Posted on 02/05/2012 2:58:27 PM PST by marshmallow
But Jesus didn't die outside of time. He died here, on this planet IN time.
He died (past tense) once for all and is now seated at the right hand of the Father. IN heaven Jesus is not being continually sacrificed but is seated at the Father's right hand waiting for His enemies to be made His footstool and HE is intercedeing for us in the meantime.
But Jesus didn't die outside of time. He died here, on this planet IN time.
He died (past tense) once for all and is now seated at the right hand of the Father. In heaven Jesus is not being continually sacrificed but is seated at the Father's right hand waiting for His enemies to be made His footstool and HE is intercedeing for us in the meantime.
It's His death and resurrection which gives us life, not his ongoing continual sacrifice (dying) that gives us life.
If He was continually dying, then He didn't defeat death by rising fromt he grave, but He did rise and conquer death so there's no more need for a sacrifice.
Why?
Who are you taht you seem to think that people need to answer you?
What are your credentials for being able to make that determination and if you so decide that someone has indeed fallen into error*, just why do you need to kno? What are you going to do or can you do about it?
Seriously? You need the Catholic Church to tell you that Paul the Apostle wrote the Bible book Romans?
Paul, a servant of Christ Jesus, called to be an apostle and set apart for the gospel of God— the gospel he promised beforehand through his prophets in the Holy Scriptures regarding his Son, who as to his earthly life was a descendant of David, and who through the Spirit of holiness was appointed the Son of God in power by his resurrection from the dead: Jesus Christ our Lord. Through him we received grace and apostleship to call all the Gentiles to the obedience that comes from faith for his name’s sake. And you also are among those Gentiles who are called to belong to Jesus Christ. To all in Rome who are loved by God and called to be his holy people: Grace and peace to you from God our Father and from the Lord Jesus Christ. (Romans 1:1-7)
How about Ephesians?
Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by the will of God, To God’s holy people in Ephesus, the faithful in Christ Jesus: Grace and peace to you from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. (Ephesians 1:1-2)
How about Galatians?
Paul, an apostle—sent not from men nor by a man, but by Jesus Christ and God the Father, who raised him from the dead— and all the brothers and sisters with me, To the churches in Galatia (Galatians 1:1-2)
How about, oh, First and Second Corinthians?
Paul, called to be an apostle of Christ Jesus by the will of God, and our brother Sosthenes, To the church of God in Corinth, to those sanctified in Christ Jesus and called to be his holy people, together with all those everywhere who call on the name of our Lord Jesus Christ—their Lord and ours: Grace and peace to you from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. (I Cor. 1:1-3)
Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by the will of God, and Timothy our brother, To the church of God in Corinth, together with all his holy people throughout Achaia: Grace and peace to you from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. (II Cor. 1:1-2)
Or Philemon?
Paul, a prisoner of Christ Jesus, and Timothy our brother, To Philemon our dear friend and fellow worker— also to Apphia our sister and Archippus our fellow soldier—and to the church that meets in your home: Grace and peace to you from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. (Philemon 1:1-3)
In fact, EVERY one of the New Testament books identify the author right there in the beginning of the book (with the exception of Hebrews). You don't need your church to tell you what God already told you. The Bible we have is the Bible HE made sure we have and it is every bit as authoritative, reliable, trustworthy and inerrant as the Old Testament assurance that the Jews had. They knew they had a miraculous gift from God and so can we. STILL!
Amen. Too much Scriptural logic for many RCs to comprehend.
THe problem with people who don't take this literally is that they cannot seem to understand WHAT Christ is doing, AT THIS TIME, AFTER His Ascension and BEFORE His return. He is forming a body of believers, who are spiritually seated in heavenly places IN HIM. He is sending believers as ambassadors for Him, preaching the reconciliation of God and man through His finished work. WHY would He be doing this during this time in heaven?
"That in the AGES TO COME he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus." Eph. 2:7.
Those who are saved during His physical absence on this earth are saved purely by faith. There is nothing we can see, feel, taste, smell, or hear that confirms our salvation. It is the Holy Spirit confirming with our spirit that we are children of God.
In the Ages to Come there will be a group of people who will be the ones God shews the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us. Because we believed and accepted the finished work of Christ for our salvation. Faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. We do not need to SEE in order to believe. The Church the Body of Christ is built and sustained purely by grace through faith. And God will shew us, the Church the Body of Christ as His kindness and His faithfulness, and His Grace to mankind.
How anyone could set this aside in favor of works of righteousness that can NEVER be attained during this age of the grace of God and His reaching out to us to be reconciled to us PURELY on the finished work of His Son, is beyond my mind to grasp.
His Time is not ours if you believe Jesus is God.You have a God that is moved if you believe Jesus is God.
But,than again you never said Jesus is God like some of the people you join with against Catholicism, yet some of them who believe Jesus is God believe just as Catholic do. Where does that leave you or them?
Post the autograph from Saint Paul that closes the case outside of Catholic tradition? It does not exist.
You would be laughed out of any court in the world if you presented the writings of Scripture as authentic.
You believe them based on faith. I believe them based on faith too and have no problem to admit this because I have faith
You have a God that is moved according to your time and God is not moved according to Scripture
Mal.3:6 " I the Lord do not change.
What happens in God's time is not in our concept of time. It's all one even only accessible as one event in the Eucharist and unconditional love by those who don't reject His Church
Good Night!
Too much Scriptural logic for many RCs to comprehend.
We comprehend that our time is not His time and everything is one event with Him or He would be moved to adjust to our time.
BY using our concept of time, Moses , Abraham etc ... would not be covered by Christ's Sacrifice for all mankind. Thus leaving the Trinity and Divinity of God in question.
Try wrapping your mind around this?
I'm done posting tonight and have much work in the morning.
I wish you a Blessed evening
Then you believe that God is continually dying in heaven?
What kind of bizarro world beliefs does the Catholic church hold to?
Well catholics generally do call anyone who disagrees with their teachings heretics....and has done so since their inception under Constantine. So no I wouldn't be insulted either...it's their out when they've been pushed back in a corner and can't defend what has no defense.
Yeah that’s why I wear her calling me a heretic as a badge of honor .
Sure. Because they do not believe Christ paid the full penalty for our sins. He must be offered over and over for every sin committed in the RCC. That’s why He’s never taken off the cross. It’s a visual reminder to them of His suffering, daily, and for an eternity.
It's not responsive to the question. Unless you believe the visible church disappeared after Acts. It’s a continuation of the NT church.
Where, when, who, what? Other than you, anything?
LOL! I'd say it's looooong past your bedtime.
Catholics *get* that. What you're not getting is it is also a connection to others - real people, a continuous connection from the Apostles 'til today. And you?
It’s not “a church of one”
No it's not, that's my point that you seem to have a problem with.
all true believers throughout history..
Yet, you cannot name a single one in history? Out of the billions you claim belong to *your* church. Not one?
Just you, no history, no real people. Just you. A church of one.
Prove me wrong.
Every question that I've seen you ask Lera, has been answered by her clearly from Holy Scripture, so what exact "errors" is your Catholic Faith requiring you to point out? That she refuses to accept the authority of the Roman Catholic Church above that of Holy Scripture? I take that stand right beside her!
Let me see if I get this clearly, you will only accept the original writings from Paul's own hand to which he autographs it as "authentic"??? No, YOU would be laughed out of a court of believers of the first century. They at least accepted what was personally sent to them by Apostles or their close disciples and did not question their authenticity because not only did they KNOW the authors, they KNEW IN THEIR HEARTS that they were receiving the truth from God. It spoke to their spirit, as from God.
What you seem to earnestly want us to believe, that it was "Catholic" tradition that made them authentic, cannot be based upon the facts. When the believers in Ephesus were hand delivered their letter from the Apostle Paul, for example, they had NO problem with its credibility, nor did they have reason to doubt its authenticity. The reason we don't have that "original" today should be obvious for a number of reasons, least of which is the false worship as a "holy relic" something like that would have received. God knew what he was doing.
Do I believe those Scriptures by faith? Of course, just as I do the fact that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, that he died, was buried and rose again for our sins, and that he will come again in glory. Where we differ, I think, is you base your faith on your Church, who tells you what you should believe. I prefer the more direct way.
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