Posted on 11/29/2011 4:33:50 AM PST by jacknhoo
To certain Catholics, Peter Kreeft is a rock star.
That was evident Nov. 18, when nearly 500 people filled an auditorium at the Bishop O'Connor Center in Madison to hear him talk.
Kreeft, a Catholic author and Boston College philosophy professor, had been asked by the Catholic Diocese of Madison to speak on whether "a Catholic can be a liberal." Kreeft called it "a very challenging question" and said he'd never spoken on it before.
Kreeft is a strong defender of the Catholic Church against what some people call "modernists" or, more derisively, "cafeteria Catholics," people who pick and choose which church teachings to follow.
There is no middle ground to Kreeft. It would be silly and redundant to him, for instance, to call someone a "pro-life Catholic." You cannot be anything but against abortion to be a Catholic, Kreeft said.
"To be a Catholic is to take the whole deal," he told the crowd.
Kreeft said several definitions of a liberal can and should fit Catholics, including "someone who is generous and unselfish" and "someone who highly values liberty and freedom."
On abortion, Kreeft contended Catholics are the "true liberals," because a liberal wants to extend liberty to the oppressed, and "the unborn are the most oppressed," he said.
Yet, in the political realm, the term liberal has been hijacked by abortion rights activists, Kreeft said. "A Catholic cannot be today what is called a liberal about abortion. That's obvious. That's a ‘duh.'"
Kreeft mentioned other issues, such as homosexual marriage and euthanasia, that he said Catholics cannot take politically liberal positions on, yet he focused most on abortion. Coming in for the most criticism were elected officials who call themselves Catholic yet support abortion rights.
During the Q&A, an audience member brought up the Kennedy political dynasty and how a group of leading theologians and Catholic college professors had met with Kennedy family members in the mid-1960s and came up with a way for Catholic politicians to support a pro-abortion rights platform with clear consciences.
Kreeft said these Catholic advisers "told the Kennedys how they could get away with murder." Kreeft then made one of his boldest comments of the evening, suggesting the theologians who first convinced Democratic politicians they could support abortion rights and remain Catholic did more damage to the Catholic Church than pedophile priests.
"These were wicked people. These were dishonest people. These were people who, frankly, loved power more than they loved God," Kreeft said. "Sorry, that's just the way it is. In fact, I'd say these were even worse than the child molesters — though the immediate damage they did was not as obvious — because they did it deliberately, it wasn't a sin of weakness. Sins of power are worse than sins of weakness. Cold, calculating sins — that's straight from the devil."
A few minutes later, the talk over, the crowd gave him a standing ovation.
People have been crossing borders “illegally” since there were orders to cross. For instance, in the Proclamation of 1763, the King forbade Colonists to occupy the Indian lands west of the Appalachians. They went ahead and did so. Instances could be multiplied. So far as universal health care is concerned, this goal is quite legitimate in itself. Only the means are in dispute. Thirdly, so you think labor unions are evil in themselves? Are the kind that supports the ultra kind who supports the most rapacious sort of capitalism, including the sweat shops of China?
Congratulations on saying really dumb things really loudly then.
No political position taken by the USCCB on an issue like immigration is ever binding in conscience on the Catholic faithful. It's a matter of prudential judgement.
But more to the point, is your ultimate loyalty to Jesus Christ, or to your country? Are you capable of admitting that your country may, at some point, be diametrically opposed to God, to his Christ, to his Kingdom, and to the Gospel?
Someone who doesn't believe that the Catholic Church is founded by Christ for the salvation of the world should not be a Catholic under any circumstances. Someone who does believe that, but remains outside the Church because they think it endorses policies which will "destroy his nation" condemns his soul to eternal hellfire. It's really as simple as that.
A nation can be made into an idol just like anything else, Alex. When your nation starts telling you that its survival necessitates dehumanizing Catholics (or Jews, or anyone else), herding them into concentration camps, and killing them ... to what will your "devotion" be then?
In 1937, Pius XI told the Catholics of Germany:
Whoever exalts race, or the people, or the State, or a particular form of State, or the depositories of power, or any other fundamental value of the human community - however necessary and honorable be their function in worldly things - whoever raises these notions above their standard value and divinizes them to an idolatrous level, distorts and perverts an order of the world planned and created by God; he is far from the true faith in God and from the concept of life which that faith upholds. -- Mit Brennender Sorge, March 14, 1937
[In 1933] The Vatican was so appreciative of being recognized as a full partner that it asked God to bless the Reich. On a more practical level, it ordered German bishops to swear allegiance to the National Socialist regime. The new oath concluded with these significant words: "In the performance of my spiritual office and in my solicitude for the welfare and the interest of the German Reich, I will endeaver to avoid all detrimental acts which might endanger it."
from the thread The Catholic Church and Nazi Germany: an exhaustive survey of John Toland's biography of Hitler
Cracks me up how it never actually answered any of your direct questions. Great points, Campion.
so a grown man buggering a little boy is just a “sin of weakness.” Got it.
Reading is a skill. Get it.
Go on back to sleep...sorry to have awakened you from your coma.
I wonder, why did you leave the Episcopal Church, Alex, and what religion or denomination or sect or cult are you a member of now?
Why spend time wondering? Posts by Alex Murphy
I have no interest in reading all of your comments on this site and attempting to deduce the answer, Alex. Apparently, you don’t want to answer the question...that’s fine.
so what is your point about the pro-choice state legislators? We should get rid of them all? And replace them with whom?
you cannot replace these legislators who vote with the pro-family agenda because
1. there is no such pro-life person in the district who is in a position to run successfully and serve in the office. Only make believe people that exist in your head. You would have to come up with a real name.
2. There are no pro-life activists to raise money and do the campaign work. There are not enough pro-life donors.
3. There is no pro-life media to get the message out and very few pro-life voters.
Other than that, no problem. That is why if pro-family people in liberal states have legislators that vote with us even if they are not nominally pro-life ... they try to keep them in office so that they are not replaced by progressive leftists.
If the best possible person living in the district is already the state rep, and you replaced him, you would obviously get somebody worse.
More Americans “Pro-Life” Than “Pro-Choice” for First Time (first time since 1995)
http://www.gallup.com/poll/118399/more-americans-pro-life-than-pro-choice-first-time.aspx
i guess if you convince 100,000 pro-lifers to move from GA to CT ... you would be correct.
There are very few “pro-life voters” in Conn. or throughout the northeast. And there are 5 times as many radical activists.
So how ‘bout we send 100,000 radicals down to GA and you send 100,000 pro-lifers up here?
Pro-life voters are people who consistently show up and vote for pro-life candidates. Consistently show up! Less than 2% of the population in CT. You need 50% to have a majority.
Less than 40% of American adults voted last NOV. So there are more non-voters than voters.
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