Survey shows Catholic priests don’t like Mass changes

RNS ^ | May 21, 2013 | David Gibson

[NYer]

(RNS) Nothing upsets the folks in the pews as much as changing the liturgy that they’re accustomed to, and that seemed likely to be the case when the Vatican ordered revisions to the familiar prayers and rubrics of the Catholic Mass.

But now, more than a year after the changes took effect in U.S. parishes, a survey of American priests shows that they are more disturbed by the innovations than their flocks.

Congregants pray during Catholic mass at St. Therese Little Flower parish in Kansas City, Mo. on Sunday, May 20, 2012. RNS photo by Sally Morrow

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In fact, the poll, conducted by researchers at St. John’s University School of Theology-Seminary in Collegeville, Minn., showed that almost 60 percent of priests surveyed did not like the new Roman Missal, as the liturgical book for the Mass is known, while about 40 percent approve.

“The high level of dissatisfaction among priests should be a grave concern for the bishops, assuming they care about what their priests are thinking and feeling,” the Rev. Michael Ryan, a Seattle priest who started a petition to rally opposition to the new translation, told the popular liturgy blog Pray Tell.

The clergy critics also have firm opinions on the matter: one-third of priests (34 percent) strongly disagree that the new translation of the Mass is an improvement, and 80 percent say that some of the language is “awkward and distracting.”

That contrasts with polls from last year, which showed that 70 percent of Mass-goers thought that, overall, the first new translation in 40 years “is a good thing.” The approval rating was 84 percent among weekly attenders. (Polls also showed that most Catholics didn’t notice many changes.)

An online survey in February by The Tablet, a London-based Catholic periodical, found opinions among English-speaking Catholics around the world to be sharply divided about the new Mass, with clergy expressing more negative opinions than lay people.

The new translation, which went into effect in the nearly 18,000 parishes in the U.S. in November 2011, was years in the making but took longer than expected when the process was taken over by Vatican-backed conservatives who wanted to make the language sound more like literal translations of the original Latin.

That resulted in formulations that supporters said were more authentic and expressed a grandeur and mystery appropriate for the sacred rites. Critics said the new phrasings were stilted and often incomprehensible.

For example, where the Nicene Creed once explained Jesus’ relationship to God as “one in Being with the Father,” the new version has believers say Jesus is “consubstantial” with God – prompting comedian Stephen Colbert, a practicing Catholic, to quip: “It’s the creed! It’s not the SAT prep.”

Pope Francis issued a powerful call for the protection of the environment and of society’s most vulnerable during his formal installation Mass at the Vatican, while qualifying his papal power as a “service” to the church and to humanity. RNS photo by Andrea Sabbadini

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This image available for Web and print publication. For questions, contact Sally Morrow.

In the previous version, worshippers preparing to receive the Communion host would confess, “I am not worthy to receive you.” Now they say, “I am not worthy that you should enter under my roof.”

One reason that priests may take a dimmer view of the new translation is that they have to use it every day, and have many more parts to say than lay people. They were also paying closer attention to the translation process, which may explain why many of them said they were just as upset with the way the revision was undertaken and implemented as they were with the end result.

More than six in 10 of the priests surveyed said they wanted a revision of the revisions, and they are not the only ones. “While we don’t want to ‘throw the baby out with the bathwater,’ the new missal needs corrective surgery and this should take place without delay,” Bishop Robert Brom of San Diego told Pray Tell.

Whether anything will happen is unclear. The new pope, Francis, appears to prefer simpler liturgical practices, but it’s also not clear that he would want to reopen this can of worms. And senior church officials in charge of liturgical matters either declined to respond to questions from Pray Tell – which is run by a priest who worked on the survey – or questioned the value of the survey.

More than 1,500 priests from around the country responded to the survey, which was conducted from February to May 2013.

[Salvation]

But, but, but the people (me included) love the new translations that are truer to the Latin.

May the Lord, open the hearts of these complaining priests and allow them to hear the beauty of the words!

[Jeff Chandler]

I learned the latin mass as an altar boy in 5th grade...two years later, after 2000 years or so, they changed it to english...

I had the same experience but with me it was about two weeks later.

[stanne]

I focused on the emasculinization of the Mass as only a girl like myself is allowed to in this time of PC.

I meant to say pretty much what Cicero stated so eloquently in post 9.

The rant is a bit held over from a response to the presentation we had at Mass last wknd from the Archbishop who is now, for the moment, off the subject of telling us the USCCB gave a ton of our donated? money to the cause of the illegal aliens here, and that the latino community is the future of the Church (but they need our money, though they have the buildings our ancestors (and theirs) built?, and is now onto the subject of plans for the future.

One aspect they want us to focus on ? ok is bringing some of the 750,000 Catholics in the Archd to Mass as there are only 150,000 attending.

I think it comes from the Holy Father, bless him.

Not sure.

They can start with getting back to the language of the Church - Latin. It’s a dead language, so no misinterpretation can easily occur. Fr. Groeschel says the enemy hates hearing it.

[gorush]

"The first Christians in Rome were Greek-speakers...they probably had the same complaint when the Church switched from Greek to Latin."

True. The gospels were in Greek with a few Aramaic quotes included to dispel some translation ambiguities that occurred in some of the all-Greek translations from Aramaic.

There is a book "Did Jesus Exist" by Bart D. Ehrman that discusses the actual documents and copies that exist to prove his contention that he did exist. Of course...but it's an interesting book nonetheless.

[Verginius Rufus]

I think Ehrman is an agnostic but tries to deal with the material in a fairminded way, not in service of an ideological outlook. There were two Loeb volumes of the Apostolic Fathers which were published in the early 20th century--recently he did a revised edition of the two volumes.

One of the notable scholars in this field died very recently--Geza Vermes, who started out Jewish in Hungary, converted to Catholicism when his family did when he was about 6, became a Catholic priest, then re-converted to Judaism.

[diamond6]

I REALLY miss the old “Gloria” at the beginning of the mass. Oftentime when singing it, I would become very emotional, it is just such a beautiful prayer.

[ebb tide]

“To which VCII document are you referring?”

Make that “documents” (plural).

[Heart-Rest]

One thing I've noticed (especially at the Daily Mass) is that many of the older "regulars" still tend to say certain parts of the Mass the older way. They generally use the new "cheat sheet" cards for longer parts, like the "Penitential Act", and for special days when they have to say the "Gloria" and the "Nicene Creed", but many do not seem to use those cards for the shorter parts of the Mass, and many of them often get those parts wrong.

For example, during the "Sanctus", many still say "Holy, Holy, Holy Lord God of power and might" instead of "Holy, Holy, Holy Lord God of hosts". Many of the older regulars also tend to clobber the various replies to "The Mystery of Faith" with older versions blended with the newer ones.

I've even heard some of our older priests say those same revised sections of the Mass the old way a number of times also. (Then again, one older priest here sometimes still says "...for Benedict our Pope...".)

I used to know the "Gloria" and the "Nicene Creed", but I'm still trying to memorize the newer translations of them. (Maybe I shouldn't bother trying, if they're just going to change them again in the near future.)

[vladimir998]

“Congregants pray during Catholic mass at St. Therese Little Flower parish in Kansas City, Mo. on Sunday, May 20, 2012.”

What a strange choice of parish for a photo about the new translation. Their early Mass is a gospel Mass and their later Mass is an Anglican Use Mass. Not exactly your typical American parish. The pastor is a married former Episcopalian priest.

[vladimir998]

Bart Ehrman? I don’t agree with the following author’s own personal views on Christianity, but I know he’s right about Ehrman on a number of points: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1468145606/ref=ox_sc_act_title_4?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

[informavoracious]

Maybe I’m oversimplifying, but it occurred to me that the new translation, being truer to the Latin, was formulated partly as a lure to bring those pesky SSPXers back into the regularized fold. See, the NO is just like the TLM! Whether the Society did wrong by not accepting BXVI’s invitation remains to be seen. Pope Francis’ leanings wrt the Latin Mass are not yet apparent, though I understand in his previous post he was not a fan of tradition.

[Biggirl]

The problem with me is that, I never knew what was the Latin words, growing up under the shadows of VC II. Well if I have to get use to the changes, so do the priests.

[Biggirl]

But remember, in the catacombs, the early Christians were often portrayed being shown with their hands rasied in prayer.

As I have said in a previous post, I grew up under the shadows of VC II and not knowing anything of Latin. From time to time, the parish choir I sing in, does a hymm in the Latin, mostly during the special liturgical seasons of the Church year.

[A.A. Cunningham]

many of the congregants holding up their hands and arms, presumably for the Our Father, in a way that was never authorized but almost universally practiced.

Only the improperly catechized engage in the orans position and its practice is far from universal.

At the Lord’s Prayer, the priest stands with arms outstretched in a gesture of supplication, the orans or “praying” position, on behalf of the people. The deacon, whose posture is governed by the liturgical rubrics, is instructed to stand with hands folded together in the same manner as the congregation. The faithful fold their hands, in a traditional posture of petitioning, to signify the humility of our congregation before God. Other gestures, such as extending arms or holding hands, are not found in the norms of the Mass. That our gestures are different does not mean that one role is more important than another—rather it points to a diversity of parts to the body of Christ.

[Biggirl]

A starter explaination:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orans

[Biggirl]

Also does say about the early Christians in prayer with raised arms.

http://www.arsmar.com/ce_art.htm

[Biggirl]

Could that be one bishop’s opinion?

My view is to leave the folks alone, in order to keep the peace.

[Biggirl]

It could be because Pope Francis wants to focus on working to “rebuild” Jesus’s Church, just as Jesus called his namestake to do the same.

[Cicero]

Yes, they imitate the Priest, which they are not supposed to do. But the problem is that all too often the priest never tells them in a kindly way to stop doing it, so they don’t generally know any better.

And I’ve also been in a couple of parishes where the priest INSTRUCTED everyone to hold hands during the Our Father. I haven’t heard that from the pulpit in recent years, but it was common earlier, and no one is telling the congregation to stop doing it.

This wouldn’t be happening now if so many priests, bishops, deacons, and nuns hadn’t allowed or encouraged it over the years.

It’s still the Catholic Church, and the sacraments are still valid in almost all the parishes, but it’s really a shame, and it’s a primary reason why the pews are so often empty.

There are, of course, wonderful exceptions, and those churches are generally full. Our Lady of Victories Church down near Wall Street was one, and it was a real pleasure to go to Mass there, or to confession.

[SuziQ]

The clergy critics also have firm opinions on the matter: one-third of priests (34 percent) strongly disagree that the new translation of the Mass is an improvement, and 80 percent say that some of the language is “awkward and distracting.”

I'm thinking the numbers would have been similar 50 years ago when the English version was implemented, over the Latin, and again, 30 years or so ago, when the 'New' English translation was introduced.

It is a little awkward for folks who knew the old prayers by heart, like the priest, and regular Mass goers. I still have to use the cheat card, because I haven't memorized the new form, yet.