22 To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some. 23 I do all this for the sake of the gospel, that I may share in its blessings."

Does anyone seriously contend Paul didn't run across his share of corruption in the notoriously corrupt Roman Empire? If I remember correctly, there were at least two occasions where jailers tried to stick him up for a bribe.

So did he immediately launch into an anti-corruption campaign to clean up the Empire, which would have been really tough as the Emperors during this period (Claudius and Nero) were the most corrupt of all, or did he work within the (corrupt) system so as to be able to keep working for Christ?

13 posted on 10/24/2011 6:05:26 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: Cronos

http://www.tennessean.com/article/20111022/NEWS/310210093/Former-Nashville-councilman-hits-Baptists-with-lawsuit


14 posted on 10/24/2011 6:43:00 AM PDT by tutstar
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To: G Larry

I would support them 100% about the unsafe building practices. That is something that should be addressed if there was sloppy oversight on that.


15 posted on 10/24/2011 6:43:29 AM PDT by Anitius Severinus Boethius
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius

There’s a lesson here. Don’t be a pest when you’re only a guest. Telling folks they’re engaging in bribery (what they call “gratuities”) doesn’t work well. The fellow was a missionary not a cop.


16 posted on 10/24/2011 6:46:58 AM PDT by count-your-change (You don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: Lee N. Field

Must be the translation, KJV has it as “A gift...” Bit different.


17 posted on 10/24/2011 6:50:35 AM PDT by ican'tbelieveit (Washington,DC is FULL of people with Political Experience... How's that Working out for you??)
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To: count-your-change
"(what they call “gratuities”)"

Exactly. Most places you can refuse to pay such gratuities and you will still get the permits and other required paperwork, eventually. If you don't have several years to wait or don't want to have to repeatedly file amended paperwork as the powers that be find technicalities to delay you with, then you pay a gratuity to someone to oversee your paperwork and ensure that the small problems that arise are handled right away and that all the paperwork is in order. Your choice.

Besides, if I'm not mistaken, they do have police and others who are in charge of investigating such accusations of unsafe practices, he could have filed a complaint with them and if he was really concerned that someone might be injured or killed due to the illegal practices, he could have paid someone a gratuity to make sure his complaint was handled as quickly as possible and that all of his associated paperwork was in order.

Basically, the guy's a dolt. If he wasn't smart enough to fight fire with fire he shouldn't have been there in the first place. Thailand is far worse than I've heard India is and you can have someone out to investigate an unsafe working condition or unsafe building practice the day after you file a complaint if someone who knows their system takes a personal interest in making sure it moves quickly through the system. Naturally, you'd want to show your appreciation to someone who is so conscientious and who is every bit as interested as safety as you are.

JMHO

18 posted on 10/24/2011 7:17:15 AM PDT by Rashputin (Obama stark, raving, mad, and even his security people know it.)
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To: Rashputin
I've had people from Kenya, El Salvador, Mexico, Nigeria tell me the same thing. Low paid government officials expect a gift to perform their services, oft times because they too have to drop a few coins, not as a bribe but as a courtesy, a tip.
19 posted on 10/24/2011 7:30:30 AM PDT by count-your-change (You don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: count-your-change

I believe their complaint was that the bribes served to official overlook UNSAFE BUILDING PRACTICES!!

Much different than simple greasing the skids!


20 posted on 10/24/2011 9:46:29 AM PDT by G Larry (I dream of a day when a man is judged by the content of his character)
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To: G Larry

That’s what he says but just what were those practices is another question. Not everyone follows the U.S. building codes or OSHA regs.


21 posted on 10/24/2011 10:07:28 AM PDT by count-your-change (You don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: Cronos

Not everyone is cut out for dealing with foreign cultures. I’m sure I’d have difficulty, myself. In my opinion (assuming the fact of the complaint are accurate), the mission board, as the employer, could reasonably reimburse the people for their expenses incurred. One would expect them to have a procedure already in place for missionary placements that don’t work out.


22 posted on 10/24/2011 10:18:38 AM PDT by Tax-chick (Sensible, logical, responsible and practical. I also walk dogs.)
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To: count-your-change
Why would you defend the Indian construction company and bribed officials?

Do you really believe the missionaries were going through an OSHA checklist and there were no blatant safety issues?
(Intuitively obvious to even the most casual observer...)

23 posted on 10/24/2011 10:24:53 AM PDT by G Larry (I dream of a day when a man is judged by the content of his character)
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To: G Larry

I’m not defending anyone. You’re getting your knickers in a knot over the claims in an yet as untried lawsuit. If you have some inside information please do share it, otherwise it’s just a lawsuit.


24 posted on 10/24/2011 10:53:42 AM PDT by count-your-change (You don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: WKB

“...the project’s architect and builder were paying bribes to get approvals for completion.”

It’s in New Delhi...

Hellooooo...


25 posted on 10/24/2011 11:52:07 PM PDT by dixiechick2000 (Proud barbarian TEA Party SOB)
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To: Cronos; All

1 Corinthians 6:1–8

6 When one of you has a grievance against another, does he dare go to law before the unrighteous instead of the saints? 2 Or do you not know that the saints will judge the world? And if the world is to be judged by you, are you incompetent to try trivial cases? 3 Do you not know that we are to judge angels? How much more, then, matters pertaining to this life! 4 So if you have such cases, why do you lay them before those who have no standing in the church? 5 I say this to your shame. Can it be that there is no one among you wise enough to settle a dispute between the brothers, 6 but brother goes to law against brother, and that before unbelievers? 7 To have lawsuits at all with one another is already a defeat for you. Why not rather suffer wrong? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 But you yourselves wrong and defraud—even your own brothers!


26 posted on 10/25/2011 6:17:48 PM PDT by uptoolate (For the record: I have complete assurance that nothing can pluck me from His hand)
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