Posted on 11/10/2012 7:59:09 AM PST by Colofornian
MessageToEagle.com - Normally, as a matter of personal preference I don’t get into politics, but when we have a presidential campaign that begins to cross over into the strange twilight zone of religious weirdness that centers on the one person who’s going to control the most powerful government and army on the face of the earth, well, it brings up some unusual scenarios to wonder about.
It is being reported in the media today that former presidential candidate Mitt Romney only wrote a victory speech for Election Day; presumably a harried, last minute scramble to revise his speech was being suggested as the reason behind the Romney-Ryan campaigns’ sluggish reluctance to concede their party’s unthinkable defeat.
Electoral Votes:
Barack Obama: 303 Mitt Romney: 206
Curiously, one has to wonder whether it was Romney’s obsession with polls and tracking data that lead to this overextension of hubris; his unshakable faith that he would be the next president of the United States—or could it have been Romney’s Mormon faith itself that lead him to believe victory was all but assured by some divine mandate?
Ascending to the office of the presidency has always been a coveted part of the mission of the Mormon Church, which began with its founder Joseph Smith, who as a young man experienced a close encounter with a being from another planet named Moroni, who descended from the heavens and instructed Smith to found a new religion (as seen on History Channel’s Ancient Aliens, S3E01)—today, in Ufology, such a happenstance would likely be classified as a contactee CE5 level event.
“I saw a pillar of light . . . which descended gradually until it fell upon me” – Joseph Smith.
In 1844 Joseph Smith, an apparent UFO contactee and the founder of the Mormon Church, brazenly launched his own political campaign for President of the United States. His stated goal was to overthrow the U.S. Constitution, and bring about a Mormon theocracy to the Nation.
Smith’s candidacy was always long shot, but that didn’t stop him from rallying his people to help clinch his destiny to be an independent commander in chief of the “army of God”.
Smith prophesied that if the U.S. Congress did not bow to his demands that “they shall be broken up as a government and God shall damn them.” He foresaw the emergence of “the one Mighty and Strong”—a leader who would “set in order the house of God”.
Smith’s call for a “theodemocracy where God and his people hold the power to conduct the affairs of men in righteous matters” evidently did not sit well with the majority of voters in the United States, and brought down a lot of bad press and hostility upon the Mormons. Smith’s presidential campaign was cut short while he was sitting in jail facing charges of treason and inciting a riot; an angry mob broke into the jailhouse and brought him to justice by shooting him to death.
Out of this early chapter of U.S. history developed what has became known in the Mormon Church as the “White Horse Prophecy”—a controversial prediction that someday a great Mormon leader, who, at a time when the U.S. Constitution “hangs like a thread as fine as a silk fiber”, would be elected President.
I know a little bit about Mormonism and their beliefs. I grew up and lived in Salt Lake City most all my life, I sat through many days of LDS seminary at public schools, and I also attended a private Mormon school as a teenager.
My family has roots in the Mormon pioneer heritage and early history. My ancestors, the Neff’s, came to the Salt Lake Valley in 1847, from Lancaster County, Pennsylvania. My great-great-great-grandfather John Neff, Sr. settled Neff’s canyon in East Millcreek, Utah. He was also a close friend of Brigham Young and accompanied him into Northern Utah to proselyte amongst the Native Americans there. His daughter, Mary Ann Neff, married the notorious Mormon gunslinger and Utah folkhero Orrin Porter Rockwell.
Orrin Porter Rockwell was one scary-looking son of a bitch . . .
Rockwell served as a loyal henchman to Church founders Joseph Smith Jr. and Brigham Young—and was affectionately nick-named ‘Ol’ Port’ the ‘Destroying Angel of Mormondom’.
In his despicable and sordid history, Ol’ Port was intimately connected to political assassinations, revenge-killings, and gruesome Indian massacres. He’s praised for having avenged the Prophet Joseph Smith’s murder by shooting one of the conspirators with his musket while riding astride a horse.
There have been a few failed attempts in various movies and books to elevate the psychopath to the status of a gritty American hero of the old west —fortunately, none of them have really stuck.
A few of the many curious tenants of Mormonism I heard growing up in Salt Lake City were as follows . . .
*Cain, the killer of his brother Abel, is alive and wanders the earth, wearing no clothing but being covered by hair, and that LDS Church apostle David W. Patten encountered him once; and that reported sightings of Bigfoot can be explained by this story.
*Blacks were neutral in the War in Heaven, and that is why they were not allowed to hold the Mormon priesthood before 1978.
*Albert Einstein supposedly once said that LDS Church apostle James E. Talmage was the smartest man he had ever met.
*The Second Coming was imminent, and when I was age 25 I would be living in the “Last Days” (I’m in my 40’s now).
And here’s where Mitt Romney’s presidential candidacy enters the picture—
I remember my 7th grade LDS seminary teacher sermonizing about the “signs” of the ‘Last Days’.
One of his favorite ‘signs’ that he liked to talk about was that a great Mormon leader would be elected President of the United States, and this would be a major indication that the Last Days were imminent, e.g. the White Horse Prophecy.
Some say that the White Horse Prophecy was written by Joseph Smith himself, while others dispute that claim. According to the Salt Lake City Tribune:
The disputed prophecy was recorded in a diary entry of a Mormon who had heard the tale from two men who were with Joseph Smith in Nauvoo, Ill. when he supposedly declared the prophecy. “You will see the Constitution of the United States almost destroyed,” the diary entry quotes Smith as saying. “It will hang like a thread as fine as a silk fiber.”
Not only will the Mormons save the Constitution, under the prediction, but the prophecy goes further, insinuating that Mormons will control the government.
“Power will be given to the White Horse to rebuke the nations afar off, and you obey it, for the laws go forth from Zion,” the prophecy says.
Publicly, the Mormon Church doesn’t officially endorse the ‘White Horse Prophecy’ as doctrine, and will deny anything to do with it (just as Romney has whenever it’s been brought up)—however, there’s a telling piece of Mormon dogma that people may find disturbing. It was set in place by Joseph Smith himself, and is referred to as “lying for the Lord.”
As an act of self preservation or to protect the Mormon Church, it is doctrinally permissive to lie about your beliefs or intentions. In other words the ends justify the means. Smith did it with regard to his polygamous lifestyle. Brigham Young did it when he claimed that only Paiute Indians were responsible for the Mountain Meadows Massacre.
Over and over again, Mitt Romney marginalized his devout Mormon background, and downplayed its significance throughout his entire campaign. But in the 1970’s the ‘Cougar Club’ at Brigham Young University declared their admiration of Mitt and predicted that he’d be the president of the United States one day. According to an article on Salon.com:
…the Cougar Club — the all male, all white social club at Brigham Young University in Salt Lake City (blacks were excluded from full membership in the Mormon church until 1978) — was humming with talk that its president, Mitt Romney, would become the first Mormon president of the United States. “If not Mitt, then who?” was the ubiquitous slogan within the elite organization. The pious world of BYU was expected to spawn the man who would lead the Mormons into the White House and fulfill the prophecies of the church’s founder, Joseph Smith Jr., which Romney has avidly sought to realize.
With all this in mind, it’s hard not to look back and wonder . . .
Could Mitt Romney have been intending to run the United States as a Mormon theocratic state, as fortold by his Church’s prophet Joseph Smith?
Would a President Romney have executed the will of the people of the United States, and answered to the people—or would he only answer to God via the hierarchy of the Mormon Church?
What if a “revelation” or “vision” was received by the current President of the LDS Church (or Prophet), and passed on to ‘President Romney’ as a directive from God?–would Romney have executed that directive, even if it had gone against the will of the U.S. people, or the World?
Thankfully, this is probably one mystery we’ll never know the answer to . . .
Written by Dustin Naef - MessageToEagle.com Contributor
About the author: Dustin Naef has been a student of ancient mysteries and the paranormal for as long as he can remember. He has worked in screenwriting, graphic design and illustration, produced and designed video best-selling games, and is currently involved in the production of a film documentary and book about the mysteries surrounding Mount Shasta, California.
If you wish to follow Dustin Naef: Dustin's website: http://www.dustinnaef.com Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/dustinnaef.mountshasta https://www.facebook.com/MountShastaFilm
Ummm, you got anything from RNMOM?
Those links you posted are to other FReepers, not RNmom as you disingenuous implied that they were since she is the one being discussed.
Courtesy ping to those whose comments you posted but didn’t courtesy ping.
El Placemarco
Firstly, do read a little before constantly jumping to (erroneous) conclusions
Thirdly, as Dave has pointed out to you on this thread, do mind your courtesy and stop accusing people falsely.
Proverbs 21:28 A false witness will perish, but a careful listener will testify successfully.
Note that I didn't make those statements and I oppose the usage of such terms in a discussion -- it shuts out any discussion.
One can say they disagree with Rev. Graham without calling him a "pawn for the dark side", right? the latter statement shuts out a discussion
Agree with that.
Graham does one thing and one thing only preaches the Good News, that’s how he started and that’s how he will end.
I believe that God is faithful and no matter where we are, what we have been taught or not taught, he WILL reveal the truth to us if we sincerely seek to know it.
My rhetorical question was about those people who HAVE discovered that Mormonism could not be defended intellectually or logically - people like Mitt Romney - those whose livelihood is being "apologists" against those who point out its unmistakable errors and lies. What is their reason for staying, for continuing to lead others into it including their own families? Surely, they MUST know, right?! I get it that the majority never feel the urge to investigate it deeper and it is that spiritual blindness that keeps them roped in as well as the community that surrounds them and the threat of hell and ostracizing should they ever think of leaving. It is much the same for other false religions (i.e.; Islam, Jehovah's Witnesses). All I can guess is that too much is at stake to lose should a man like Romney decide to leave. It tells me that some things are more important to people than their eternal life, than knowing the true God, than being willing to forsake all for the love of Christ.
God bless you and the ministry you have to reach others for Him.
I get it that the majority never feel the urge to investigate it deeper and it is that spiritual blindness that keeps them roped in as well as the community that surrounds them and the threat of hell and ostracizing should they ever think of leaving...It tells me that some things are more important to people than their eternal life, than knowing the true God, than being willing to forsake all for the love of Christ.
- - - - - -
BINGO! LDS who ask hard questions are given pat answers, they are not encouraged to research or investigate or think for themselves, actually they are DISCOURAGED from doing that. If they have an issue, they are told to just ‘put it on the shelf’ - to ignore it.
For many the fear of ‘outer darkness’ (the LDS don’t have an eternal Hell) for apostates does keep them in, I’m helping a gentleman who is going through that now. He knows Mormonism is false but is afraid of losing his family and ‘outer darkness’.
For some who KNOW the truth, yet stay anyway, there are a couple of attitudes I see often. First, they grew up with the view that if Mormonism isn’t true, nothing is so it doesn’t matter if they play the part to keep their family happy. Similarly, there is an attitude among some that well, Mormonism is just as good as any other church, so I might as well enjoy the benefits and all my friends are here. For a few, the fear of their spouses divorcing them (which is common for LDS leadership to recommend to the faitful spouse if the other spouse becomes apostate) makes them stay.
Mormonism is very much a ‘good ol boys club’ and for people like Romney, a means of power in this world. I fully expect Romney to be called to be a General Authority which means more money and built in audience for his books. Romney is an egomaniac and egomaniacs thrive in Mormonism.
For those who have left Mormonism and become born again through Christ, they don’t stay very long - they can’t. They cannot sit and listen to the blasphemies spouted from the pulpit and unbiblical doctrines. A few stay for a brief period in hopes of getting their LDS family to follow them out, but soon discover that is more likely to happen when they leave.
When Shawn McCraney (HOTM.TV) first started his show in Utah (great show I recommend it), he said he didn’t care if you stayed LDS as long as you were truly born again. He has since changed his mind, because he saw his own family leave after he stopped playing the part and saw how the LDS shunned him when he was trying to be ‘active’ LDS but preaching the real biblical gospel and salvation by grace.
The attitude of those who stay, knowing that it is all a lie (like the apologists who get paid very well by the LDS church) and frankly of most LDS faithful is they put the LDS CHURCH first, not God, not Christ. It is heartbreaking.
Thank you, brother, for your kind words. This isn’t a fun ministry, it is real spiritual warfare and it is necessary. I would love nothing more than the LDS to be like the Worldwide Church of God, and repent, but there is a lot of earthly benefits of staying LDS and they have their reward in this life. Our reward is in the life to come.
By the definition you provided, you thereby proved that Rnmom’s comment was NOT a tirade.
Good job.
I take sacraments at our Episcopal Church in town.
The Nicaean creed is said before Holy Supper here - I meditate and think of my own confession for that time. I will be putting up my formal confession as a lay minister as a Facebook note that I will link on my profile page soon. It's not online - only in our Liturgy so I will have to type it out. I'd also like to request to post to Catholic Caucus threads. I consider all Catholics my brethren no matter how we worship externally.
I believe we are created in the Lord's image. The heavens were bent at the Lord's advent. His soul Divine and the Father, his body from Mary and human. He put off his human nature to be glorified as Divine Human. Our regeneration is the same process, described in Genesis from Abraham to Joseph and His brothers. We believe clouds represent the literal sense of the Word. 'Person' takes away from Divine and has led to the blasphemy that Jesus is wholly natural and not Divine. We do not discard any word of the Old Testament.
I like to invite you to Church. I found this service very moving on Veterans Day and after the election. I think Catholics will find it very familiar:"You Have Saved Us", Rev. Jeremy F. Simons - 11/11/2012 Adult Service (Holy Supper)
What erroneous conclusions?
You provided three links in post 881 and I checked and double checked all three and not one of them was RNmom's.
In post 879, Elsie asked about comments of RNmom's that you were complaining about in post 865 that she had allegedly made about Billy Graham.
You porvided three links in post 881 in response to Elsie's post 879 request and not a one of them was attributed to RNmom.
Therefore, my conclusions was not erroneous.
If someone requests specific information, it would be nice if that information was forthcoming instead of red herrings trying to get off topic and then throwing it off on someone else accusing them of being wrong.
Holier than thou much?
Speaking about false witness, there remains unanswered the requests for specific comments alleged to have been made by Rnmom against Rev. Graham.
Could you provide evidence of said comments or admit that you have borne false witness against her?
Catholic by blood?
So like A, B, AB, O and Catholic?
The real questions is how do you dishonor Catholicism by partaking in their religious ceremonies, when you have spent days and pages telling us all, that all paths lead to God.....sorry Catholics do not teach that.
Have you told your Catholic family you beleive nothing of what they teach and consider mormonISM superior and most like your all paths lead to God stuff.
Seek help.
Yeah; words like that do have an effect all right.
I agree, you need help.
Genesis 5:3
When Adam had lived 130 years, he had a son in his own likeness, in his own image; and he named him Seth.
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